jobseekers / employers alike- this official 'bung' may tip the balance!

computershack

Vader123 wrote: »

Again, with my employer hat on, why bother putting in the time/effort/resources?
Vader

So let me get this right....

You bemoan the demise of the apprenticeship, you whine about the poor quality of job applicants and say that decent ones get snapped up quickly but you can't be bothered to train people?

Wow, there's a short sighted view if ever I saw one. Still, you'll get what you deserve - all the detritus that nobody else will employ.

briona

computershack wrote: »

Still, you'll get what you deserve - all the detritus that nobody else will employ.

I think you misunderstood Vader's posts!

There are more than enough decent quality applicants out there at the moment (recession, mass unemployment, good candidates being made redundant...). And ironically, "the detritus that nobody else will employ" are the candidates MOST likely to come with the JobCentre's £1,000-string attached – the very same candidates that Vader has expressly stated he has no interest in.

Perhaps you should re-read the thread?! :rolleyes:

Briona

john539

Vader123 wrote: »

As an employer, I have wasted my time in the past (though not anymore) with the "I'm only here cos they will stop my benefits" argument.

I would want £500 per candidate from the JC to interview.

(Or being realistic I would want £500 per 5 candidates interviewed).

I am sick of trying to fill positions that are 20K a year 5 on 5 off (8-2), full BUPA, Xmas bonus and having to put up with JC idiots. They don't want to be there, don't want to answer any questions, I don't want to see them.

Waste of time.

Vader

What do you expect ?

You don't pay anything to advertise through JC+.

How does that compare with the cost of doing it yourself or through an agency ?

Some people are never happy.


There is virtually no filtering on who can apply for jobs advertised at JC+.
Any man & his dog can apply.

JC staff have virtually no skills in finding the right people for jobs, they just go through the motions. Jobseekers have to prove they are "actively seeking work", so they may apply for anything put in front of them by JC advisor, even if it's completely unsuitable.

JC+ is outdated & not fit for purpose.

Vader123

computershack wrote: »

So let me get this right....

You bemoan the demise of the apprenticeship, you whine about the poor quality of job applicants and say that decent ones get snapped up quickly but you can't be bothered to train people?

Wow, there's a short sighted view if ever I saw one. Still, you'll get what you deserve - all the detritus that nobody else will employ.

You misunderstand my posts!

My vacant posts have a strict "minumum spec".

These are specific things, like certain qualifications, certain experience etc.

As a job seeker you can get this from my website, or ringing my HR people.

The JC+ offer to help fill these posts and promise to send applicants matching my minimum spec.

I then get people who :

1) Left school with no O-levels/GCSE
2) Have never worked in my sector
3) Have no relevant or recent experience
4) Who openly admit they are only there because they they don't want their JSA to be stopped.

Thats my time wasted, the candidates time wasted and whoever at the JC+ that decides who comes wasted.

See my point?

Vader

Vader123

john539 wrote: »

What do you expect ?

You don't pay anything to advertise through JC+.

How does that compare with the cost of doing it yourself or through an agency ?

Some people are never happy.


There is virtually no filtering on who can apply for jobs advertised at JC+.
Any man & his dog can apply.

JC staff have virtually no skills in finding the right people for jobs, they just go through the motions. Jobseekers have to prove they are "actively seeking work", so they may apply for anything put in front of them by JC advisor, even if it's completely unsuitable.

JC+ is outdated & not fit for purpose.

You don't pay anything to advertise through JC+.

No I don't.

I don't pay anything, nor do I have any obiligation to use them.

I use them in the vain assumption that there might be some people who want a job, has the skills for the job and will prove it to me at interview.

There is virtually no filtering on who can apply for jobs advertised at JC+.
Any man & his dog can apply.

No, thats my point. I ask the JC+ to filter applicants based on my requirements.

Not how long they have been on the dole, not their age, not their need for a job.

They should be, (and promised me) that they vet the people that apply, my advert does not hit the JC+ boards.

Perhaps thats my problem, perhaps they offer out the position to anyone.

JC staff have virtually no skills in finding the right people for jobs, they just go through the motions

That might be what they tell their claimants, but thats not what they tell the (dwindling) employers they work with.

They tell me they have computer systems that can match my person spec to job seekers. They tell me that they will contact the candidates, they will arrange and diary times, they will deal with the candidates when they want feedback.

They don't, and £500 per candidate would still be a waste of time, and especially money (tax payers and mine, I am in both groups!).

Vader

donnajunkie

Vader123 wrote: »

Again, with my employer hat on, why bother putting in the time/effort/resources?

If I want a, for example, a sage specalist, right now I can ask for that. I don't need to train them, they are out there looking for jobs.

Vader

i understand your point. i wonder whether that kind of thinking by employers is part of what contributes to the recruitment difficulties that you have had. i am not saying that every time a company needs someone they should always train someone. i am saying that i think companies have a responsibility to have some trainees. the bigger the company the more trainees they should have. i once worked at a company that employed over 50 people and did not have one single apprentice.

Vader123

donnajunkie wrote: »

i understand your point. i wonder whether that kind of thinking by employers is part of what contributes to the recruitment difficulties that you have had. i am not saying that every time a company needs someone they should always train someone. i am saying that i think companies have a responsibility to have some trainees. the bigger the company the more trainees they should have. i once worked at a company that employed over 50 people and did not have one single apprentice.

I don't have apprentices, though I have relationships with the local colleges and schools for work placements.

To be honest, its hard enough running a business at a profit at the moment without extra people to look after. But I hope this to be temporary.

Vader

DKLS

I understand exactly where you are coming from Vader, This year I have had the misfortune to interview for an office junior role, I very nearly lost the will to live during the process.

You cant polish a turd with £500

john539

Vader123 wrote: »

No, thats my point. I ask the JC+ to filter applicants based on my requirements.

They should be, (and promised me) that they vet the people that apply, my advert does not hit the JC+ boards.

Perhaps thats my problem, perhaps they offer out the position to anyone.

That might be what they tell their claimants, but thats not what they tell the (dwindling) employers they work with.

They tell me they have computer systems that can match my person spec to job seekers. They tell me that they will contact the candidates, they will arrange and diary times, they will deal with the candidates when they want feedback.

You have been misled.

JC+ don't know jobseekers real skills or experience, therefore it is impossible for them to match to anything. They only use high level job type category numbers to match to people.

JC+ go on whatever the jobseeker tells them, if jobseeeker says they can do the job or have the skills, that's it.

JC staff don't really understand skills/experience behind jobs & for each jobseeker.

There's a lot more to matching people to jobs than using general job type category numbers.

donnajunkie

john539 wrote: »

You have been misled.

JC+ don't know jobseekers real skills or experience, therefore it is impossible for them to match to anything. They only use high level job type category numbers to match to people.

JC+ go on whatever the jobseeker tells them, if jobseeeker says they can do the job or have the skills, that's it.

JC staff don't really understand skills/experience behind jobs & for each jobseeker.

There's a lot more to matching people to jobs than using general job type category numbers.

of course people could lie to agencies or even directly to the employer as well. the jobcentre has often tried to refer me to a job i am not suitable for. i always speak up and tell them. however many people may be too scared to speak up. that is probably a big part of why employers get unsuitable people being refered to them. the way things are going now they are expecting people unemployed over 6 months to consider anything. whether you think that is right or not, this ultimately means employers will be seeing more people with no experience in the job. the philosophy is if you cant get a job you are qualified for then you should go for a job you arent qualified for because you have a better chance of getting one of those jobs. :rolleyes: