CAA request updates / results part 2

pebbles88

me again

following a long fight with shatwest, and them admitting they do not have the original agreement anymore (they admitted it to the FOS during a complaint was being looked into...but thats another story!) they played ball and accepted token payments, stopppe dinterest etc.

they have recently sent me a very nice letter asking for my proposals of increasing the payment - (they must all run in the same cycles!!), so i am in a bit of a conundrum,... i cannot afford to increase my payments, cannot afford to offer a F&F, but am sorely tempted to tell them to piddle off, but then also would feel very guilty at not paying something.

yes i already have defaults, on a couple of catalogues, but this is quite a large balance. and i really dont know what to do now..... was half way thru typing a letter roughly saying, i know you dont have the agreement, accept token payments or b**ger off and get no payments.... and im also thinking that if i keep paying tokens then its prolonging the start of the 6 yrs to statue barred.....

i really dont know what to do! :undecidedarrggh, any thoughts my lovlies??

martinjohn

if you've firmly established they dont have the agreement, just dont pay them, they cant do nothing except well harass you, in which case you can sue for harassment :j

the way im seeing it, is you can argue that;
if there is NO ORIGINAL CCA you should not acknowledge there IS an agreement
the doucment must be supplied due to:
no knowledge of debt, no knowledge of terms, no knowledge of debt agreement ever existing or being signed or agreed to at the time it alledgely occured.
if it is not; any one of these aspects argueably be true and used in your defense.

The question in my mind, is do you need to have a defense, and after manchester it appears you do need to have a defense... if you wish to fight it in court IF (the big IF!) it Ultimately gets to that stage...

I think however the banks should be forced to supply the original CCA to customers, not doing so is undermining peoples right to data under the data protection act 1998 for a start isnt it - it does after all now include all offline data not just computer data? Am i wrong? This is is the bit thats really getting to me, is why they dont supply it?

pebbles88

martinjohn wrote: »

if you've firmly established they dont have the agreement, just dont pay them, they cant do nothing except well harass you, in which case you can sue for harassment :j

hello,

well i have it in writing from the FOS that they do not have it as it was opened in 1998.

part of me is thinking, well i already have 2 defaults, and several lates on my CRA files so in for a penny in for a pound....

but the other half of me is thinking if i turn round and stop all payments then I will open up a huge can of worms for us. already having ongoing fight with some of my other debtors.

think i will mull it over a few days, thank you very much for replying

martinjohn

ive just looked at consumeraction group and have read of someone forcing the bank to supply their original agreement using a data subject access request (SAR)

You can bring this to court for £30 and get your costs back to. It seems this is the only way to get the bank to supply the document?

If they dont supply the agreement, you can be sure they cant supply it at a later date or else they would not of been following the original courts instruction to supply it under the SAR.
Further if they did supply it and the terms were unenforceable thiss would be in clear obstruction of supplying the agreement and making it clear that they were hiding something.

what do people think?

ALSO i just read on the CRAZY OFT makes no sense whatsoever guidance,

"Thirdly, the creditor or owner should make it clear in
communications to the debtor that the debt is in fact
unenforceable."

but obviously they dont! did they do that for pebbles88... no!

Anyway, im off to write my SAR requests! i really dont think its worth even CCAing them first? NID?

never-in-doubt

martinjohn wrote: »

ive just looked at consumeraction group and have read of someone forcing the bank to supply their original agreement using a data subject access request (SAR)

You can bring this to court for £30 and get your costs back to. It seems this is the only way to get the bank to supply the document?

If they dont supply the agreement, you can be sure they cant supply it at a later date or else they would not of been following the original courts instruction to supply it.

what do people think?

DO NOT attempt to take a lender to court! Unenforceability means the lender cannot take you to court - that's that!

A SAR doesn't mean they will send the original either - waste of £10. If they will not comply to a specific s.78 request then what makes you think they'll comply with SAR?

You really don't grasp this at all do you?

never-in-doubt

pebbles88 wrote: »

hello,

well i have it in writing from the FOS that they do not have it as it was opened in 1998.

part of me is thinking, well i already have 2 defaults, and several lates on my CRA files so in for a penny in for a pound....

but the other half of me is thinking if i turn round and stop all payments then I will open up a huge can of worms for us. already having ongoing fight with some of my other debtors.

think i will mull it over a few days, thank you very much for replying

No agreement = unenforceable, why are you paying a debt that is unenforceable? Mad or what!!

Forget morals, your credit file is dead and paying this debt only prolongs statute barred so quit paying lol :mad::mad:

pebbles88

martinjohn wrote: »

ive just looked at consumeraction group and have read of someone forcing the bank to supply their original agreement using a data subject access request (SAR)

You can bring this to court for £30 and get your costs back to. It seems this is the only way to get the bank to supply the document?

If they dont supply the agreement, you can be sure they cant supply it at a later date or else they would not of been following the original courts instruction to supply it under the SAR.

what do people think?

ALSO i just read on the CRAZY OFT makes no sense whatsoever guidance,

"Thirdly, the creditor or owner should make it clear in
communications to the debtor that the debt is in fact
unenforceable."

but obviously they dont! did they do that for pebbles88... no!

oh i did Sar them, they sent me all sorts of nonsense, including another customers private details..... but still no CCA! :rotfl:twits

pebbles88

never-in-doubt wrote: »

No agreement = unenforceable, why are you paying a debt that is unenforceable? Mad or what!!

Forget morals, your credit file is dead and paying this debt only prolongs statute barred so quit paying lol :mad::mad:

ooh dont shout at me please

im just unsure as too what to put in the letter to them now!!

never-in-doubt

pebbles88 wrote: »

ooh dont shout at me please

im just unsure as too what to put in the letter to them now!!

Send this: 4. CCA Dispute

I wasn't shouting lol - but we are on MSE after all :rotfl:

pebbles88

never-in-doubt wrote: »

Send this: 4. CCA Dispute

I wasn't shouting lol - but we are on MSE after all :rotfl:

true true!

i have already been down this line with them, disputed them, got very terse and tbh, scary letter back. and at the time it frightened the bejeses out of me!

FOS complaint came about thru them being very heavy handed despite not producing the cca, the fact they sent someone elses details with my sar as well as parts of my own.

the outcome of the FOS complaint was that they had acted fairly and were allowed to chase for payment so to speak, and as they stopped interest and accepted tokens etc that they couldnt do much, but i did get a chunk of interest back. however they dod also say that they couldnt commment on whether it was enforceable of not and that it was not their place to do so...

so in effect i have already disputed them, been thru the process with them. trouble was i found out about them 100% not having the agreement the day i got out of hospital, so in all honesty wasnt on this planet for a few weeks with the pain meds! and i just went on auto pilot sending the tokens out etc.

i feel like if i just send the letter again that i wont be helping myself, iyswim?