government benefits for childless couples

Poppycat

Shouldnt we have children in work houses next?

Spendless

Childless single and couples on a low income can get working tax credit help too.

looby75

fatblokexl wrote:

B: thankfully we are healthy so do not drain the NHS

I'm not going to even comment on your other two statements because, well to put it bluntly they aren't worth commenting on. BUT I did want to comment about the fact you say you are healthy and don't drain the NHS.

That may be the case at the moment, but unless you have a crystal ball and can see into the future you have no idea of how you health will be in say 10 years time. You could go and be hit by a bus tomorrow and spend months recovering in hospital, you could get cancer and need treatment for that, or your partner could fall of the kerb and break their ankle and need physiotherapy for months after the bone in healed. Your suggestion that you should be entitled to some form of compensation because you don't use NHS services is ludicrous.....you simply can not predict the future.

And believe me if you ever DO need to use the NHS services at some point in the future, say in your dotage, you will be very very thankful that our children are working and paying their taxes to help keep it running, or maybe even working as the medical professionals who are taking care of you.

chugalug

I dont agree with any of the above either. Your expenses if you don't have children are lower and you're in a better position to retrain if you want a better paid job. Society needs more people to have children. Just because people claim benefits doesnt mean they have children who aren't going to contribute to society. Are all children whose parents claim benefits going to grow up to be a drain on society?? What you're saying is people should have children if they want but you don't think society should contribute to the cost of this. IMO if employers paid decent wages for the jobs that are necessary but low status no-one would need to claim benefits but unfortunately this isnt the system we live under. If we want to live in a civilised society we should contribute to the things that society as a whole benefits from ie education, healthcare, social services, benefits and yes that includes children. Cos whether you like it or not you benefit from all of these or will do at some time.

fatblokexl

montycat wrote:

Oh my,
I am spechless!I too am getting on with my life ,working hard and I certainly didn't "drop sprogs left right and centre".
QUOTE]

Sorry to hear your news,please accept my condolences. Perhaps my words in this and other posts have been mis-interpreted.
What i meant to say without the long boring sentences is... some parts of society believe that by not working and/or having numerous children they will get money thrown at them by the state for not much in return and we the poor tax payers are supporting them.

I do agree a welfare state for the needy and under priveledged is vital but we must draw the line somewhere and either cap the rate of benefits paid or reduce the burden on the people who do not claim.

My own situation, as an example, means that from my own and my wifes income, we pay for:
mortgage
council tax
home insurance
2 cars
petrol
car tax
car insurance
parking
electricity
pet
phone
tv
HP for the cars
bank loan

and by the time that is done we are left with £££'s well below what the average person on tax credits for instance gets.

should we "choose" not to work we would probably be better off as we would not need the cars (no job to go to), consequently no car ins, tax, petrol, parking.
bank loan may get paid for short term as it's protected.
may loss house once mortgage protection ends but hey...council will give us a house, then we wont pay council tax or rent (or at least reduced).
may decide to have kids with all the spare time we will have, then the money we will have will be more than we have now.

but i "choose" to work and i get no help!!!

Poppycat

But those on tax credits have to pay for those things too. We need to encourage people to have families, although tax credits has its faults it does help those who are in need.

If it wasnt for tax credits a lot of people on low incomes would be in poverty, and many wouldnt be able to work because it wouldnt be worth doing it.

chugalug

People who are on tax credits have the expenses of working as well as the expenses of children. If you were very low paid you would get WTC and still have the same expenses but I don't know if you would be able to live on minimum wage! If you werent working sure you wouldnt have to pay council tax and if you had social housing you'd probably get your rent paid. BUT could you live on £57 per week (not much more for a couple) for food, bills etc?? :Yes you'd get more money if you had children but you'd have higher expenses. Tax credits have done the job they were designed to do which was lift children out of poverty - I for one don't resent that.

Poppycat

They havent quiet got children out of poverty, they government havent quiet met the target although it has helped many people, myself included.

Just because you yourself hasnt need to use many services, you may one day need them. Please dont deny others who need help I really think some people read too much what the papers say regarding spongers etc. Yes there are some, but I said this before the poor and those with health problems seemed to be a soft target as often they cant fight back.

montycat_2

Hi flatblokexl
I could write a similar list of my expenses but ,envisage this scenario .
Before 30th June 2005 -our yearly income was £54000.We received the minimal child Tax credit and Family Allowance ,no other benefits .
As from 1st July 2005 -my income was cut to Family Allowance and my £150 a month I got from my job .Roughly £300 a month .Out of that I had to pay £850 a month mortgage and feed 3 kids plus pay for a funeral.
I was fortunate ,my husband was insured but ,that money is mine and my kids salary for the next 30 odd years .
Without the full whack of Child Tax credits and Widowed parents Allowance ,I would be destitute .
My Widowed Parents Allowance is based on my late husbands National Insurance contributions and ,is a taxable Allowance .I am entitled to it and my husband paid for it through his wages .
My Quetion for you is this ,If you died tomorrow -your wife would receice something back .That is the way the system works .Its is a safety net for all.
Some of us never need it ,others like me are grateful it exists .
I do accept that some abuse it but ,many more are thankful that it is there .

A_LANCASHIRE_LAD_2

Ooh what a hornets nest this topic is...

On some points I can totally agree, yet others I strongly disagree.

My wife & I have previously on benefits when we had no children, unfortunately my wife was very ill & had to undergo tests for brain tumour etc (thankfully they were clear) and during this time I couldn't find work and we claimed benefit, as we had no children and owned our own home the only benefit we got was my wife's incapacity benefit, as we owned our home we got mortgage interest payments, but these only kicked in after a wait of about 3 months, and then only amounted to around £13 per week. This time was no fun, we still had to pay gas, electric, mortgage etc this is TOTALLY impossible on this amount of money.

We now have a child of 4 months, I still am out of work (but believe me it isn't for want of trying) we get £88 benefit plus £54 tax credit £17 child allowance plus we get most of our rent paid (as we now rent, having lost our house to the above situation) and most of our council tax also paid, however, the extra money soon goes when we have to buy nappies, wipes, creams, bottles, prams, cots, etc etc (please don't go on about the sure start grant here, believe me £500 goes no-where, we don't have an expensive mamas & papas nursery, ALL of our things were second hand) my wife is now looking for work as she wants our child to grow up with nice things and have day trips out and holidays, all of which we are unable to give him on benefits & as I've been unable to find work it is down to her to bring home the bacon.

living on benefits is not an "easy" life, its damn hard and very demoralising & depressing