Incapacity Benefit Review in Spain

seven-day-weekend · 7 August 2006 at 10:46PM

Hi ther.e I posted recently saying that my husband's IB review was due on 27 July and asking if anyone knew what would happen as we live in Spain. No-one seemed to know....so now I can tell you!

He had a letter today asking for our Dr's name and address. My husband then rang them, saying it doesn't work like that, we only have a Dr in our tiny remote village two mornings a week, you don't have to register with this one and he only speaks Spanish (and it's not always the same Dr anyway). Our Spanish, although improving, is not good enough to speak of these types of health matters. He also pointed out that the treatment in the UK for his depression and IBS was only repeat prescriptions and you can buy both the antidepressants and the peppermint oil capsules over the counter from a pharmacy here in Spain, and that all he ever got from our Dr. in the UK was repeat prescriptions. He said he hadn't seen a Dr in the village because of the language problem. We can prove he has bought the drugs from a pharmacy and that he has had to go to hospital with the IBS.

Anyway, they accepted that. They are now going to send him a questionnaire, and maybe he will have to have a medical in Spain. If this is the case he will ask for an interpreter, or the opportunity for a medical when we are in the UK for ten days in September.

His claim has not been cancelled, yet. We will have to wait and see the outcome.

Thought this might be useful to someone. Watch this space.....

hjb123 · 8 August 2006 at 8:59AM

Thats good to hear - sounds like you had a fairly nice person ring you about it. Guess its just a case of filling in the questionaire when it arrives and waiting for the outcome. They may decide that its more hassle than its worth to try chasing you when you live abroad!

seven-day-weekend · 8 August 2006 at 10:16AM

We've actually aways found the IB staff to be extremely helpful. Having read other peoples' experiences with them, maybe we've just been lucky. My husband has a medical history of depression going back to 1990 and IBS to about 1995. He always been upfront about his illnesses (not saying others haven't) and just told it as it is, without either exaggerating or minimising them.

Maybe we'll not be saying this is they stop his benefit in a month's time!:rotfl:

Max_Fischer · 8 August 2006 at 12:02PM

I just joined the forum yesterday otherwise I would have replied to your original post.

I actually work in Incapacity Benefit so here's some information.

The reason they want your husband's doctor's name and address is because they are actually trying to avoid a medical examination and pass him without it. This is because most people pass the medical examinations and they are quite expensive especially if the person is residing abroad.

If someone has a mental illness then when someone is due for what is called the Personal Capability Assessment we would normally send a questionnaire to your doctor usually without you even knowing.

If the doctor gives us enough information on the GP questionnaire for our doctors to pass you without even seeing you then that's it. If your doctor hasn't given enough information then we have send a questionnaire form to you (called an IB50 form) to get more information about your illness from you.

If after that our doctors still require more information to be confident in their decision to pass you then they will arrange a medical examination.

When you are abroad it's exactly the same.

In your instance it sounds like they didn't hold details of your spanish doctor to send him the mental health questionnaire so they wrote to you asking for those details.

As you don't have an actual doctor in Spain they are instead having to send you an IB50 questionnaire form. The questionnaire covers every possible illness and is quite long so you'll find that most of the form won't apply to your husband.

As you won't have a doctor backing up what you're saying on the form (when you submit an IB50 form you are also usually asked to obtain a special medical certificate from your doctor which basically gives our doctors a more detailed diagnosis of the illness and details of any medications) it's most likely that a medical will be arranged either in Spain (we have reciprocal agreements with EU countries to do this) at the DWP's expense.

This can take a few months to sort out so you may be waiting a while to hear after you send in the form.

I wouldn't worry too much about it though as to pass a medical it's to do with how many points you score based on the information on the forms and obtained from a medical if you have to attend one.

With mental illnesses it is actually easier to pass as you don't have to score as many points as someone with a physical incapacity.

Your best approach when you get the IB50 is to put as much information as possible including any physical problems that the DWP may not be aware of (they probably just have your husband's illness down as "depression" and that'll be it).

It's also very important to list all of the medications as well.

Just remember that more information you put in the form then the less likely it as he'll have to undergo a medical. Although as you won't have a doctor backing up what your saying then it's most likely that your husband will have to undergo a medical. And remember that a sensible approach is to describe everything as if it was one of your husbands "bad" days. Everyone slightly exaggerates their illness when filling in the form just don't go overboard!

Anyway I just thought you'd be interested in what's going on behind the scenes.

Good luck (although I'm fairly sure everything will be fine)!

SMC_2 · 8 August 2006 at 12:33PM

Max_Fischer wrote:

I just joined the forum yesterday otherwise I would have replied to your original post.

I actually work in Incapacity Benefit so here's some information.

The reason they want your husband's doctor's name and address is because they are actually trying to avoid a medical examination and pass him without it. This is because most people pass the medical examinations and they are quite expensive especially if the person is residing abroad.

Most people pass the medical examinations, is that really true? More and more people seem to be failing and having to appeal!!!!!

hjb123 · 8 August 2006 at 12:46PM

SMC wrote:

Most people pass the medical examinations, is that really true? More and more people seem to be failing and having to appeal!!!!!

I agree! I failed my medical and I know of quite alot in this area that did and have had to or are having to appeal

Max_Fischer · 8 August 2006 at 1:34PM

The majority of people who fail the Personal Capabiltiy Assessment (PCA) are still the ones who fail to return the IB50 questionnaire on time, fail to turn up for the medical or do not have the backing of their own doctor (or their doctor was too lazy to back them up). Very few people who are ill and have a good GP backing them up will fail the PCA (and most of them will probably win an appeal).

In fact we're seeing more and more medical certificates annotated by the doctor (in secret code) asking us to start the PCA as they are too afraid to sign the person off themselves and would rather we done their job for them.

Also as GPs are now being pressurised by the government for issuing too many sick notes they're trying to get people off Incapacity Benefit either by signing them off or as a lot seem to prefer asking us to do their dirty work for them (at considerable expense to the taxpayer).

You would be surprised what GPs do behind their patient's back!

Also if your doctor fails to give us enough information or is too lazy to properly verify what you are telling us on the IB50 form then you'll obviously be more likely to fail as you'll be relying on what you've said on the IB50 form and how you perform at the medical.

Most other people though still pass the PCA.

It may appear that more people are failing. This is only because more people are actually being referred for PCAs than were a few years ago. But usually most people still pass the PCA.

The PCA section at my office has almost double the staff of 5 years ago whilst my section has barely changed.

A few years ago lots of PCAs were actually deferred as the resources just weren't there to do them. Now due to government targets and diversion of resources to Incapacity Benefits more PCA referrals are being made now than ever before.

Seven-day-weekend (who started this thread) is unusual in that they do not have a GP but from what has been posted it seems to me unlikely that they would fail.

hjb123 · 8 August 2006 at 2:44PM

Max_Fischer wrote:

The majority of people who fail the Personal Capabiltiy Assessment (PCA) are still the ones who fail to return the IB50 questionnaire on time, fail to turn up for the medical or do not have the backing of their own doctor (or their doctor was too lazy to back them up). Very few people who are ill and have a good GP backing them up will fail the PCA (and most of them will probably win an appeal).

I disagree with this. I sent in my IB50 and Med 4 form, properly and well in time, got called in for a medical, turned up on time for it and failed it mainly due to the incompetent doctor that carried it out. My own GP was fully backing me, he filled in forms for me and wrote letters - yet I still failed the PCA because it isnt a good assessment for some conditions.

It puts added strain on the person claiming when they even have to go for the medical when they are quite obviously ill, then when they fail the medical it just makes the illness deteriorate with the stress of it all.

joemardo1 · 8 August 2006 at 3:21PM

Hi,

I never knew you could get incapacity benefit if you lived abroad. What are the rules on this?

joe

singlehouseholder · 8 August 2006 at 3:32PM

you could say that, given the thousands of people claiming IB, the % of those that have negative experiences or fail personal capability assesments is somewhat negligible.Not that that is any consolation if you are one of the unlucky ones.

seven-day-weekend · 8 August 2006 at 4:18PM

joemardo1 wrote:

Hi,

I never knew you could get incapacity benefit if you lived abroad. What are the rules on this?

joe

It's not automatic, I don't think. My husband was claiming it before we went to Spain, we let DWP know we were going to Spain, the claim was stopped while they decided whether he could claim it or not, then about six weeks later he had a letter saying he could continue to receive it. They also sent him a form E121 which covers him for free healthcare in Spain for as long as he is on IB.

Incapacity Benefit Review in Spain

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