Save the Economy? SCRAP the NHS!

setmefree2

Health Lessons from Europe


"High infant mortality, low life expectancy, soaring health-care costs — the symptoms are numerous and the diagnosis unmistakable: America's health-care system is ailing. But like a patient who coughs or limps his way through an illness, the U.S. has often been reluctant to look for help.
That's changing. The Obama Administration promises to offer universal coverage, introduce electronic records and wrestle health-care costs under control — in short, at least part of the health-care revolution that many Americans have advocated for years.
Inevitably, perhaps, that means Americans are looking to European models, hailed by some, dismissed as socialized medicine by others."


http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1899873,00.html

lostinrates

setmefree2 wrote: »

Inevitably, perhaps, that means Americans are looking to European models, hailed by some, dismissed as socialized medicine by others."

I haven't clicked the link...but with the points in your post I'd agree......BUT its worth also rememebring that America do do somethings well: research is fantastic and some health paramtres more narrow: meaning people in the system are advised to get treatment earlier ...as I understand it.

My privte GP (who is retained as a team of three with a private employer) goes every three years (on rota with collegaues) for a month for education into new treatments/reseacrh etc.

dervish

The_Economist wrote: »

A few points i would like too pick you up on,
1) The vast majority of us pay more into the NHS than we will ever get out of it. It costs the country millions and billions of pounds.

This is the same as your state pension, do you also want to get rid of that!

2) Too much middle management - not enough front line etc.

This is a problem with any organization and i have to agree.

3)Solution is simple - abolish the NHS - the tax that people lose from their incomes could get them private health cover.

Isn't this the type of thing that has caused many Americans financial difficultys or even bankruptcy.

4)In this ever deepening recession decent honest people who are hardworking or retired may jolly well ask "why should I subsidise the health of people?" They are right.

What about those babies and children that need the NHS to get them well again.

5)The money saved on the NHS could go towards tax cuts and improving other infrastructure improvements such as widening motorways.

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

what a re the childish rolling faces meant to represent?

StevieJ

dervish wrote: »

what a re the childish rolling faces meant to represent?

I think he is laughing at you dervish

dervish

StevieJ wrote: »

I think he is laughing at you dervish

So he is laughing at the thought of infratsructure improvements? How silly.

StevieJ

dervish wrote: »

So he is laughing at the thought of infratsructure improvements? How silly.

I thought you wrote

SCRAP IT!

infratsructure improvements? :rotfl:

dervish

StevieJ wrote: »

I thought you wrote

SCRAP IT!

infratsructure improvements? :rotfl:

I think most people would prefer a rebate on their taxes and then be able to choose whether to pay for health cover or not.

I also know that most people in this country would agree that we need a major road building program - either more motorways or widening of existing ones.

No-one is interested in buses etc we need to be able to use cars and roads.

When people say we cant use cars as the roads are too crowded then I say - look we as a country are OVERCROWDED !!!!! In fact we should be incentivising certain groups of people to leave and make for sapce for the decent majority.

misskool

lostinrates wrote: »

I haven't clicked the link...but with the points in your post I'd agree......BUT its worth also rememebring that America do do somethings well: research is fantastic and some health paramtres more narrow: meaning people in the system are advised to get treatment earlier ...as I understand it.

My privte GP (who is retained as a team of three with a private employer) goes every three years (on rota with collegaues) for a month for education into new treatments/reseacrh etc.

As someone who works in research in allied medicine, I'd just like to comment that perhaps the reason why some research in America is exceptionally good is because they have lots of money for it. The rich can afford to pay for the best ergo, they get the best research money can buy for what they suffer from. The diseases of the rich; eg, cardiovascular disease, hypertension, bowel cancer, etc have more money thrown at them than the real causes of death in the world (malaria, dengue fever, TB).

The danger I find when people go private is to demand a diagnosis even though the doctors can't find one. Although, with the NHS, there is a lot of missed diagnosis because the doctors are so busy. I would like the NHS to be able to employ more front line staff capable of screening people so the best doctors can spend the maximum amount of time doing what they do best, take a best educated guess at what's wrong with the patient based on symptoms.

JoolzS

bendix wrote: »

Did I read somewhere that the NHS is the third largest employer in the world, after the Chinese army and the Indian state rail system?

I can think of no more damning indictment than that.

If what you read is true, then I think that is fantastic. The NHS is one of those things that makes this country great (even though I hate many, many things about this country). I'm also fairly sure that the statistic you read is untrue.

Julie

Generali

JoolzS wrote: »

If what you read is true, then I think that is fantastic. The NHS is one of those things that makes this country great (even though I hate many, many things about this country). I'm also fairly sure that the statistic you read is untrue.

Julie

Nope, it's true:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/health/article1050197.ece

ENGLAND may once have been a nation of shopkeepers, but it is becoming a country of healthcare workers, with one in every twenty-three of the working population being employed by the NHS. Almost 1.3 million people — or the combined populations of Birmingham and Coventry — work for the NHS, which is one of the world’s biggest employers.

Since 1997, the number of NHS staff has risen by nearly 230,000, with a record 59,000 people — enough to fill Old Trafford football stadium — joining last year alone.

According to the latest workforce census, the NHS employs 386,400 nurses — matching the entire population of Edinburgh — 109,000 doctors and 122,100 scientists and other therapists.

An extra 18,800 nurses were employed in 2003, up 5.1 per cent on the previous year, and there were 5,600 more doctors — an increase of 5.5 per cent. Although the number of managers rose by a relatively modest 3,000, this amounted to a 9.4 per cent increase in a year — almost double the growth rate in nurses’ numbers.