Unions protest because contractors are using foreign workers at power station.

luvpump

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/economics/article5546863.ece

paulmx3

i work in a factory where probably 90%+ of new employees are not from the UK and from the first hand experience i get although this may not be typical of all,where i work it involves the majority of the immigrant workers.

firstly i see it is not a level playing field,many people in the uk have grown up content to live,work,have a family in the area they where born,many have families which they choose not to uproot at 5 minutes notice having been offered a minimum wage job at the other side of the country.

many will say they should get up off the backsides and better themselves to earn more and get a better job,for many this is just not possible.

immigrant workers do not have any such constraints as family and friends,they come from another country and it is irrelivant where they work so can easily go where the work is.

it is also my experience that they do not have the same financial ties as many uk workers do.they live many to a property thus very low rental costs,many do not contribute to council tax,car tax,car insurance,indeed a large proportion i work with do not even have a license yet somehow manage to drive themselves to work each day,i must stress i am not saying this is typical with all immigrant workers,but it is typical of the ones i work with.

this country is in tough times,it is going to get worse,there comes a time when we really do have to think about ourselves first,many factory workers who lose a job now will not find another,many agencies now only take on migrant workers,indeed the temp agency my firm uses has no british temps.

wether it sounds harsh or not the influx must be stopped at least until there is light at the end of the tunnel.

ultra10

Cleaver wrote: »

No, you don't come across as racist.

The British worker has to compete by being better at the job. Mewbie has put this better than me before so check his old posts, but the world is now one playing field. There are no 'british workers', there are 'workers'. Sure, there are still permits, certain difficulties moving between certain countries etc. but these will become less and less. So the playing field is level in the way that a company has a job and needs to find a balance between paying the lowest wage they can whilst getting the most experienced and educated person they can for that wage.

I wasn't aware that "British Workers" from say Easter European Countires were a differant "Race" ..
Anyway, a little anecdote, I went for a Jar with a Uni pal from the mid 90's a few weeks back, he was a right on "Socialist" back then as I guess most of us were, or at least thought we were ..:)
The Firm he was employed at did some serious job cutting last Autumn, he was one to be shed, & to hear him have a little rant about Migrant workers caused an ironic smile .. . If you had to re-apply for your job and were replaced by a foreign national doing the job, cheaper, perhaps better & was younger, would you be so pro "Open door" Migration Policy ?? ..... Nah, didn't think so & neither would other posters on this thread, whatever they may tell you

Cleaver

paulmx3 wrote: »

i work in a factory where probably 90%+ of new employees are not from the UK and from the first hand experience i get although this may not be typical of all,where i work it involves the majority of the immigrant workers.

firstly i see it is not a level playing field,many people in the uk have grown up content to live,work,have a family in the area they where born,many have families which they choose not to uproot at 5 minutes notice having been offered a minimum wage job at the other side of the country.

many will say they should get up off the backsides and better themselves to earn more and get a better job,for many this is just not possible.

immigrant workers do not have any such constraints as family and friends,they come from another country and it is irrelivant where they work so can easily go where the work is.

Are you suggesting only British people have families and friends? I'd argue that it's far more difficult to uproot from, say, Poland to come and work here than it is for me to move 100 miles across my own country.

paulmx3 wrote: »

it is also my experience that they do not have the same financial ties as many uk workers do.they live many to a property thus very low rental costs,many do not contribute to council tax,car tax,car insurance,indeed a large proportion i work with do not even have a license yet somehow manage to drive themselves to work each day,i must stress i am not saying this is typical with all immigrant workers,but it is typical of the ones i work with.

British people can do all of the above. I wouldn't recommend it though...

paulmx3 wrote: »

this country is in tough times,it is going to get worse,there comes a time when we really do have to think about ourselves first,many factory workers who lose a job now will not find another,many agencies now only take on migrant workers,indeed the temp agency my firm uses has no british temps.

wether it sounds harsh or not the influx must be stopped at least until there is light at the end of the tunnel.

I can sympathise with what you are saying. Just out of interest, why do you think 90% of the jobs at your place are being done by people born in other countries?

Cleaver

ultra10 wrote: »

I wasn't aware that "British Workers" from say Easter European Countires were a differant "Race" ..
Anyway, a little anecdote, I went for a Jar with a Uni pal from the mid 90's a few weeks back, he was a right on "Socialist" back then as I guess most of us were, or at least thought we were ..:)
The Firm he was employed at did some serious job cutting last Autumn, he was one to be shed, & to hear him have a little rant about Migrant workers caused an ironic smile .. . If you had to re-apply for your job and were replaced by a foreign national doing the job, cheaper, perhaps better & was younger, would you be so pro "Open door" Migration Policy ?? ..... Nah, didn't think so & neither would other posters on this thread, whatever they may tell you

It's not a question of whether I'd be happy or not, I'm just arguing that it's the way the world is heading.

To be honest though, if I applied for a job here in the UK and was unsuccessful because someone from outside the UK got the job who was better qualified and experienced I would say well done to them. In fact I'm sure that's happened on more than one occassion before.

omelette451

The law is perfectly clear, and imo is perfectly justified. We live in a global society, and laws of freedom of movement within the EU have brought many benefits to all member states throughout the years. Like it or not, Britain's success is dependent on the success of the EU; integration and co-operation are the key to success for the entire continent. As for the situation at the power station, Polish and Spanish staff are perfectly entitled to take up jobs, just as I am entitled to work, travel or study in Poland or Spain - it's quid pro quo to the letter. Instead of ranting and complaining, the staff who consider themselves 'affected' should consider the real reasons foreign staff are being employed: it's nothing to do with lower wages (they're presumably paid the same as British nationals doing the same job) or agreeing to be slaves (employment law and conditions apply equally to everyone), it's because they're willing to be flexible and mobile in order to find the best job they can. Many Poles are returning 'home' because they reckon life there is better now than here, but we don't hear of many British joining them... As a nation we have got too complacent and stuck in our ways, and rather than blaming immigrants for everything we should be more imaginitive in adapting ourselves to changing circumstances.

As for the OP, why does the union think it has the right to be xenophobic and racist in that way? I thought the union's job was to represent the whole workforce, but it's not doing a very good job if it's criticising half of it and saying it has no right to be there. The same unions initially tried to fight against women being allowed into the workforce - look where that got them! IMO the union should be forced to adopt the TUC policy of solidarity across the whole shop-floor staff.

Cleaver

What a great post Omelette.

leveller2911

Cleaver wrote: »

It's not a question of whether I'd be happy or not, I'm just arguing that it's the way the world is heading.

To be honest though, if I applied for a job here in the UK and was unsuccessful because someone from outside the UK got the job who was better qualified and experienced I would say well done to them. In fact I'm sure that's happened on more than one occassion before.

I understand that, If a worker from abroad is better qualified and has more experience (although if we all did that who would give you a job to get the experience?)then good luck to them............BUT you can't pick and choose parts of an argument and ignore the parts you don't like, If we cannot compete financially then how is it morally right??????

JasonLVC

Many industries today hire in staff, be they locals or immigrants.

Why?.

A fully employed person has rights of employment, discipline procedures, pensions, sick pay and are hard to get rid of if they're no good.

A temporary worker comes with none of those extra costs or burdens and therefore cheaper.

Jaguar in the last 6 monhs has got rid of some 800 temporary and casual workers as it costs them nothing to do, whereas the remaining workforce will require redundancy packages and pay-offs.

I'm not saying it is right, big business IS greedy, but the laternative for the energy producer in this case is it costs twice as much to build which will be reflected in OUR energy bills being twice as expensive.

mewbie_2

The argument seems to be British jobs for British workers. Sounds nice. But companies can choose who they employ and more importantly where they are based. So if they cannot employ cheap labour here, they will move abroad.

There are some areas that can't move abroad such as farms. Who employ foreign workers to pick beans, whatever. I don't think there would be a queue for those jobs if no foreigners allowed. So would they have to pay more? Which would put up the price of our food. Which we would then buy from abroad.

Either we have global market economy, or some form of isolated and protected socialism? Can't have it both ways.