How can my brother avoid the sack ??

robnye

i agree.... this doesnt sound right.....

it sounds more like due to current economics restraints, they needed to cut some flesh... (jobs i mean) and used him as a scapegoat, whether this is true or not i dont know, but the greivance procedure certainly doesnt look like its run its true course of events

did your brother manage to get a copy of the company grievance procedure?

i am all for rude people being given the sack but only if the correct procedure has been followed.

DGJsaver

Well , i did allude to them needing to cut cloth in my first post.......it does seem odd but whats he to do , rock and a hard place , go for a job and hope they dont request a reference (not all do) or kick up a stink and lose the months vital money ??

DGJsaver

robnye wrote: »

did your brother manage to get a copy of the company grievance procedure?

Yes , and it states , as you would expect , that if fired for gross misconduct , then no pay is due...

jobbingmusician

Another thing which no-one seems to have considered in this thread so far.

He has previously had a written warning. The company disciplinary policy should make it clear how long a written warning will remain on the file, and the maximum is usually a year. When was this written warning dated? If more than a year ago, the employer is out of order to refer to it (strange as this may seem).

If the warning was more than a year ago, and the disc policy states that it should have been removed, I suggest that your brother writes to them pointing this out and pointing out that this may automatically makes his dismissal unfair. It is up to him where he goes from here - I suggest that his best course of action might be to negotiate a good reference which makes no reference to disciplinary action (it might, for example, say that he was laid off as a cost cutting exercise) in return for him taking no legal action. You may need to sign a formal compromise agreement (Google this) for which the employer should meet the costs.

Little_Si

Hello

I am the `unfortunate ` fellow described in the title !

Thanks for all the advice , i have one question , i have a second interview on tuesday , i am thinking of coming clean and telling the prospective employer that my current employer found out i was on the verge of leaving and has let me go after paying me till the end of november , which they have , does anyone have any advice on wether this is a bad or good idea ?

I am absolutley convinced the company has not wanted to look weak in the market place (ie laying off) , and has more or less fabricated my dismissal , i never got to actually SEE any of these complaints for myself , but i showed remorse nonetheless as i thought i would get another chance !


I really want this other job ,and at my hearing the first thing they said was "we have reports you have activley pursued another job , whislt at work" the first parts true the second isnt. What should i do !!

Thanks

Si

Little_Si

Conor wrote: »

He's screwed. He's had warnings and a disciplinary for it before so it's not a new problem. He's continued to do the same things that he was disciplined for last time. I doubt that he's going to keep his job this time.

Lol thanks , you werent wrong !!

Savvy_Sue

As to coming clean, depends what you think might be in your reference. If you have not agreed what they will / won't say, you'd best be honest, IMO.

A bit unclear though, were they saying you'd spent work time job-hunting? Or just that you'd dared to consider leaving while still employed by them?

RabbitMad

Little_Si wrote: »

Hello

I am the `unfortunate ` fellow described in the title !

Thanks for all the advice , i have one question , i have a second interview on tuesday , i am thinking of coming clean and telling the prospective employer that my current employer found out i was on the verge of leaving and has let me go after paying me till the end of november , which they have , does anyone have any advice on wether this is a bad or good idea ?

I am absolutley convinced the company has not wanted to look weak in the market place (ie laying off) , and has more or less fabricated my dismissal , i never got to actually SEE any of these complaints for myself , but i showed remorse nonetheless as i thought i would get another chance !


I really want this other job ,and at my hearing the first thing they said was "we have reports you have activley pursued another job , whislt at work" the first parts true the second isnt. What should i do !!

Thanks

Si

Go back to them and say you've taken advice and it looks like you have a very strong case for wrongful dismisal - then negotiate from there. Or actually get yourself down to a solicitor and find out for real and then take them to a tribuneral.

As for your future employer you could say your company has invented some reason for dismissing you as you they found out were looking for another job, because if you get another job and haven't mentioned this, when they get the reference from the old company that may dismiss you too for not mentioning it.

Little_Si

RabbitMad wrote: »

Go back to them and say you've taken advice and it looks like you have a very strong case for wrongful dismisal - then negotiate from there. Or actually get yourself down to a solicitor and find out for real and then take them to a tribuneral.

As for your future employer you could say your company has invented some reason for dismissing you as you they found out were looking for another job, because if you get another job and haven't mentioned this, when they get the reference from the old company that may dismiss you too for not mentioning it.

Hiya
Thanks for your advice , not all employers ask for references though and i wonder if i can `be lucky` this once , the prospective employer seems to like me and i wonder if it will atally scupper my chances if i come clean with the new employer ?

The old employer ,it really stresses me out , everyone i have spoken to think i have been crucified !!

So stressed i dont know what to do for the best , is it free at a solicitors do you think ?

jobbingmusician

If you are a member of a union, they should give you free advice.

If you negotiate with an employment solicitor, many should give you an hour's advice for a notional fee (I think £25 or so). It wouldn't cost you anything to ring up and find out what rates are like. Or you could try a CAB, although many of these are not strong on employment law.

It does sound to me as if you are likely to have a very strong case for wrongful dismissal (I mean unfair dismissal if you have been in your job for longer than a year). Just to be clear

- it does not cost anything to take your past employer to tribunal, if you represent yourself

- you are very unlikely to have costs awarded against you if you lose, unless the court finds that you have raised the tribunal out of malice, just to make trouble for the company.

Have they sent you any letters confirming your dismissal? If so, what do these say? (Looking for another job whilst at work would be unlikely to be a dismissable offence, for a first offence, by the way - unless you have a super responsible job. It would be possible to fire an airline pilot who was reading whilst flying a plane, for example, but taking an unauthorised break from your work to browse the papers is unlikely to be gross misconduct in an 'ordinary' job).