Virgin Trains are bunch of con artists IMHO. Be warned!

thescouselander

Yes

robt wrote: »

The analogy does not work. Whether the terms are restrictive or not is irrelevant to the analogy.

I'm sorry, it does work:

You say anyone can buy a ticket without ID for a train - the same is true for a plane - it goes something like this:

1) Book the ticket on line using a credit card
2) Arrive at airport and insert ANY Credit/Bank Card or Airmiles card
3) Insert booking reference
4) Ticket pops out of the machine

Its only when you get to the security checkpoints that you need to produce ID (or maybe if you are dropping off luggage). In any case, you can get your ticket without ID (except for the cards mentioned previously)

Virgin Atlantic operate this system so why can virgin trains? The ticket system for Eurostar works in a very similar way to the airlines too.


Ok, so Virgin Trains operated in accordance with their policy but I think it is difficult to deny that their system for collecting tickets is extremely inflexible - anything could happen to your card, it could get lost, eaten by a cash machine, forgotten, stolen etc etc.

Also, despite the OP phoning in good time Virgin Trains insisted enforcing their policy to the letter and provided no assistance and some poor advice in telling the OP to try and sort it out at the station.

Whether the terms of the agreement are enforceable or not they behaved in extremely bad faith - this poor business practice IMHO and shows Virgin Trains up as being a bit of a cowboy outfit. It appears (from other posts) it was within their power to sort something out regarding collection of the original tickets but they chose not to help.


As for the terms and conditions, it is not legal for a company to impose just any terms they like - and with good reason. I sincerely hope the OP takes this all the way and challenges it in court.

pinkshoes

omelette451 wrote: »

However, a great many people who work in the public eye say that they are willing to 'go the extra mile' or bend a rule only for those people who are nice, friendly, and polite rather than angry or stressed

I think the issue here is the rule itself, which is completely over the top, unnecessary, and doesn't have any logic behind it other than to catch people out and rip them off.

This is supposed to be our public transport service, and they treat their customers like sh*t!

By all means punish someone who hasn't bought a ticket and is trying to travel for free, but for those who have made a mistake by forgetting a credit card, yet can still easily prove their identification, it is ludicrous to make them buy another full price ticket.

No wonder our roads are so clogged with cars if this is the treatment you get on public transport!

omelette451

thescouselander wrote: »

I'm sorry, it does work:

You say anyone can buy a ticket without ID for a train - the same is true for a plane - it goes something like this:

Perhaps so usually but not for British Airways, which does require the original card to be presented at the airport.

thescouselander

Yes

omelette451 wrote: »

Perhaps so usually but not for British Airways, which does require the original card to be presented at the airport.

Not so, I am a regular flyer on BA. My work books the ticket in my name using a corporate card that I do not have access to. All I have to do it to insert one of my own cards and the booking reference and the ticket comes out.

Obviously I can't do this on the trains which is why I have a problem with this ridiculous policy.

omelette451

thescouselander wrote: »

Not so, I am a regular flyer on BA. My work books the ticket in my name using a corporate card that I do not have access to. All I have to do it to insert one of my own cards and the booking reference and the ticket comes out.

Oh that's strange... I've always had to use the same card, and once (at a manual counter rather than the machine) I gave the wrong one by mistake and was asked for the right one. Not sure what would have happened if I hadn't had it with me.

thescouselander

Yes

omelette451 wrote: »

Oh that's strange... I've always had to use the same card, and once (at a manual counter rather than the machine) I gave the wrong one by mistake and was asked for the right one. Not sure what would have happened if I hadn't had it with me.

The only time there is a hitch is if the name on the booking isn't exactly as it is on the card. For example, some of my cards have my initials and surname while others spell my name out in full - this sometimes seems to confuse the machine. In any case, it always sorts itself out when you enter the booking reference number.

Welshwoofs

Silent Mule, you are unfortunately wasting your time on this particular section of MSE. I've read a number of threads in this area and I can only describe the good majority of posters to be as much use as tits on a bull frankly. They simply exist to crow at another's misfortune and throw around holier-than-thou statements backing up every illogical, restrictive and customer hostile term and rule out there.

Common sense would dictate that with full identification and the booking reference to hand you could be issued your tickets. Common sense would dictate that using the 'f word' in a general sense wouldn't be jumped upon by some petty-minded little prole behind the ticket desk.

Alas there is very little common sense to be had either in train companies or amongst the benighted posters of this particular forum area.

I wish you good luck in your complaints to VT. I am forced to use them often on the West coast run from Chester to Euston and it's an appalling service and vastly over-priced.

omelette451

Welshwoofs wrote: »

I wish you good luck in your complaints to VT. I am forced to use them often on the West coast run from Chester to Euston and it's an appalling service and vastly over-priced.

(Quietly ignoring the other comments and refusing to get drawn in to petty bickering)
Following privatisation there is no such thing as 'being forced' to use VT, especially on your route. A new route has recently opened via Wrexham, and another on London Midland direct from Crewe to Euston (both with a short Arriva connection to CTR), so if you really hated Virgin you could use alternative service providers. Truth is you probably like at least part of the service (the speed, perhaps?) and therefore choose to travel with them regularly.

Welshwoofs

omelette451 wrote: »

(Quietly ignoring the other comments and refusing to get drawn in to petty bickering)
Following privatisation there is no such thing as 'being forced' to use VT, especially on your route. A new route has recently opened via Wrexham, and another on London Midland direct from Crewe to Euston (both with a short Arriva connection to CTR), so if you really hated Virgin you could use alternative service providers. Truth is you probably like at least part of the service (the speed, perhaps?) and therefore choose to travel with them regularly.

Omlette - if I want to get to my office in Islington by 10am then yes I am pretty much forced into using VT by practicalities. I live in N.Wales on a spur line which has regular trains into Chester not Wrexham. To get to Crewe I'd have to change at Chester and wait. Who on earth would do that when the train they want can be boarded at Chester ?

You've also leapt to the assumption that I hate VT alone. I don't. I don't like any of the major rail companies and for good reason... their service is dire.

For instance I rather stupidly decided to take the train from Prestatyn to Exeter last weekend rather than drive, booking a standard ticket 3 weeks in advance via trainline.com and picking up the tickets on the day at Prestatyn. The tickets showed I had a seat reserved for the first part of the journey on an Arriva train to Birmingham New St but not for some reason on the second leg on a Cross Country train from Brum to Exeter St Davids (Aberdeen to Plymouth train). At Brum I asked why the tickets hadn't arrived with a seat reservation for the Cross Country leg and was told they didn't know and that they couldn't reserve a seat from the terminal they were using but that it "wasn't a problem". The train arrived extremely busy with only seats in First Class so I upgraded for £10 and went in there.

On my return leg on Monday morning I arrived at Exeter St Davids for the 10.24 (Plymouth to Aberdeen) back to Birmingham only to be told that I wasn't allowed on the train as it was busy and I didn't have a seat reservation. When I pointed out that my tickets were booked 3 weeks in advance for a specific journey for which I had seat reservations on the second leg I was met with the vacant expression train staff specialise in these days and was told that there was 'nothing they could do'. When I forced the issue and demanded to know why I wasn't being allowed on a train I was specifically booked on I was told (with a shrug) that "it's Christmas and it's a 4 carriage train". When I asked if I would be allowed aboard the train an hour behind I was told again that it was reserved seats only. Opining that this was 'bloody insane and !!!! poor planning on someone's behalf' I was threatened with the BTP. At which point my Father standing behind me erupted and demanded to know why staff were threatening his daughter. In response we were told to 'try our luck further up the line in case it empties out'.

My Father then pelted up the M5 to Bristol Parkway where the rather more helpful ticket staff were so shocked at the treatment we'd recieved at Exeter that they actually got on the phone to them to talk about it. After confirming that what I'd said was true the chap at Bristol got a complaint form and strongly suggested I use it. At Bristol they allowed me on the platform (which they wouldn't at Exeter) and I got on the train, though having to stand by the doors between First Class and the guard's area at the front. Ten minutes the guard checked my ticket and told me that I may have to get off the train at the next stop (Cheltenham Spa) as I didn't have a seat reservation and he didn't want me standing outside First Class. With a bit of sweet-talking about how hard their job was yadda yadda I was allowed the privilege of continuing to stand to Birmingham.

So no, I have no campaign against VT and I use them to Euston because they are the most convenient. However there is no doubt in my mind that the train service in this country is absolute rubbish and the train companies themselves have no care whatsoever for the customer and are quite content to nurse their profits and deliver a third rate service for as long as they're able to get away with it. They don't give a flying crap about the customer and that is why I get so irrate when I see people on this forum tearing apart people like the OP who have done nothing more than expect the service they've paid for!

real1314

OP

You booked a ticket that required you to have the credit card with you. You lost the card required.
So, so far none of this is anyone else's fault.

What could the contractor have done?

You (and others) say they could have had a back-up system for this type of eventuality. That's very true, but could they devise and implement such a system at nil cost?
I'd suspect not. So your complaint is that they do not have a back up system to cover eventualitites outwith the contract terms, that would require all passengers to pay higher fares to cover the few people that fail to meet the contract terms.
Overall, it's probably cheaper for passengers to have the people who fail to meet the contract terms pay for their error rather than have everyone else pay for it. That's capitalism for you.