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Bulk LPG - Cheapest suppliers / supply route?
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is that price from the call centre or the rep.I found the reps in the larger companies give you a far better deal.0
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I've recently received a letter from those nice people at Flogas offering £50 worth of free gas, if I renew my contract for another two years. The price, 65ppl. Now let me think...............0
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Good thought Meagan, that was from the call centre.
Extra fuels 50.23ppl plus £63 tank rental. Their website www.extrafuel.co.uk shows at the top their currently monthly rate and its history. At least they are up front with their charges. But they will offer no kind of cap/bail-out on the contract.
BP just quoted me 57p...................
Rob.0 -
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GrandadRob wrote: »Their website www.extrafuel.co.uk shows at the top their currently monthly rate and its history. At least they are up front with their charges. But they will offer no kind of cap/bail-out on the contract.
All, be aware:
Schedule 2, paragraph 1(j) of Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 states that:terms may be unfair if they have the object or effect of allowing the seller or supplier to alter the terms of a contract unilaterally without a valid reason which is specified in the contract.
and paragraph (l) states thatterms may be unfair if they have the object or effect of providing for the price of goods to be determined at the time of delivery or allowing a seller of goods or supplier of services to increase their price without in both cases giving the consumer the corresponding right to cancel the contract if the final price is too high in relation to the price agreed when the contract was concluded.
From which I would suggest that the Extrafuel contract would likely be considered unfair as it allows for "unfettered" price rises (OFT jargon, not mine) and would therefore be ruled illegal and unenforceable by the OFT. Extragas are not alone in this: I know for certain that the current Flogas contract is flawed in the same way. I suspect others are too.
See also my previous post http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showpost.php?p=40209456&postcount=582 for the OFT view on this.
Note that the OFT are seeking submissions from LPG and Domestic Oil users following last month's referral by Charles hendry MP in the wake of the Domestic Heating Oil market fixing scandal uncovered by the Sunday Times. (For those ogf you that haven't heard about that one, DCC, Flogas' parent company are alleged to have been fixing prices by quietly buying up independent Oil suppliers and then posting inflated prices on the boilerjuice website, whcih they have also conveniently bought).
The closing date for submissions to the OFT is 28th February (see post http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showpost.php?p=41084160&postcount=689 for details)0 -
If it IS necessary to change the sacrificial anodes, how much disruption is involved??? Would I be right to assume that they can just bore some smallish holes (a few inches in diameter) and drop new ones in, or does it involve major groundworks and destruction of the lawn or whatever is above the tank??
I had mine replaced a year or so ago (not sure how many) but what you say pretty well describes the job. It was carried out by a lone operative in barely a couple of hours, if that.
The flamin' moles make more mess with their excavations.0 -
All, be aware:
Schedule 2, paragraph 1(j) of Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 states that:
and paragraph (l) states that
From which I would suggest that the Extrafuel contract would likely be considered unfair as it allows for "unfettered" price rises (OFT jargon, not mine) and would therefore be ruled illegal and unenforceable by the OFT. Extragas are not alone in this: I know for certain that the current Flogas contract is flawed in the same way. I suspect others are too.
My "Domestic Bulk Gas Supply Agreement" with Extra Gas has the following clause:
5. L.P.G. shall be sold at the company's current price as specified from time to time by the company.
In effect "specified from time to time" means each month, on the first of the month, for that whole month, posted on the website www.extrafuel.co.uk .
Extra Gas prices really do go down as well as up!
In January the price was 54.27, this month, February, it is 50.23. My first delivery was in June last year at 36.03 and it has gone up every month since then (though June's price wasless than May's).
Yes, I am tied into Extra Gas as sole supplier for 2 years. But I willingly went into the agreement knowing the price would go up and down monthly.
I wonder how the OFT would see my contract?0 -
LittleVermin wrote: »My "Domestic Bulk Gas Supply Agreement" with Extra Gas has the following clause:
5. L.P.G. shall be sold at the company's current price as specified from time to time by the company.
In effect "specified from time to time" means each month, on the first of the month, for that whole month, posted on the website www.extrafuel.co.uk .
Extra Gas prices really do go down as well as up!
In which respect, I believe ExtraGas are unique!
On reflection, and having read the OFT rulings on the BP and Flogas contracts made in 2005, I suspect that, for transparency, the OFT would probably ask ExtraGas to include some clause or reference to a respected index such as Patts LPGaswire when determining prices and to make that available as evidence. As things stand, I doubt ExtraGas would get much more than a slap on the wrist (at worst), as (unlike some companies - you, dear reader, can decide which) the intention is not to defraud the customer, but to offer a "fair" spot price.
A smart contract lawyer might be able to argue otherwise, and despite the intention, I suspect it is arguable that the contract should nevertheless include some remedy should the customer find any rise unsustainable.
But like you say, you entered into the contract with your "eyes open"!0 -
In which respect, I believe ExtraGas are unique!
Indeed. Extra Gas's business model as a gas supplier is different to all the others (so far as I know).
Extra Gas's customers know the price before delivery - you order on the website, the front page of which shows the price.
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As a LPG user I have chosen to pay for my LPG the same way I pay for fuel for my car - at the pump price available to all customers (though of course I'm tied to one supplier since I don't own my tank). I've had almost 20 years of the other system where the supplier sets the price with no transparency but occasional attempts to justify price rises, using arguments that seemed no longer to apply when wholesale fuel prices (and particularly wholesale LPG prices) went down!0 -
LittleVermin wrote: »My "Domestic Bulk Gas Supply Agreement" with Extra Gas has the following clause:
5. L.P.G. shall be sold at the company's current price as specified from time to time by the company.
In effect "specified from time to time" means each month, on the first of the month, for that whole month, posted on the website www.extrafuel.co.uk .
Extra Gas prices really do go down as well as up!
In January the price was 54.27, this month, February, it is 50.23. My first delivery was in June last year at 36.03 and it has gone up every month since then (though June's price wasless than May's).
Yes, I am tied into Extra Gas as sole supplier for 2 years. But I willingly went into the agreement knowing the price would go up and down monthly.
I wonder how the OFT would see my contract?
This contract is clearly illegal under the OFT ruling and makes no difference wherever or not you went into "with your eyes open". This is because they can actually raise the price by whatever they feel like. As it happens there price is not what I would call outrageous. Although I am paying less (I think 47p) and the last letter I received said they would lower the price if the Wholesale price of LPG fell (we will see). Furthermore my contract is also illegal as no where it says ...well it says nothing what so ever about price rises but it seems pointless to complain if my deal is the best available in my area. I have said this before it shows a lot of bottle for extra gas to put there price on the internet for everyone to see. It allows other to undercut it. A lot of bottle.0
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