Report Bank Charges successes and failures

cwright1985

Can anyone advise me please??

I banked with HSBC for a long while until they refused me a mortgage.

Yorkshire Bank then offered me a private account with a manger providing I got a mortgage through them. I needed a mortage and it was proving difficult due to the nature of my job so I accepted.

My house move unfortunately fell though and the mortage offer expired 6 months later. Around 1 year later, after renting for that period in the area near my new work, I tried to buy again.

This time round I was refused the same mortgage! I was told that they couldnt offer me anything because of my job. The same job as I orginally had when they did offer a mortgage.

I have since switched bank again as I only joined Yorkshire Bank because I was told I would get a mortgage from them in the first place.

Is this a reasonable case where I can try and get some compensation due to the fees I paid and huge inconvenience caused?

Regards

dunstonh

Jon1975 wrote: »

Bank - Santander
Amount Claimed - £3929
Amount Refunded - £0 as yet

These charges have been accrued over the last six years, as a result of always being in my overdraft and not having the means to get out of it. I suffer from bipolar affective disorder and BPD and have been unable to work for the last seven years. In this time I have frequently lacked capacity to adequately mange my financial affairs and have also suffered from frequent periods of "impulsiveness" i:e spending without caring. As you can imagine this has left me in considerable financial hardship as well as impacting on my health condition. I stumbled across the article on MSE regarding claiming charges back, so used the template explaining my issues and provided Santander with all the statements with charges highlighted and also evidence from my doctor of my mental health condition. Santander called today to say that they consider themselves to have kept within banking code guidelines because they were never informed I had any difficulties, despite the fact I have largely lacked the ability to contact them and that they never bothered to contact me as a result of the erratic behavior on my account, and such they refuse to refund any charges.
Do you guys think I should pass this on the ombudsman to take a look at.

Cheers

In your complaint, did you use wording that indicated the charges were unfair or words like that? if you did, then these are normally rejected and the FOS will not consider complaints about "unfair bank charges".

If you focused only on CURRENT hardship, then they can still reject your case if they feel that the hardship is self inflicted. i.e. through consumer spending habits. They look at your bank statements for example to see where you spend your money. If you have sky TV, large mobile phone bills, netlix, dining out, takeaways or even shop at Next, then these are the sorts of things that will lead to rejection.

If your spending shows no luxury spending and they agree with you that you are in hardship then they would come up with a solution which may include refunding some of the charges.

You have the right to go to the FOS. However, all the FOS can do is make sure the bank considered your case fairly. if it feels it didn't it will ask the bank to look at it again. It cannot impose a decision on bank charge refunds.

Jon1975

Thanks for your reply dunstonh. I worded my letter to reflect the the areas of the lending code (section 9) and banking conduct of business source book (section 5.1.4) as per the template letter, so I didn't refer to the charges as being "unfair" nor did I focus on current hardship. My case is based on the fact that due to my account being in a poorly managed state accruing many charges over the last six years (due in my part to having severe mental health difficulties) that Santander have a "responsibility" to consider refunding some or all of these charges as at no point did they try to contact or "intervene" to help or find out what was wrong. As it stands Santander have taken the position that because they weren't informed they don't need to do anything about it, what I say in response to that is that as a bank they have a responsibility to help their customer manage their accounts and flag up when things are clearly amiss and not continue to profit from someones misfortune. As the code states - a firm should deal fairly with a banking customer whom it has reason to believe is in financial difficulty - and I believe I am a customer who fits in to that category and because Santander made no attempt to comply with that part of the code I should by all rights be entitled to some recompense.

dunstonh

I worded my letter to reflect the the areas of the lending code (section 9) and banking conduct of business source book (section 5.1.4) as per the template letter,

That is a bad template letter and shouldnt be used.

so I didn't refer to the charges as being "unfair" nor did I focus on current hardship

Reference to banking conduct and lending code is effectively the unfair route which doesnt work any more.

Financial hardship is what you needed to focus on.

that Santander have a "responsibility" to consider refunding some or all of these charges as at no point did they try to contact or "intervene" to help or find out what was wrong.

They have no responsibility to refund a penny. It is a goodwill gesture on their part if they sympathise with your situation. It is so much better to present the issues and get the person on side rather than quote rules and regs which may not apply and effectively force the bank to respond in a similar way back.

As the code states - a firm should deal fairly with a banking customer whom it has reason to believe is in financial difficulty

But you said you didnt focus on your current hardship.

and I believe I am a customer who fits in to that category and because Santander made no attempt to comply with that part of the code I should by all rights be entitled to some recompense.

Forget what you think you are entitled to. You are not entitled to a penny. It is a goodwill gesture on their part. You have to persuade them you are in hardship.

You went about this the wrong way. Go back to them and point out you are in current hardship. Make them aware of your mental health situation. Dont go quoting rules or entitlement which do not apply. Focus on how the hardship is affecting you and what caused you to get into hardship.

Jon1975

Thanks again for your, rather abrasive, but comprehensive reply - if you believe the template to be a bad one shouldn't you inform the forum moderators ? And yes I'm aware that I am not "entitled" to anything as such, but would like to be treated sympathetically by Santander due to difficulties I have had to deal with. I shall contact ombudsmen and let you know how it goes.

JennyHornsby

Hi,

I also applied to Halifax for a refund in my bank charges, they sent me a letter offering £690 but I have moved house and lost my offer letter - could you post the complaints number from your offer letter so I can call them as they refuse to put me through to the correct department when I call the normal Halifax number? I would be so grateful! Thank you, Jenny

[Deleted User]

cwright1985 wrote: »

Can anyone advise me please??

I would strongly advise starting a new thread in a more relevant forum. At first glance, I would suggest that although very unfortunate you don't have a strong case here. You got the mortgage offer you were promised and didn't take it up. The bank then seemingly changed their criteria by the time you next applied. It's just bad luck and life can be like that at times. I reiterate, though, your best bet is to start a new thread in a more relevant forum. Nothing to lose by trying. Good luck and maybe posting here might be an idea.

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/forumdisplay.php?f=15

dunstonh wrote: »

You have the right to go to the FOS. However, all the FOS can do is make sure the bank considered your case fairly. if it feels it didn't it will ask the bank to look at it again. It cannot impose a decision on bank charge refunds.

In effect, though, it is exactly what the FOS does. Do you have evidence of any cases where recommendations made by the FOS haven't been followed by the banks concerned? I don't know of any.

dunstonh wrote: »

They have no responsibility to refund a penny. It is a goodwill gesture on their part if they sympathise with your situation... Forget what you think you are entitled to. You are not entitled to a penny. It is a goodwill gesture on their part. You have to persuade them you are in hardship.

They have every responsibility in my view, as they are effectively part of a criminal cartel. No doubt you were referring to technicalities, but I would still disagree with you. Each to their own in how we look at it though.

Jon1975 wrote: »

Do you guys think I should pass this on the ombudsman to take a look at.

Yes, 100% you should.

Jon1975 wrote: »

As it stands Santander have taken the position that because they weren't informed they don't need to do anything about it

Well, you have now informed them and the reason you didn't inform them earlier was down to your poor state of health, which they have been provided medical evidence of. I think you have a very good case myself.

Jon1975 wrote: »

I shall contact ombudsmen and let you know how it goes.

Yes, please do and you have nothing to lose by trying. :beer:

dunstonh

In effect, though, it is exactly what the FOS does. Do you have evidence of any cases where recommendations made by the FOS haven't been followed by the banks concerned? I don't know of any.

The FOS will impose an instruction to refund where a mistake has been made or charges have continued incorrectly. I looked at the ombudsman decisions and whilst it was easy to find rejections, finding an upheld where the bank was forced to pay an amount was harder. There were a number where the banks had continued to take charges after repayment plans (or similar) had taken place and the FOS instructed those to be refunded.

However, the response is typical where the hardship assessment has not been carried out fairly in the eyes of the ombudsman:
http://www.ombudsman-decisions.org.uk/viewPDF.aspx?FileID=10619
I would also remind HSBC of its ongoing obligation to consider Mr Y’s (and his
representative’s) financial difficulties positively and sympathetically.

They have every responsibility in my view, as they are effectively part of a criminal cartel. No doubt you were referring to technicalities, but I would still disagree with you. Each to their own in how we look at it though.

Your view doesnt matter. Nor does anyone view other then the FOS. What matters is the the outcome.

The ombudsman decision here verifies that they are not required to refund anything (as do virtually all of the decision).
http://www.ombudsman-decisions.org.uk/viewPDF.aspx?FileID=16552
Although Halifax should consider cases of financial hardship positively and sympathetically, that doesn’t oblige it to refund charges.
http://www.ombudsman-decisions.org.uk/viewPDF.aspx?FileID=12694
I fully recognise that Ms F has experienced financial hardship and that the bank’s charges
are significant in relation to her income. But as the charges were taken correctly I cannot
require the bank to refund them.

Set_me_free

Bank - Natwest
Amount claimed - £150
Amount Refunded £126

I wrote to Natwest 5th October using the template letter explaining our financial hardship after being diagnosed with breast cancer May 2013. I did already write to them back in Jan 2014 about our situation, they never responded. To be fair they have refunded all charges after the date of that letter, I am happy with this outcome, the money just appeared in my account 9th October, didn't have a call or a letter.

Set_me_free

Bank - Lloyds
Amount claimed: £363 + £324 = £687
Amount Refunded: £55 good will gesture, case closed, will be going to the financial Ombudsman

I wrote to Lloyds 5th October using the template letter explaining our financial hardship after being diagnosed with breast cancer May 2013. I did already write to them back in Jan 2014 about our situation, they responded with a call from their care team, but there was nothing they could do, as we had incurred no charges then.

Moving on to July of this year, I went in to Lloyds for a full financial assessment, we are living on the edge of our overdraft limit and often go over so have incurred many charges since Feb 2014, I am still only working part time and may never return to full time work due to side effects and generally coping with a lively child. We filled out a hardship form together she agreed we are only just meeting all our bills, which would then not allow for any emergencies or car tax etc.

Lloyds, called less than 5 hours from receiving the letter (I sent it recorded), have been rude and offensive, unsympathetic and basically said there was no evidence of hardship, despite our account being on the edge of the overdraft every month and often going over our limit, we have a massive build up of charges and interest, charges alone are more then £687 with interest its in the region of £600. The whole thing has snowballed, before my diagnosis we were financially sound.

I explained we are in a cycle of charges and fees, he was so insensitive and rude, he basically made out we were out living it up when I was ill, due to a concert ticket which was bought on our account but paid for by my mum as a Christmas gift, I was so mad, he mentioned another ticket from before I was even diagnosed.

He also lied and said there were no notes on our account referring to a letter Jan 14 or my appointment in branch this July, I have since spoken to the branch they have been very apologetic, they do have both the letter and appointment on file.

So I will be taking this further, I’m just waiting for the letter so I can apply to the ombudsman.

There is so much more I could say…

Shame on Lloyds.