Severn Trent dispute - advice needed.

timberflake

Hi guys, got a problem with Severt Trent and need some advice.

Basically, I've lived in my apartment Since 1st May 2007. When I moved in, it was a flat share with another chap and the Landlady charged us £525 pcm each all bills inclusive.

In May 2009, my flatmate moved out and my girlfriend and I decided to take over the whole apartment. We took over on 1st June 2009 and changed the deal so we paid rent to the LL and took care of all the utilities etc ourselves.

Fast forward to Dec and we had a letter from ST stating that they had no record of our apartment and would be sending an engineer round to look at the meter.

The engineer came round in the first week of Jan '10, he was in the apartment two mins, just enough time to read the meter and leave (our meter is in our apartment so I assume we're on a water meter).

We've heard nothing since until a couple of weeks ago when I received a letter asking for just over £1,100.00!

I rang them up and they informed me that they'd sent me a bill and a reminder and that this was the final demand. I informed them that I'd received neither the bill or the reminder and they said they'd send me a copy (the copy hasn't turned up yet and its been almost two weeks).

Whilst I was on the phone I asked what this bill was for and they told me it was from 1st Jan 2008 - 12th Jan 2010 (around £46 pcm!). I told them I was only responsible for the bill since June 2009 and they said they would need to see a copy of my tenancy agreement (not a problem), but I'm still taking issue with what they say we owe!

If you pro rata the £1,100.00 over two years it works out to £46.00 a month for two people in a 2nd floor apartment, this is way too much in my view, we can't owe £322.00 for 7 months water supply!

Does anyone have any suggestions on the best way to resolve this? My idea is to send them a letter with a copy of my tenancy agreement to confirm we're only liable for the water from 1st June 2009. At the same time, I plan to also take issue with the fact that in Dec 2009 they had no record of the meter (and include a copy of the letter) and draw attention to the fact that there is no way they can accurately bill us from June 2009 because of this. Finally, I plan to give them a meter reading as at the date of my letter to them and advise them that I will supply them with another reading after 30 days so that they can work out our monthly usage and apply that over all the months we owe.

Does that sound fair? And what do people think my chances of success are?

timberflake

Does anyone else have any thoughts on this?

DVardysShadow

Dob in your landlady as responsible for the bills up to the change of tenancy. Presumably you have meter readings from when you took over responsibility for utilities.

Cardew

£1,100 is certainly very high for two people in the Severn Trent area - but not impossible.

Assuming that the £1,100 is a valid bill, the division of the £1,100 is a matter between yourself and landlady.

As you didn't inform ST you were now responsible for the bills or submit a meter reading you are not on strong ground. I doubt the landlady would think it 'fair' for you to claim your water consumption had reduced drastically from June 2009.

timberflake

Cardew wrote: »

£1,100 is certainly very high for two people in the Severn Trent area - but not impossible.

Assuming that the £1,100 is a valid bill, the division of the £1,100 is a matter between yourself and landlady.

As you didn't inform ST you were now responsible for the bills or submit a meter reading you are not on strong ground. I doubt the landlady would think it 'fair' for you to claim your water consumption had reduced drastically from June 2009.

Well my landlady has told me to leave her out of it and not give them her name (for obvious reasons). ST can only bill me from June 2009 so the MAXIMUM they can bill me is £322.

Even though I didn't inform ST when I took over the water or supply them with a reading (as we didn't know where the meter was until Jan), I really can't see how ST can simply bill us and say pay now, especially seeing as in Dec 2009 they admitted in writing that they had no account set up for this apartment.

Surely my proposal of taking a reading at the beginning and end of a month has got to be more accurate and preferrable to them taking one reading in Jan 2010 and then sticking their finger in the air to guess what the meter reading was in Jan 2008!?!?

I know these utility companies seemingly have all the power, but logic has to win through, they cannot accurately work out what our monthly bill is from one reading, however we can by me giving them two readings.

Cardew

timberflake wrote: »

Well my landlady has told me to leave her out of it and not give them her name (for obvious reasons). ST can only bill me from June 2009 so the MAXIMUM they can bill me is £322.

Even though I didn't inform ST when I took over the water or supply them with a reading (as we didn't know where the meter was until Jan), I really can't see how ST can simply bill us and say pay now, especially seeing as in Dec 2009 they admitted in writing that they had no account set up for this apartment.

Surely my proposal of taking a reading at the beginning and end of a month has got to be more accurate and preferrable to them taking one reading in Jan 2010 and then sticking their finger in the air to guess what the meter reading was in Jan 2008!?!?

I know these utility companies seemingly have all the power, but logic has to win through, they cannot accurately work out what our monthly bill is from one reading, however we can by me giving them two readings.

You show them a tenancy agreement, but don't mention the landlady's name?

The landlady gets away(she hopes) without paying for water for years? yet you think logic is on your side and the company are at fault and being unfair.

You lived in the apartment from May 2007.

Why would they estimate a meter reading in Jan 2008? (presumably the meter reading then was zero??)

timberflake

Cardew wrote: »

You show them a tenancy agreement, but don't mention the landlady's name?

The landlady gets away(she hopes) without paying for water for years? yet you think logic is on your side and the company are at fault and being unfair.

You lived in the apartment from May 2007.

Why would they estimate a meter reading in Jan 2008? (presumably the meter reading then was zero??)

Rightly or wrongly its absolutely nothing to do with me who is responible for the water before June 2009 and I have no obligation to chase that debt on behalf of ST. Not to mention the fact that I dont think my LL will like it too much if I drop her in it, we wouldn't be the best of friends going forward would we!

You quite rightly state I've lived there since May 2007 (it was all bills incl until June 2009), so how can the meter reading be zero in Jan 2008!? The apartment has had tenants since arouns 2005 so if they've taken a meter reading of zero until they read it, we'll end up paying for water we're not liable for.

This is my argument, ST haven't told me what meter readings they have, all I have is a letter saying give us £1,100!

Gothicfairy

Timber, to be honest it makes no difference what you think or feel. It is rightly or wrongly down to you and no one else.

STW can go back 6 years legally and they have gone back to the date you became responsible for the supply.
You used the water and they are billing you. Either show them a tenancy agreement that states you were not responsible for the charges until 2009 or pay the bill.
The fact they did not know about the flat is not their fault , It sounds like it is a build that no one bothered to declare ( it might be worth checking with the council for the tax )

Gothicfairy

Also whilst I think about it, are you saying you have not got a bill ?
The problem you seem to have is with the landlady and not STW

timberflake

Gothicfairy wrote: »

Timber, to be honest it makes no difference what you think or feel. It is rightly or wrongly down to you and no one else.

STW can go back 6 years legally and they have gone back to the date you became responsible for the supply.
You used the water and they are billing you. Either show them a tenancy agreement that states you were not responsible for the charges until 2009 or pay the bill.
The fact they did not know about the flat is not their fault , It sounds like it is a build that no one bothered to declare ( it might be worth checking with the council for the tax )

If you read my posts, I'm not debating for a second that I do owe ST some money. However, it is no where near £1,100 and there is no way they can demand I pay the entire bill when I have only been responsible for the water since June last year - that I'm clear on.

My argument is, how can they give me an ACCURATE bill when from June 2009 until now with only 1 meter reading. They say this bill is from 1st Jan 2008- 12th Jan 2010, fine, what they havent said is whether they're assuming the meter reading was zero at 1st Jan 2008 or not. If they are assuming it was zero at this point they're way off the mark as the apartments have been lived in since 2005 and owned by the same person. This "start point" is a crucial piece of information they have neglected to tell me as it could have a drastic effect on my bill:

Assuming they read the meter from zero
1st Jan 2008 - 12th Jan 2010 = £1100 / 24 months = £46 pcm (approx)
1st Jan 2005 - 12th Jan 2010 = £1100 / 60 months = £18 pcm (approx)

My problem is that they havent sent me a bill nd even though I've requested they send it again two weeks ago I still don't have it. Until I know what meter reading they're billing from its really very hard to work it all out.

timberflake

Gothicfairy wrote: »

Also whilst I think about it, are you saying you have not got a bill ?
The problem you seem to have is with the landlady and not STW

No, ST said they sent a bill but it never arrived. All I've hd is a demand letter. I asked them to re-send the bill two weeks ago but its still not arrived.

Until I see what reading they're billing from I'm none the wiser, as my previous post shows, if they billing from zero and are just guessing the date the apartments starting being occupied this changes everything as the apartments have been inhabited since 2005.

My problem isn't with my LL. I don't care what the water charges were before 1st June 2009 as it is nothing to do with me and I have no legal obligation to them. All I'm concerned with doing is getting an ACCURATE bill from 1st June 2009 onwards, and to do that I need to see what ST think the reading was (if anything) on 1st Jan 2008.