CSA Variation is crap!

missmontana

MrAverage wrote: »

I moved far away with her as a last throw of the dice to give the marriage a chance rather than walk away.
I lost my career after we seperated as she wanted me out and all of my family live 100 miles away so thats how come I ended up so far away.
I could not afford to rent anywhere in the city I was working, especially with the divorce to sort etc.
I now have a well paid job which sadly is 100 miles from the kids, and I would not want to live near her.
I moved on and re married.
Its the next move for me is to ask her to meet halfway, but as she dont drive I know the answer will be no.

He moved with her, before they split, she didn't move the kids away from him.
He had to move away from the kids to get a job.
So what is your point? He was the one that moved away in this case.

In alot of cases the dads remove themselves.

(this is not aimed at the OP)

MrAverage

missmontana wrote: »

It seems you are being torn in all directions MrA, I wish my NRP made half as much effort and he only lives 20 mins up the road and works 5 mins round the corner...
But, at least you are making the effort! I applaud you :T and hope it all works out.

I only wish I lived 20 mins away. Those kids would be with me every spare weekend that I would have. My only problem is the 4 on 4 off shift pattern. This means I only get regular weekends off every other month.
Once again the CSA were totally unsympathetic when I explained this.
You are damned for working and damned for not being able to see every week, every month.

missmontana

MrAverage wrote: »

I only wish I lived 20 mins away. Those kids would be with me every spare weekend that I would have. My only problem is the 4 on 4 off shift pattern. This means I only get regular weekends off every other month.
Once again the CSA were totally unsympathetic when I explained this.
You are damned for working and damned for not being able to see every week, every month.

Oh yeah, my ex works shifts, doesn't ever offer to come get the boy after school and take him for a macdonalds on his 3 or 4 days off tho. Makes me wonder sometimes....

missbunbury

MrAverage wrote: »

I only wish I lived 20 mins away. Those kids would be with me every spare weekend that I would have. My only problem is the 4 on 4 off shift pattern. This means I only get regular weekends off every other month.
Once again the CSA were totally unsympathetic when I explained this.
You are damned for working and damned for not being able to see every week, every month.

But it's not about being 'sympathetic' or 'unsympathetic' - the CSA are not ALLOWED to reduce your maintenance just because you don't agree with it, whatever the reasons behind it. The amount of maintenance you pay is determined by child support laws - if these laws were changed, the CSA would calculate differently. What you're doing is essentially like walking into a shop and complaining to the shopkeeper about having to pay VAT - there's nothing they can do about it because they are legally required to charge the VAT and hand it over to the government.

In terms of advice, the best I can suggest since you are struggling with your maintenance payments is that you should look into ways to reduce your other, less essential outgoings - there's loads of help available on this site in that area! Then you could free up more money which might enable you to visit more often. Alternatively, if you can arrange to have overnight care of the kids regularly, you get a shared care reduction which is usually much more than a contact costs variation. It's done on averages, so it doesn't actually need to be every week, just the equivalent amount of time - basically, if you have them for 52 nights a year, your maintenance is reduced by 1/7. So, in the school holidays, if you were to book 4 days off (based on what you said about 4-on, 4-off) you could have them for a full week at a time, several times throughout the year. Obviously, this depends on your general situation.

Child support is esentially like income tax - as long as it's calculated correctly (and I haven't seen any suggestion in your posts that yours hasn't been) there's no point resenting paying it. I think people often direct their anger towards the CSA when that anger is actually a lot more to do with issues around the break-up of a relationship.

My final suggestion - try sitting down with your ex and showing her a financial breakdown detailing exactly what you have in the way of outgoings and explain to her that you are struggling under the current arrangement. Full disclosure might encourage her to see your side, and it's only the same information that you would be willing to show the CSA if they were allowed to be interested. If she closes her CSA case, the two of you can make any arrangement that suits both of you - the CSA cannot legally take into account your outgoings but she can. You could even try getting a mediation service involved to help you try to come to an arrangement.

MrAverage

Been there done that with regard to asking for give and take, more take from the PWC.
The CSA should take into account what outgoings the NRP has as these are extra outgoings as a result from the break up.
I have the kids once per month, thats all I can afford because of the distance.
As a NRP dont we have the right to see where the money goes? Even the CSA couldnt explain this to me.
They have told me its not for clothes. I dont trust my ex with money as its being spent on other non essential items. So you expect me to cut my outgoings just to furnish her with money which is probably going on gambling or drink?
I believe for the amount per month I pay (£338) I should be entitled to see how it costs that much. I had plans to take the kids abroad but now they will never get to see those sights and experiences because their mother certainly wont. The money I pay is wasted in my opinion because before I had to go through the CSA the kids were getting new clothes, shoes, games....you name it, they got it. Its just the CSA always favour the PWC and screw the rest.

MrAverage

Not once have I complained about the assessment, its just why cant it be given to the PWC in vouchers so its spent on things the kids need, not what she needs for her habits etc.

MrAverage

missmontana wrote: »

Oh yeah, my ex works shifts, doesn't ever offer to come get the boy after school and take him for a macdonalds on his 3 or 4 days off tho. Makes me wonder sometimes....

Sounds like a right waster if you ask me, sorry but NRP who dont give a damn are not worth mentioning.

missbunbury

MrAverage wrote: »

....The CSA should take into account what outgoings the NRP has as these are extra outgoings as a result from the break up....As a NRP dont we have the right to see where the money goes? Even the CSA couldnt explain this to me....I believe for the amount per month I pay (£338) I should be entitled to see how it costs that much. .... Its just the CSA always favour the PWC and screw the rest....
Not once have I complained about the assessment, its just why cant it be given to the PWC in vouchers so its spent on things the kids need, not what she needs for her habits etc...

You may well be making very valid points about how the money is used and what should be taken into account, I am not arguing against you on any of these, I'm saying that you are wrong to blame the CSA for the situation. They are not allowed to consider your outgoings, they are not allowed to tell you where the money goes or dictate to the PWC what it used for, they are simply there to enforce the law as it currently stands, and the law itself is what you want changed. If the law said "maintenance should be paid in vouchers" then the CSA would pay it out in vouchers. It's the politicians in Westminster who make the laws, and who have the power to change them.

13Kent

Hi Mr Average,

Sorry to say we have been in your situation - 4 hr round trip on Fri and Sun every other week, PWC making no attempt to get the children to us. Our fuel bill was £400 a month.(Family split due to PWC having an affair, my OH tried to make it work for the sake of the children too, but she did the same thing a second time then threw him out) CSA didn't want to know, despite numerous attempts to lower our payments (which incidentally are nearly £600 a month on CSA 1 - in our experience you are on a hiding to nothing. The thing we feel are really unfair is that if we were on CSA2 we would be be paying less than half what we do pay! Unfortunately despite seeing our MP (who was as much use as a chocolate teapot) we are stuck with it. We tried appealing to the PWC as we were struggling to live at one point - our car died and we had no choice but to buy a reliable one as my OH wouldn't be able to travel to see his children, so we had to take out a loan for that on top of our outgoings. (Incidentally the CSA were not interested in this either - even though without the car my OH would have lost contact with his kids)

We got through it albeit with handouts from family, no luxuries, clothes from charity shops, buying basics brands in supermarkets etc. Things thankfully have turned a corner now, and although we can't afford luxuries we are not struggling so much now.

We just live with it now, try not to let the situation get to us, and wait for that letter which someone else posted about saying 'case closed!' - a few years off yet, but we are on the downhill slope I hope!

Hang in there - hopefully things will improve - it might take a while, but you learn to live with it and survive!

MrAverage

Thanks Kent, nice to know there are similar people who have been experiencing the same treatment from CSA.
My ex had an affair too, 3 times in all.
I aint saying I am struggling, just surviving. My anger is because the kids are not gaining whereas if I wasnt paying her, then they would benefit from me a lot more.