Toyota; Total recall?

cyclonebri1

Pew_Pew_Pew_Lasers! wrote: »

The engine can be stopped on the move, it's really very simple. I wouldn't expect most drivers to bother reading something so unimportant as the driver's manual, though.

There's something flawed tho' if it takes a read of the manual to find out how to stop a car in an emergency. There's also something fundamentaly wrong if 2 manufacturers decide that under emergency shut of conditions, 1 car has to have the stop held down for a count of 1 to 4, and another decides it's a better idea for mutiple hitting of the stop to bring about a shutdown????

This should be standard on any car with push start/stop, read the manual before you change from 1 car to the next, not going to happen is it?

What Toyota appear to be guilty of is not providing an obvious and effective method of shuting down the car in a fault condition??

Pew_Pew_Pew_Lasers!

What, you mean aside from pushing the brake pedal hard (which will overpower the engine easily), or taking it out of gear, or holding the start/stop button? Or even just plowing it into the central reservation and slowing it that way?

Those are all very obvious methods.

Its a complicated piece of machinery, the driver's manual is included for a reason. People need to take some personal responsibility.

cyclonebri1

Pew_Pew_Pew_Lasers! wrote: »

What, you mean aside from pushing the brake pedal hard (which will overpower the engine easily), or taking it out of gear, or holding the start/stop button? Or even just plowing it into the central reservation and slowing it that way?

Those are all very obvious methods.

Its a complicated piece of machinery, the driver's manual is included for a reason. People need to take some personal responsibility.

Do you honestly think they didn't try pressing the brake pedal, we obviously don't really know, but Toyota have admitted that they got it wrong. I'm sure there will be more to come on this story, and it isn't just an American thing, abeit their "no one told me I couldn't take a nap in the back with the cruise control on" attitude does count for something.

And as I was trying to point oit put you don't seem to want to accept, holding the button down for over 3 seconds is not a natural reaction, and in my none Toyota wouldn't stop the car.

I cannot imagine a single car owner let alone a Toyota owner, trawling the owners manual for "How to stop the car if the computer takes over":rotfl:

Pew_Pew_Pew_Lasers!

They obviously didn't press the pedal hard enough. In every car I have ever driven, the brake easily overpowers the engine.

I'm betting they lightly pushed the brake pedal, instead of stamping hard down on it. The brakes then overheated, and became useless. Instead of letting go of the pedal for 20 seconds to allow the brakes to cool, they continued to press it, keeping it roasting hot and useless.

Your point about "natural reactions" is stupid. It is the responsibility of a driver to educate themselves on exactly how their vehicle is operated. If they don't do so, I have no sympathy for them. All of the deaths/accidents I have read about in these cars were entirely preventable. One only has to look at the history of the Audi 5000 in the US to understand that Americans are, generally, poor drivers.

cyclonebri1

Pew_Pew_Pew_Lasers! wrote: »

They obviously didn't press the pedal hard enough. In every car I have ever driven, the brake easily overpowers the engine.

I'm betting they lightly pushed the brake pedal, instead of stamping hard down on it. The brakes then overheated, and became useless. Instead of letting go of the pedal for 20 seconds to allow the brakes to cool, they continued to press it, keeping it roasting hot and useless.

Your point about "natural reactions" is stupid. It is the responsibility of a driver to educate themselves on exactly how their vehicle is operated. If they don't do so, I have no sympathy for them. All of the deaths/accidents I have read about in these cars were entirely preventable. One only has to look at the history of the Audi 5000 in the US to understand that Americans are, generally, poor drivers.

Errm, please don't call me stupid or my next post will be more direct.:mad:

I challenge you to tell me what you would do in a car that you could not stop. Repeatably stabbing the button is a much more likely reaction.

Cut the crap about reading the manual, what would you do in an emergency. Remember, no one has stated these folks were familiar/owned these cars.

I some how think you would have no sympathy for anyone????

so sad:(

mikey72

Pew_Pew_Pew_Lasers! wrote: »

They obviously didn't press the pedal hard enough. In every car I have ever driven, the brake easily overpowers the engine.

I'm betting they lightly pushed the brake pedal, instead of stamping hard down on it. The brakes then overheated, and became useless. Instead of letting go of the pedal for 20 seconds to allow the brakes to cool, they continued to press it, keeping it roasting hot and useless.

Your point about "natural reactions" is stupid. It is the responsibility of a driver to educate themselves on exactly how their vehicle is operated. If they don't do so, I have no sympathy for them. All of the deaths/accidents I have read about in these cars were entirely preventable. One only has to look at the history of the Audi 5000 in the US to understand that Americans are, generally, poor drivers.

Hmm, come back when you have looked at the drive by wire brakes, along with the drive by wire accelerator, the drive by wire transmission, and the drive by wire start/stop.
Until then I'm betting you're the sort of person who would tap the brakes lightly in a car they couldn't stop either, while turning to page 1 of the user manual. If you have a system for preventing these deaths, have you contacted Toyota, you could save them millions.

Pew_Pew_Pew_Lasers!

cyclonebri1 wrote: »

Errm, please don't call me stupid or my next post will be more direct.:mad:

I challenge you to tell me what you would do in a car that you could not stop. Repeatably stabbing the button is a much more likely reaction.

Cut the crap about reading the manual, what would you do in an emergency. Remember, no one has stated these folks were familiar/owned these cars.

I some how think you would have no sympathy for anyone????

so sad:(

I suggest you buy yourself a dictionary; at no point did I call you stupid, although if you continue in this vein you'll probably end up proving just that point for me.

If I was in a Toyota that began to accelerate without any input from me, I'd use one of the measures outlined above. I would know about these procedures, because as someone who values the ability to drive safely I would have familiarised myself with the vehicle's controls.

Even if I didn't know how to stop the engine, I'd still know how to knock it out of gear, and how to use the brakes. It really is very simple, and yes, I have absolutely no sympathy whatsoever for people who do not understand how to control the vehicle they are driving. There was a lady on here who posted not so long ago, about how her car "lost steering" on a bend. It says a lot about this forum that many posters raised the possibility that she had a steering fault, when it was obvious to anyone that knows anything about driving that her car understeered.

mikey72

Pew_Pew_Pew_Lasers! wrote: »

I suggest you buy yourself a dictionary; at no point did I call you stupid, although if you continue in this vein you'll probably end up proving just that point for me.

If I was in a Toyota that began to accelerate without any input from me, I'd use one of the measures outlined above. I would know about these procedures, because as someone who values the ability to drive safely I would have familiarised myself with the vehicle's controls.

Even if I didn't know how to stop the engine, I'd still know how to knock it out of gear, and how to use the brakes. It really is very simple, and yes, I have absolutely no sympathy whatsoever for people who do not understand how to control the vehicle they are driving. There was a lady on here who posted not so long ago, about how her car "lost steering" on a bend. It says a lot about this forum that many posters raised the possibility that she had a steering fault, when it was obvious to anyone that knows anything about driving that her car understeered.

You really really have dropped the ball here haven't you. You actually imagine a little rod from the gearlever to the transmission don't you.

cyclonebri1

Pew_Pew_Pew_Lasers! wrote: »

I suggest you buy yourself a dictionary; at no point did I call you stupid, although if you continue in this vein you'll probably end up proving just that point for me.

.

And I suppose you'd suggest I read that whilst trying to stop the car and flicking through owners manual?. As said above you really don't understand the issue at all.

As far as anyone who says a post of mine is stupid is concerned, I take that to mean that they are calling me stupid, don't try playing on words to back away from it. If you meant it, say so, if you didn't, you mat consider an apology in order

The whole point, and you will not accept this, is that Toyota created a control system that was flawed, they have fully admiitted this, maybe they are not quite as perfect as you?

custardy

mikey72 wrote: »

You really really have dropped the ball here haven't you. You actually imagine a little rod from the gearlever to the transmission don't you.

exactly,the more 'fly by wire' a car has then the more is controlled via ECU
i will admit when i first heard about this i assumed driver error
however reading some of the cases and one where a driver had the handbrake on and hit feet pushed hard on the brake pedal,yet the car accelerated against this leads me to believe there could be an issue

people on you tube demonstrating how a car behaves when it is functioning as normal means nothing