Terrified by shouting, angry farmer .. what to do next?

Pepzofio

Oldernotwiser wrote: »

If you read what she wrote and I quoted, she said " he ran a genuine risk of being bitten" if the dogs thought that he was attacking her. Read it again.

I've read it several times, and if you read it in the context of the paragraph, it is clear that OP meant it to be interpreted as 'If the farmer really believed that my dogs were such a threat, why would he put himself in danger, as surely any dog capable of cattle-worrying would be more than capable of lunging at someone in defence of their owner?' - as gwhizz and tom1234 have already pointed out.

Oldernotwiser

Tom1234 wrote: »

Was it really? Doesn't look like it to me.

If you don't quote the preson you're replying to then they won't know that this is what you're doing - this is why you're not getting any replies!

I've read the part you're quoting but you seem to be ignoring the bit I am!

Oldernotwiser

Pepzofio wrote: »

I've read it several times, and if you read it in the context of the paragraph, it is clear that OP meant it to be interpreted as 'If the farmer really believed that my dogs were such a threat, why would he put himself in danger, as surely any dog capable of cattle-worrying would be more than capable of lunging at someone in defence of their owner?' - as gwhizz and tom1234 have already pointed out.

I appreciate that this wasn't the point that she was trying to get across but it's what she said nonetheless. Sometime's it's quite telling to read what people write as an aside to their main point.

mumslave

ach this is getting a bit daft now, even if the farmer did believe the dogs were dangerous, he would very likely still have reacted the way he did, people do silly things to protect their animals, even farmers with livestock. I jumped in between a border collie and my jackrussel fighting once,despite being well aware that you should never get involved in a dog fight...it was actually to stop my jack russel as it had the collie by its throat, so it wasnt even done with the overall concern being my own animal. Very stupid none the less.

The point is, its possible to understand why the farmer reacted the way he did, but he threatened the OP in a way the police, I believe, would take very seriously indeed. A letter to him sounds like a great way, to try to get some resolution on this. Going back and forth over whom is right of whom is wrong seems pointless, rather just there are lessons to be learned on both sides.

Pepzofio

BilberryCharlotte wrote: »

You have it one there, it is not only bad manners, but some people are foolish/arrogant in my opinion. Even the best trained dog can be spooked on occasion, therefore if you haven`t got your dog on a lead you have no absolute control over it.

Personally I think it's a bit cruel to own a dog and never let it run off the lead - especially a 'working' breed such as a collie. There are also situations where leads are impractical such as drag hunts/gun dogs.

I am sorry to tell you that not all farmers are good to their livestock, or care to see that they have food water and shelter if needed. Hopefully they are very much in the minority. Do all meat eaters care about animal welfare? I think many do in their own way, but I doubt if all omnivores do.

I am aware that not all farmers are good to their livestock, but you seemed to be saying that caring about (your own) animals was justification for threatening (other) animals and their owners!

Nor am I, I am sorry the farmer was angry and upset the original poster who seems to be a very caring person, but perhaps she might have been in even more distress if he had shot her dogs.

An event which a lot of posters seem to be implying would be OP's own fault in some way, which I think is ridiculous. She may not have been following the countrycode's recommendation (by some people's interpretation), or a perceived notion of 'good manners', but shooting her dogs for simply not being on a lead, when he had not actually witnessed them in the act of chasing or worrying his stock would have been a criminal offence.

I don`t think people should prevented from walking on public footpaths, but that privelege surely brings responsibilities with it such as keeping your dog on a lead, then in this particular case there may not have been any need for verbal intimidation.
Even so, I do feel very sorry for this ladies distress.

I'm just saying it cuts both ways.

You seem in bit of a snit by the way, are you one of these posters who thinks that only their opinion is valid? Are you residing in town or country?

:rotfl:Not aware of being in a snit, certainly don't think I'm the only person with a valid opinion (although I do feel a lot of people are getting things a bit out of perspective here), currently residing in a small town, but have previously lived in small villages and on farms and have worked with cattle. Are you vegan/vegetarian?

mumslave

not to be picky, but gun dogs are never let off on farm lands, purely because noone but poachers would be on farm lands hunting...as you might have gathered we had a lot of dogs, as my dad was similar to a game keeper. His gun dogs were only ever off the lead (and indeed out of their kennel) when working...and that would never be on farmlands, more up on the hills where the odd sheep could be likely yes, but not from being intentionally put there by the farmer.

And sadly if the dogs had been shot, yes in my eyes it would be the OPs fault...unintentionally. This is why I am cross at the farmer, instead of explaining anything to her about the dangers of having dogs off the lead, he instead threatened to start shooting blah blah, just because some people, like me, have been unfortunate to realise what can happen should dogs be free from leads around farm animals, doesnt mean every dog owner will be aware. He should have sorted the situation out and explained. I expect the OP would have been a lot more understanding/less intimidated had he acted in such a manner.

The farmer next door to us was forever threatening to shoot me and my brothers, for stealing his turnips. Just randomly thrown in, because the memory is quite amusing.

gwhizz75

mumslave wrote: »

And sadly if the dogs had been shot, yes in my eyes it would be the OPs fault...unintentionally.

Maybe in your eyes, but in reality that is simply not true. She wasn't breaking any laws, or even any codes of conduct. She was perfectly within her rights to walk her dogs off the lead as long as they were under control. If he had shot the dogs, he would have broken the law as they were NOT worrying or chasing the cattle. How can it therefore be the OP's fault? In the eyes of the law, it would be the farmer's fault.

If the dogs WERE worrying the cattle, then it would be a different story. However, we can only assume that the OP is telling the truth and that the dogs were minding their own business, trotting along behind her. If someone shot my dog in that situation, and then claimed it was my fault, I think I would grab the gun and shoot them.

mumslave

I took it to mean in the hypothetical case of the farmer shooting the dogs because they were worrying the cows, not what actually happened. If the dogs had been chasing the cows, the farmer would be within the law to shoot them, sadly, and yes i would believe it to be the OP's fault, not intentionally of course, but when you have a pet, just like children, you are responsible for them at all times. Having the dogs off the lead WAS dangerous, especially when I read there was a bull to be seen.

BilberryCharlotte

Pepzofio wrote: »

:rotfl:Not aware of being in a snit, certainly don't think I'm the only person with a valid opinion (although I do feel a lot of people are getting things a bit out of perspective here), currently residing in a small town, but have previously lived in small villages and on farms and have worked with cattle. Are you vegan/vegetarian?

In general, unless they have become arthritic or have joint problems, as far as I know working breeds require a lot of exercise, therefore if you don`t want to keep them on a short lead get an extending lead or find an area that is fenced off. I know lots of people let their dogs run free in public places, which I feel is really foolish, both for the safety of the dog, other people and traffic.

I am not saying that having animals is justification for threatening other animals and/or their owners, but I feel that this particular situation could easily have been avoided, or had the farmer believed these dogs had chased his cattle he could easily have been convinced otherwise had the dogs been on a lead.

As far as I am aware he would have been perfectly entitled to shoot the dogs, I have known farmers shoot dogs for simply being near their sheep, let alone seeing the animals move away hurriedly, if you have lived or worked on farms you may know this. Perhaps he thought that by shouting at her he may prevent such a thing happening again and was actually doing her a favour. For most situations the people involved will see things completely differently. Having said that, I can see how upset she would be, and maybe still is, it isn`t nice to feel threatened and powerless to protect oneself.

Not in a snit? you seemed a bit like an avenging something or other, perhaps you were just ready for your lunch? Yes, I am now a vegan, I do hope you don`t feel that means I shouldn`t have an opinion?

adouglasmhor

funny enough when I used to see the hunt going through fields of cattle and sheep and even once farmed deer I never once saw any of the hounds leashed. I suppose country animals would realise they were only interested in foxes and ignore them.

note the above is laden with sarcasm