Lapland New Forest Scam. How to get money back...

whitewing

Edna, someone has posted your comments now onto mumsnet. (You can view the mumsnet posts via the link in my post 1382).

_________________

Our advice is still to chargeback and register as a creditor (until you get your refund). If you didn't pay by card, still register as a creditor.

Gomer's Guide'll help:

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/...html?t=1412867


If your sec 75 claim has been turned down, contact Consumer Direct/Trading Standards as apparently they have a letter that may help (we haven't seen it).

If you need more assistance, please post here.

EdnaCloud

whitewing wrote: »

Edna, someone has posted your comments now onto mumsnet. (You can view the mumsnet posts via the link in my post 1382).

I just had a look. Doesn't seem to be malicious or harmful. I see it's a few days since the post you mentioned and a long while since the post before that - early Dec? So I wonder if many people are reading that thread, but whoever posted to 'mumsnet' is probably, in fact almost certainly, a lurker here. If you are lurking and are claiming refund or registering as a creditor (or both) please come out of the woodwork and relate your experiences for others.

_________________

Our advice is still to chargeback and register as a creditor (until you get your refund). If you didn't pay by card, still register as a creditor.

Gomer's Guide'll help:

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/...html?t=1412867


If your sec 75 claim has been turned down, contact Consumer Direct/Trading Standards as apparently they have a letter that may help (we haven't seen it).

If you need more assistance, please post here.

Again I second that message from whitewing.
Whitewing, have you read the PMs from earlier?

whitewing

Me again. That mumsnet post got me thinking. Who are the business creditors that were at the Lapland NF liquidation meeting?

I do remember reading that some ticketholders had possibly purchased via agencies, and certainly this post on Baby and Bump on 1st Dec seems to indicate that it the case:

http://www.babyandbump.com/christmas-forum/60499-lapland-new-forest-lapland-west-midlands-reviews-discussion-18.html
Quote. Just a note to assure all of you at Baby and Bump that Woods Travel Ltd. Has no association with the New Forest - Lapland experience. We are in the same position as all of you that have either gone & been very disappointed or who have bought tickets and now want a refund. We have cancelled the future day excursions we were offering to this destination & are in the process of refunding our clients. Good luck to all that have purchased their tickets independantly. End Quote

Presumably those ticketholders got refunded so won't be complaining. But what about the agency? How would they have paid? And would they have registered as creditors. (I am also wondering if The Lapland Experience/Canterbury Travel is a potential creditor for the same reason, and maybe that's where the mumsnet user got confused).

Anyone know how agencies usually pay for block bookings? By cheque? Or card? I am speculating here.

I have given up hoping that anyone aside from Edna and I (and yorksrabbit) will, but we would love it if you did!

Hopefully, you'll all register for chargebacks and as creditors anyway.

Gomer's Guide'll help:

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/...html?t=1412867

EdnaCloud

whitewing wrote: »

Me again. That mumsnet post got me thinking. Who are the business creditors that were at the Lapland NF liquidation meeting?

That is a very good question. As described before I would think it unlikely any company offered credit terms - even if it were a bona fide outfit, having no trading record generally makes it very hard to get credit. However it is possible that some companies did. Now all the traders at the 'fair' had to pay LNF for the pitches, so that probably rules them out. That leaves organisations such as the snow company, those who provided animals, those who provided sheds, lights, toilet etc, and the employment agencies who provided staff. Mr Mears seems to have admitted paying a number of suppliers large amounts of money without receipt (how convenient) and whilst this could be a lie to conceal money I think in practice it may be, to some extent, the truth because I do not think any of the reputable companies providing services would do so on credit. That being said there may be some who provided good/services based on a cash deposit and are therefore out of pocket and now trade creditors.

Another range of creditors may be travel agencies as whitewing suggests. How many arranged trips to this event and effectively acted as ticket agents we do not know. I doubt mr mears would have offered *them* credit facilities, so I expect if any paid on behalf of their customers it would have been by company card or cheque. How much cover is afforded to corporates I do not know, but I do hope there aren't a whole load out there hurting. But any that are could be the business creditors referred to. What a shame we haven't got anyone on this thread who went to the meeting and is willing to share information!

I do remember reading that some ticketholders had possibly purchased via agencies, and certainly this post on Baby and Bump on 1st Dec seems to indicate that it the case:

http://www.babyandbump.com/christmas-forum/60499-lapland-new-forest-lapland-west-midlands-reviews-discussion-18.html
Quote. Just a note to assure all of you at Baby and Bump that Woods Travel Ltd. Has no association with the New Forest - Lapland experience. We are in the same position as all of you that have either gone & been very disappointed or who have bought tickets and now want a refund. We have cancelled the future day excursions we were offering to this destination & are in the process of refunding our clients. Good luck to all that have purchased their tickets independantly. End Quote

Presumably those ticketholders got refunded so won't be complaining. But what about the agency? How would they have paid? And would they have registered as creditors. (I am also wondering if The Lapland Experience/Canterbury Travel is a potential creditor for the same reason, and maybe that's where the mumsnet user got confused).

I cannot find any connection between Canterbury Travel and LNF and I am sure they didn't even offer trips to LNF. so that poster on 'mumsnet' should think again before making accusations that cannot be evidenced.

Anyone know how agencies usually pay for block bookings? By cheque? Or card? I am speculating here.

Major ticket agencies will have credit facilities with the event organisers, but smaller scale travel agencies and the like probably pay the same way we do - but may well have different refund/chargeback rights under the law.

I have given up hoping that anyone aside from Edna and I (and yorksrabbit) will, but we would love it if you did!

It would be good to see some more traffic here. We should not be getting apathetic and letting people get away this sort of thing.

Hopefully, you'll all register for chargebacks and as creditors anyway.

Gomer's Guide'll help:

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/...html?t=1412867

whitewing

Daily Vigil

(A ‘vigil’ is defined as a ‘purposeful watch’)

Please note that the following comments are made to the best of my knowledge from my interpretation of information freely available on the internet from a Google search. I have not posted links as I am hoping to find time to do a proper update on the Refund Guide thread to follow on from Gomer’s post. If I do get a chance, I will post links there. I believe there are lessons that can be learnt from the handling of this situation.

Lapland New Forest

Closed: 4th December 08.

No. days since closure: 83

All ticketholders who have not yet had a refund should register as creditors with Grant Thornton ([EMAIL="Lapland.Liquidation@gtuk.com"]Lapland.Liquidation@gtuk.com[/EMAIL])

All card-paying ticketholders who have not yet had a refund should continue with chargebacks or section 75 claims in addition to registering as creditors. Gomer's Guide'll help:

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/...html?t=1412867

We think you may be running out of time to do a refund via your bank. We will try to clarify that soon.


(Advise Grant Thornton if you receive a refund so your bank becomes the creditor for the amount of your ticket)

All businesses owed money by Lapland New Forest Ltd should register as creditors. It is important that a full picture is built up. If you are worried about confidentiality, at the very least speak to Grant Thornton.

Legal action? The most recent update I can find is from 17th Feb 09. “Trading Standards are continuing to investigate, and this may take some time”.


Lapland West Midlands

Did not open as planned on 6th December 2008: www.laplandwestmidlands.co.uk

No. days since failure to open: 81

All 42 ticketholders refunded in full

Legal action? As of 19th Jan 09, Trading Standards have identified 2 specific offences on the Lapland West Midlands website.” Any more updates anywhere?

We welcome any comments on this thread, and will gladly provide any assistance we can, so please do post here if you have anything to add or ask (however insignificant it may seem).

EdnaCloud

There follows today's Daily Vigil posting.
I am indebted to whitewing for establishing this, and for constructing the original text. All thanks should go to whitewing for initiating this procedure.

I have no doubt that we will refine this over the coming days to include as much information as possible.

(A ‘vigil’ is defined as a ‘purposeful watch’)

Please note that the following comments are made to the best of my knowledge from my interpretation of information freely available on the internet from a Google search. I have not posted links as I am hoping to find time to do a proper update on the Refund Guide thread to follow on from Gomer’s post. If I do get a chance, I will post links there. I believe there are lessons that can be learnt from the handling of this situation.

Lapland New Forest

Closed: 4th December 08.

No. days since closure: 84

All ticketholders who have not yet had a refund should register as creditors with Grant Thornton ([EMAIL="Lapland.Liquidation@gtuk.com"]Lapland.Liquidation@gtuk.com[/EMAIL])

All card-paying ticketholders who have not yet had a refund should continue with chargebacks or section 75 claims in addition to registering as creditors. Gomer's Guide'll help:

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/...html?t=1412867

We think you may be running out of time to do a refund via your bank. We will try to clarify that soon.

We believe the time limit on some claims to be 120 days, what is not clear however, ids if this is from date of purchase or date of expected attendance. If the latter time will be very short at best - so get charging back and claiming those refunds.


(Advise Grant Thornton if you receive a refund so your bank becomes the creditor for the amount of your ticket)

All businesses owed money by Lapland New Forest Ltd should register as creditors. It is important that a full picture is built up. If you are worried about confidentiality, at the very least speak to Grant Thornton.

Legal action? The most recent update I can find is from 17th Feb 09. “Trading Standards are continuing to investigate, and this may take some time”.

**STOP PRESS** I have just been informed by whitewing of this:
http://www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/news/lapland/

Lapland New Forest was the 'top' story for this newspaper.


Lapland West Midlands

Did not open as planned on 6th December 2008: www.laplandwestmidlands.co.uk

No. days since failure to open: 82

All 42 ticketholders refunded in full

Legal action? As of 19th Jan 09, Trading Standards have identified 2 specific offences on the Lapland West Midlands website.” Any more updates anywhere?

We welcome any comments on this thread, and will gladly provide any assistance we can, so please do post here if you have anything to add or ask (however insignificant it may seem).

pancho_villa

Hi, just thought I would let you know that Tesco have finally put the money back in my account.:j

whitewing

pancho_villa wrote: »

Hi, just thought I would let you know that Tesco have finally put the money back in my account.:j

That's good news. Definitely worth the effort.

EdnaCloud

pancho_villa wrote: »

Hi, just thought I would let you know that Tesco have finally put the money back in my account.:j

I'm please for you, as I'm sure others are. And thanks for posting this - we need these sort of posts to encourage others. Thanks, Pancho.

EdnaCloud

Today's Daily Vigil posting.
I am indebted to whitewing for establishing this, and for constructing the original text. All thanks should go to whitewing for initiating this procedure.
This is an abbreviated posting, for full details of the text please look back to the last few posts.

Lapland New Forest
Closed: 4th December 08.
No. days since closure: 85
All ticketholders who have not yet had a refund should register as creditors with Grant Thornton ([EMAIL="Lapland.Liquidation@gtuk.com"]Lapland.Liquidation@gtuk.com[/EMAIL])
All card-paying ticketholders who have not yet had a refund should continue with chargebacks or section 75 claims in addition to registering as creditors. Gomer's Guide'll help:

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/...html?t=1412867

We think you may be running out of time to do a refund via your bank. We will try to clarify that soon. We do, however believe the time limit on some claims to be 120 days.

(Advise Grant Thornton if you receive a refund so your bank becomes the creditor for the amount of your ticket)

Legal action? - No further update.

The fiasco has gained some notoriety though,
http://www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/news/lapland/
Lapland New Forest was the 'top' story for this newspaper.


Lapland West Midlands
Did not open as planned on 6th December 2008: www.laplandwestmidlands.co.uk
No. days since failure to open: 83
All 42 ticketholders refunded in full

Legal action? No further updates

We welcome any comments on this thread, and will gladly provide any assistance we can, so please do post here if you have anything to add or ask (however insignificant it may seem).