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Las Vegas thread and MSE guide 2009
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Ti is the one decently graded hotel Strip hotel I wouldn't consider staying in after rubbish service in their casino and being asked by a member of staff "Do you expect me to wander around the casino looking for someone to help you ?" My reply (we'd been promised help by two people previously and got forgotten abouts o this was 45 mins after the problem occurred-a jammed ticket-hardly rocket science) "Well yes actually I do-I'm the customer and I'd like some service please". I'm never that snotty usually btw
but it worked ! Needless to say we left and blew our money somewhere that was nice to usi as we emptied the bank balance instead !
I'll take the Encore pleaseI Would Rather Climb A Mountain Than Crawl Into A Hole
MSE Florida wedding .....no problem0 -
The Secret GardenOK here's my Trip Report for the first part of our holiday
Travelled up to Gatwick via train the day before the flight
Stayed in the Oakhurst guest house....brilliant service...free pick ups and excellent breakfast so if anyone wants details let me know.
Anyone wanting a TR on gambling.....forget it....we dont gamble we go to Vegas for the sun and the sights....so here we go
Day 1
Well got here after a pretty uneventful but never ending flight.
Backseat entertainment was fine as was the service throughout the flight....I really dont know what people find to moan about Virgin.
Immigration took about 20 mins....our bags were on the carousel so we were quickly outside and into a cab....Taxi fare came to $16.40 to the Imperial Palace
No one was waiting at check in so again it was smooth sailing for us,we'd made our reservation through a casino host and fair play Bob did us proud with a lovely poolside room on the 8th floor.
We dumped our bags freshened up a bit and went back down to the bar for a long awaited drink....ooooops no draught at the bar ...never mind we settled for a couple of bottles of Miller instead.
After a few more we wandered down to the little supermarket in the avenue of shops and stocked up on some water and mixers to go with those 2x1l bottles of Absolute Vodka I'd bought on the plane.
Then it was back up to the room for 40 winks before hitting the strip.
Well the 40 winks turned into no winks for me so I read my book while Alan snored his head off next to me.....I'm useless after long haul takes be days to get into a proper eating/sleeping pattern.
Then we freashened up,changed and went downstairs....neither of us was particularly hungry so we just had a burger and fries to keep us going.I was still pretty tired having not slept much the night before and not at all on the plane or up in the room so we decided we wouldn't walk far.
Stopped off for one in O'Sheas had a little walk around the Flamingo gardens then just caught the end of Fat Elvis in Bills.Beer was only $2 on the spin the wheel offer so we settled in the lounge bar for a few.
karaoke was just starting up and that guy Igor who was on America.s Got Talent was there.
We had a few more and were joined by a nice couple from Texas.Stayed for a couple more then went over to Carnival court to watch the Crashers had a few more beers then decided enough was enough so we finished off the night back in our room and then it was off to bed.
Day 2
Started off the day with a IP special breakfast from the Burger place as neither of us could be arsed to go far....was ok but don't think we'll have another.
Went for a little walk up to the Venecian then came back to spend the morning by the pool.
who ever said it was going to be in the 80's temp wise was seriously mistaken ...today was 97....I love the sun and all I could stand was 3 hours tops my god it was hot...so we returned to our room to freshen up a little and then went for a walk to see some sights and take a few pics and do a little shopping.
called in O'sheas on the way back for a well earned drink then back to the room to dump our purchases.
By now it was 3.30pm and time to make our way to Bills for the forum meet.We were a bit early and the lounge was full with Big Elvis being on...
walked round for a bit then spotted Rich (Funkyfin)and Claire....introduced ourselves and then set out to look for the others..
Spotted pebblesmax(Elaine) as we had a meet in Benidorm earlier in the year and then Luci arrived.we all started chatting and then Luci had to go as she had to get ready for Cher that evening the rest of us then made our way over to the sports bar lounge for Big Elvis's next set.....got seats in the front....not a huge Elvis fan myself but the guy does have a good voice and he was entertaining enough I suppose
stayed till the end of his set then we all said our goodbyes
We went back to the hotel for a little siesta.
We decided to do a few lounge bars later on but made our way to the Venician to Noodle Asia....as I fancied Chinese
Al had Dim Sum and I had Mu Shu.....it was ok but nothing special....
there seemed like a good group on in the lounge bar so we stayed there for a few drinks then moved on to the Mirage.
Had a couple more drinks in the lounge at the Mirage then made our way to Harrah's.
Piano bar was full but had one there and then went to Carnival court to watch the Crashers again....
I never get tired of this band I think they are brill.Stayed for a pitcher or 2 by now I'm starting to feel it so we decided to call it a night and went back to the IP for a nightcap around 1am
Day 3
Up early today...6.30am...Al couldn't sleep and he's about as quiet as a warthog so got some of my TR done before heading up to the Fashion show mall.Plan was to get a show for the evening from the Tix booth....really dissapointed as we wanted either La Reve(they only had splash zone)Chris Angel (marked up unavailable on the board) or Carrot Top which for some reason had closed across it....didn't fancy anything else so we left it
went up to the food hall for a spot of brekkie then we hit the shops.Finished shopping around lunchtime so we called into TI for a couple of beers.By now it's steaming hot so wemade our way back to the IP to dump our shopping.....freshened up a bit so went down to the casino floor to watch the dealertainers singing then on to O'sheas for a couple of drinks.
TV was on and the weather girl said it was 98 degrees outside....sod that for a game of soldiers so it's back to the IP and a dip in the pool.
we could only stick it for about 2 hours it was mega hot......spent most of that time in the pool....Al and I love to spend time lounging around the pool but even for us it was way to hot.....back to the room for a siesta me thinks.
After a wee kip we showered and changed and made our way to Ellis Island for our evening meal....god that place is cheap $2.50 for a vodka and coke and $1.50 for a large glass of beer.
we both had the rib eye steak special just $6.99 brilliant price and it was really nice. the whole bill came to just over $20 with drinks.
went into Bills for one on the way back and then on to O'Sheas to watch the band there Greedy Gretchen...they were ok so we stayed for one set then off to the Carnival Court to watch the Crashers again...when they finished around 12.30am we moved to the Piano bar stayed for about half an hour then went back to our room for a nightcap.
Day 4
He's done it again.....woken me up at 6.45am ....why can't men be quiet for gods sake.....I've had about 4 hours sleep and I'm ratty as hell.
So it's off to breakfast we go then down to O'Sheas to the Tix place to look for an afternoon show...plumped for Mac King at Harrah's then it's back to the pool to chill for a bit.Got our lunch poolside then it was up to the room to freshen up before the show.
I must admit I didn't think we were going to like it at first but he turned out to be both clever and funny....I would certainly recommend this show to anyone....great value for money
decided to go for a little siesta after as we'd been up so bloody early thanks to someone we know
ok where to go for evening meal???? we wandered over to the forum shops and ended up in Planet Hollywood....well may as well use those $5 off coupons.....I had the salmon and Al had a steak....then we shared an icecream sundae....well I ate most of it.
Called into O'sheas and watched the band there for a drink or two then wandered into Jimmy Buffets Margaritaville for a bit of a dance then down to Bills again to watch the band in the lounge there....so cheap to drink there we stayed for the rest of the night
Day 5
Our last day at this end of the strip.......Oh Joy!!!!!A lie in this morning till 7am....he's spoiling me.Denny's for breakfast....we were told it was an hour wait to be seated buggared if I'm waiting that long so made a huge mistake and went to Mc d's for brekkie...it was disgusting and I threw most of it in the bin....Al has a cast iron stomach so he ate all his.
Then down to Bills to get show tickets......Plumped for Love as it was the only Cirque show on the list waited an hour to get served for our tickets but at least it's in the shade there unlike the one by the M&M store or the Fashion Show Mall.
then it was off to Mirage to exchange our Tix tickets for show tickets.....got K section row 7 seat 8 and 9 which we were told by the guy in the box office were good seats.Had a drink at the bar seing as we were walking past....you know....as you do....then back to the IP to go online and check on the girls at home.....picked up lunch from Subway on the way back to take to the pool with us
Off to the pool for the last time at the IP for us....stuck it in the sweltering 98 degree temp for all of 2 hours....I'm a pool person usually but not at these temperatures....so bumbled over to carnival court for a well earned jug of beer for 2 and a bit of a dance.....well why not we are on holiday and the poolside DJ at the IP was playing rap which we both hate with a passion.
Then it was back to the room for a wee siesta......which turned out to be a bit longer than planned but left us just enough time to get ready for dinner.....we opted for Flavours Buffet at Harrahs as we has coupons and suprisingly the line wasn't to long so we were all finished and suitably stuffed by 8.30pm plenty of time to get over to Mirage....
had a little wander round Harrahs for a bit then over to the Mirage to see Love.There was a fair sized queue by the time we got there and it was only 9.00pm but we were seated by 9.15pm and really pleased with our seats as they were right next to one of the walkways the performers use to enter the stage....
OMG!!!! what a show....I thought it would be good but it was absolutely amazing....worth every penny...
Off to Bill's for a few drinky poos next and watch the band there then into O'Sheas to watch a bit of Greedy Gretchen and finished off the night at Carnival Court.....got in about 3am absolutely knackered.
DAY 5
Moving day and Al excelled himself once again by getting me up at 8am after less than 5 hours sleep....at this rate I'm going to need a week off just to catch up on my sleeep.
Packed all our stuff and left it in the room while we went for breakfast.....Bill's Victorian Cafe....thank god for money off coupons..... then after breakfast back to the IP to check out ....taxi over to MGM was reasonable ....only $7.20.....Checked in at MGM but room not available yet we had a 40 min wait so had a drink at the crazy horse bar.
Rang on house phone to check our room number and we were on 18th floor room 427.....lovely room with 2 queen beds and a sort of strip view could see Mandalay Bay,Excalibur and Tropicana...
Hotel is not bad but it's mega huge and one hell of a trek to the pool......stopped at the farmers market on the way back for a bite to eat...It's taken us the best part of the morning to get our bearings
decided to take a walk up to Tix4tonight to see what they had up on the board......yet again no Cirque shows....had a drink in the Hawiian market then back to the hotel for a siesta..
I think this hotel is far noisier than the IP they had a dj on poolside right below us in the IP and yet when you shut the balcony door you couldn't hear a thing....we could hear every plane taking off from our room in the MGM and we could hear our neighbours through the walls,plus the windows were filthy so you couldn't rally take clear pics from the window....anyway siesta interupted by planes taking off.....suppose thats the drawback of having a room facing the airport......thanks a lot...MGM....so much for me saying it's our first time here could we have a nice strip view room...
No I didn't do the $20 trick as I didn't want a west wing room and I thought that's what i would get if I tried it,there you go.....we are here now so we'll just try and make the best of it but so far Al's not impressed and I'm beginning to regret not booking the Excalibur or the Luxor....
Anyway time to catch up on writing my TR...not done it for a few days and I'll forget bits if I dont do it soon.....
ok where to go for dinner.....neither of us particularly hungry so we op to go to the food hall near the M&M shop..We plumped for Panda Express....cant go wrong and brill value for money....off to Planet Hollywood now and a walk round the Miracle mile....well not all the way round as my feet are killing me....so it's off down to the Hawiian Marketplace for a drink and to watch the karaoke for a bit
then we moved onto NY NY and watched the Irish Band in Nine 5 Irishmen.and had a couple of drinks...then it's off to the Excalibur...got given VIP passes for Coyote Ugly...place was heaving and the queue at the bar was about 4 deep......so we moved on to Dicks....love this place and the band are really good......there was a group of gay lads in there dancing with some girls on a hen party......they were hilarious....very entertaining boys whoever they were...
Stayed for a couple of hours then made our way back to the MGM and off to beddy byes..
More to follow in a couple of days:hello: LORRAINE :hello:0 -
The Bellagio FountainsLorraine great trip report!!! Keep it coming, will post all ours later when we get back!
xx0 -
The Bellagio FountainsThanks for the trip report Lorraine! Too bad you got a duff room at the MGM. We also had a room facing the airport, but never heard a thing and hubby is a light sleeper.0
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The Bellagio FountainsReally enjoying the TR Lorraine - looking forward to the next installment!
I think the seats you had for Love were very similar to the ones we had last time and agree they were great....really glad you enjoyed it - I liked it SO much more than when we saw it from the front row.Does remembering a time that a certain degree of personal responsibility was more or less standard means that I am officially old?0 -
The Bellagio FountainsLove the trip report Lorraine. Looking forward to more.
Shame you didn't like MGM. I've only stayed once in a celeb spa room. It was a bit dark and drab, but would still stay there again at the right price.
Not tried IP, Luxor or Excalibur.......Love MSE, Las Vegas and chocolate!0 -
The Bellagio FountainsPosted by tangobunny
"
Well got here after a pretty uneventful but never ending flight.
Backseat entertainment was fine as was the service throughout the flight....I really dont know what people find to moan about Virgin.
Immigration took about 20 mins....our bags were on the carousel so we were quickly outside and into a cab....Taxi fare came to $16.40 to the Imperial Palace
No one was waiting at check in so again it was smooth sailing for us,we'd made our reservation through a casino host and fair play Bob did us proud with a lovely poolside room on the 8th floor.
We dumped our bags freshened up a bit and went back down to the bar for a long awaited drink....ooooops no draught at the bar ...never mind we settled for a couple of bottles of Miller instead.
After a few more we wandered down to the little supermarket in the avenue of shops and stocked up on some water and mixers to go with those 2x1l bottles of Absolute Vodka I'd bought on the plane.
Then it was back up to the room for 40 winks before hitting the strip.
Well the 40 winks turned into no winks for me so I read my book while Alan snored his head off next to me.....I'm useless after long haul takes be days to get into a proper eating/sleeping pattern.
Then we freashened up,changed and went downstairs....neither of us was particularly hungry so we just had a burger and fries to keep us going.I was still pretty tired having not slept much the night before and not at all on the plane or up in the room so we decided we wouldn't walk far.
Stopped off for one in O'Sheas had a little walk around the Flamingo gardens then just caught the end of Fat Elvis in Bills.Beer was only $2 on the spin the wheel offer so we settled in the lounge bar for a few.
karaoke was just starting up and that guy Igor who was on America.s Got Talent was there.
We had a few more and were joined by a nice couple from Texas.Stayed for a couple more then went over to Carnival court to watch the Crashers had a few more beers then decided enough was enough so we finished off the night back in our room and then it was off to bed.
Day 2
Started off the day with a IP special breakfast from the Burger place as neither of us could be arsed to go far....was ok but don't think we'll have another.
Went for a little walk up to the Venecian then came back to spend the morning by the pool.
who ever said it was going to be in the 80's temp wise was seriously mistaken ...today was 97....I love the sun and all I could stand was 3 hours tops my god it was hot...so we returned to our room to freshen up a little and then went for a walk to see some sights and take a few pics and do a little shopping.
called in O'sheas on the way back for a well earned drink then back to the room to dump our purchases.
By now it was 3.30pm and time to make our way to Bills for the forum meet.We were a bit early and the lounge was full with Big Elvis being on...
walked round for a bit then spotted Rich (Funkyfin)and Claire....introduced ourselves and then set out to look for the others..
Spotted pebblesmax(Elaine) as we had a meet in Benidorm earlier in the year and then Luci arrived.we all started chatting and then Luci had to go as she had to get ready for Cher that evening the rest of us then made our way over to the sports bar lounge for Big Elvis's next set.....got seats in the front....not a huge Elvis fan myself but the guy does have a good voice and he was entertaining enough I suppose
stayed till the end of his set then we all said our goodbyes
We went back to the hotel for a little siesta.
We decided to do a few lounge bars later on but made our way to the Venician to Noodle Asia....as I fancied Chinese
Al had Dim Sum and I had Mu Shu.....it was ok but nothing special....
there seemed like a good group on in the lounge bar so we stayed there for a few drinks then moved on to the Mirage.
Had a couple more drinks in the lounge at the Mirage then made our way to Harrah's.
Piano bar was full but had one there and then went to Carnival court to watch the Crashers again....
I never get tired of this band I think they are brill.Stayed for a pitcher or 2 by now I'm starting to feel it so we decided to call it a night and went back to the IP for a nightcap around 1am
Day 3
Up early today...6.30am...Al couldn't sleep and he's about as quiet as a warthog so got some of my TR done before heading up to the Fashion show mall.Plan was to get a show for the evening from the Tix booth....really dissapointed as we wanted either La Reve(they only had splash zone)Chris Angel (marked up unavailable on the board) or Carrot Top which for some reason had closed across it....didn't fancy anything else so we left it
went up to the food hall for a spot of brekkie then we hit the shops.Finished shopping around lunchtime so we called into TI for a couple of beers.By now it's steaming hot so wemade our way back to the IP to dump our shopping.....freshened up a bit so went down to the casino floor to watch the dealertainers singing then on to O'sheas for a couple of drinks.
TV was on and the weather girl said it was 98 degrees outside....sod that for a game of soldiers so it's back to the IP and a dip in the pool.
we could only stick it for about 2 hours it was mega hot......spent most of that time in the pool....Al and I love to spend time lounging around the pool but even for us it was way to hot.....back to the room for a siesta me thinks.
After a wee kip we showered and changed and made our way to Ellis Island for our evening meal....god that place is cheap $2.50 for a vodka and coke and $1.50 for a large glass of beer.
we both had the rib eye steak special just $6.99 brilliant price and it was really nice. the whole bill came to just over $20 with drinks.
went into Bills for one on the way back and then on to O'Sheas to watch the band there Greedy Gretchen...they were ok so we stayed for one set then off to the Carnival Court to watch the Crashers again...when they finished around 12.30am we moved to the Piano bar stayed for about half an hour then went back to our room for a nightcap.
Day 4
He's done it again.....woken me up at 6.45am ....why can't men be quiet for gods sake.....I've had about 4 hours sleep and I'm ratty as hell.
So it's off to breakfast we go then down to O'Sheas to the Tix place to look for an afternoon show...plumped for Mac King at Harrah's then it's back to the pool to chill for a bit.Got our lunch poolside then it was up to the room to freshen up before the show.
I must admit I didn't think we were going to like it at first but he turned out to be both clever and funny....I would certainly recommend this show to anyone....great value for money
decided to go for a little siesta after as we'd been up so bloody early thanks to someone we know
ok where to go for evening meal???? we wandered over to the forum shops and ended up in Planet Hollywood....well may as well use those $5 off coupons.....I had the salmon and Al had a steak....then we shared an icecream sundae....well I ate most of it.
Called into O'sheas and watched the band there for a drink or two then wandered into Jimmy Buffets Margaritaville for a bit of a dance then down to Bills again to watch the band in the lounge there....so cheap to drink there we stayed for the rest of the night
Day 5
Our last day at this end of the strip.......Oh Joy!!!!!A lie in this morning till 7am....he's spoiling me.Denny's for breakfast....we were told it was an hour wait to be seated buggared if I'm waiting that long so made a huge mistake and went to Mc d's for brekkie...it was disgusting and I threw most of it in the bin....Al has a cast iron stomach so he ate all his.
Then down to Bills to get show tickets......Plumped for Love as it was the only Cirque show on the list waited an hour to get served for our tickets but at least it's in the shade there unlike the one by the M&M store or the Fashion Show Mall.
then it was off to Mirage to exchange our Tix tickets for show tickets.....got K section row 7 seat 8 and 9 which we were told by the guy in the box office were good seats.Had a drink at the bar seing as we were walking past....you know....as you do....then back to the IP to go online and check on the girls at home.....picked up lunch from Subway on the way back to take to the pool with us
Off to the pool for the last time at the IP for us....stuck it in the sweltering 98 degree temp for all of 2 hours....I'm a pool person usually but not at these temperatures....so bumbled over to carnival court for a well earned jug of beer for 2 and a bit of a dance.....well why not we are on holiday and the poolside DJ at the IP was playing rap which we both hate with a passion.
Then it was back to the room for a wee siesta......which turned out to be a bit longer than planned but left us just enough time to get ready for dinner.....we opted for Flavours Buffet at Harrahs as we has coupons and suprisingly the line wasn't to long so we were all finished and suitably stuffed by 8.30pm plenty of time to get over to Mirage....
had a little wander round Harrahs for a bit then over to the Mirage to see Love.There was a fair sized queue by the time we got there and it was only 9.00pm but we were seated by 9.15pm and really pleased with our seats as they were right next to one of the walkways the performers use to enter the stage....
OMG!!!! what a show....I thought it would be good but it was absolutely amazing....worth every penny...
Off to Bill's for a few drinky poos next and watch the band there then into O'Sheas to watch a bit of Greedy Gretchen and finished off the night at Carnival Court.....got in about 3am absolutely knackered.
DAY 5
Moving day and Al excelled himself once again by getting me up at 8am after less than 5 hours sleep....at this rate I'm going to need a week off just to catch up on my sleeep.
Packed all our stuff and left it in the room while we went for breakfast.....Bill's Victorian Cafe....thank god for money off coupons..... then after breakfast back to the IP to check out ....taxi over to MGM was reasonable ....only $7.20.....Checked in at MGM but room not available yet we had a 40 min wait so had a drink at the crazy horse bar.
Rang on house phone to check our room number and we were on 18th floor room 427.....lovely room with 2 queen beds and a sort of strip view could see Mandalay Bay,Excalibur and Tropicana...
Hotel is not bad but it's mega huge and one hell of a trek to the pool......stopped at the farmers market on the way back for a bite to eat...It's taken us the best part of the morning to get our bearings
decided to take a walk up to Tix4tonight to see what they had up on the board......yet again no Cirque shows....had a drink in the Hawiian market then back to the hotel for a siesta..
I think this hotel is far noisier than the IP they had a dj on poolside right below us in the IP and yet when you shut the balcony door you couldn't hear a thing....we could hear every plane taking off from our room in the MGM and we could hear our neighbours through the walls,plus the windows were filthy so you couldn't rally take clear pics from the window....anyway siesta interupted by planes taking off.....suppose thats the drawback of having a room facing the airport......thanks a lot...MGM....so much for me saying it's our first time here could we have a nice strip view room...
No I didn't do the $20 trick as I didn't want a west wing room and I thought that's what i would get if I tried it,there you go.....we are here now so we'll just try and make the best of it but so far Al's not impressed and I'm beginning to regret not booking the Excalibur or the Luxor....
Anyway time to catch up on writing my TR...not done it for a few days and I'll forget bits if I dont do it soon.....
ok where to go for dinner.....neither of us particularly hungry so we op to go to the food hall near the M&M shop..We plumped for Panda Express....cant go wrong and brill value for money....off to Planet Hollywood now and a walk round the Miracle mile....well not all the way round as my feet are killing me....so it's off down to the Hawiian Marketplace for a drink and to watch the karaoke for a bit
then we moved onto NY NY and watched the Irish Band in Nine 5 Irishmen.and had a couple of drinks...then it's off to the Excalibur...got given VIP passes for Coyote Ugly...place was heaving and the queue at the bar was about 4 deep......so we moved on to Dicks....love this place and the band are really good......there was a group of gay lads in there dancing with some girls on a hen party......they were hilarious....very entertaining boys whoever they were...
Stayed for a couple of hours then made our way back to the MGM and off to beddy byes.."
So, you like a drink then :rotfl:
Sounds like my type of trip, but I doubt I could keep up!The common law of business balance prohibits paying a little and getting a lot. If you deal with the lowest bidder, it is well to add something for the risk you run, and if you do that you will have enough to pay for something better.0 -
The Bellagio Fountainsin las vegas for last leg of honeymoon in mid June :beer:
Been looking at grandcanyon trips on the internet and was wondering if it tends to be cheaper to book in advance on the net or wait until we are out there. Would there be 2for 1 deals or just the typicak X% off that we would have got on the net?
for a south rim airplane and bus tour about 7-8hrs looking at $240 incl fees (papillion)
or just airplane into the west rim $120 each incl fees (3.5hrs).
With another company can do airplane to north rim and abit of time on a ranch for $220
Thanks
John0 -
The Bellagio Fountainsin las vegas for last leg of honeymoon in mid June :beer:
Been looking at grandcanyon trips on the internet and was wondering if it tends to be cheaper to book in advance on the net or wait until we are out there. Would there be 2for 1 deals or just the typicak X% off that we would have got on the net?
for a south rim airplane and bus tour about 7-8hrs looking at $240 incl fees (papillion)
or just airplane into the west rim $120 each incl fees (3.5hrs).
With another company can do airplane to north rim and abit of time on a ranch for $220
Thanks
John
Ok I am prepared to be shot down in flames / abused / shouted at for daring to post this....... but have you considered a coach trip to the Grand Canyon ?
That way you get to stop at places, and stand on the edge. :eek:
Of course the afficianadoes on here will say its not the real Grand Canyon, its owned by Indians and its commercial, blah blah... we liked it !
We prefered it.0 -
The Bellagio FountainsOk I am prepared to be shot down in flames / abused / shouted at for daring to post this....... but have you considered a coach trip to the Grand Canyon ?
That way you get to stop at places, and stand on the edge. :eek:
Of course the afficianadoes on here will say its not the real Grand Canyon, its owned by Indians and its commercial, blah blah... we liked it !
We prefered it.
You can take a coach trip to the 'real' South Rim as well...it's an all-day affair though.Does remembering a time that a certain degree of personal responsibility was more or less standard means that I am officially old?0
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