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  • FIRST POST
    • MSE Sarah
    • By MSE Sarah 14th Jan 20, 2:48 PM
    • 217Posts
    • 99Thanks
    MSE Sarah
    0 WOW
    Money Moral Dilemma: Should I have refused to pay again for my shopping?
    • #1
    • 14th Jan 20, 2:48 PM
    0 WOW
    Money Moral Dilemma: Should I have refused to pay again for my shopping? 14th Jan 20 at 2:48 PM
    This week's MoneySaver who wants advice asks...

    I paid for lunch at a supermarket self-service till by scanning its payment app, so it automatically charges my credit card and awards me loyalty points. I got the usual instant notifications (from that app and my credit card app) that the payment went through - but the till said it didn't. I alerted staff who insisted I pay again and told me I'd get an automatic refund if there was a double charge. I paid again, but should I have kicked up more of a fuss?

    Unfortunately the MSE team can't always answer money moral dilemma questions as contributions are often emailed in or suggested in person. They are intended to be enjoyed as a point of debate and discussed at face value.

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Page 1
    • General Grant
    • By General Grant 14th Jan 20, 2:58 PM
    • 1,352 Posts
    • 1,322 Thanks
    General Grant
    • #2
    • 14th Jan 20, 2:58 PM
    • #2
    • 14th Jan 20, 2:58 PM
    Is that a MORAL dilemma?

    It would depend on how much I trusted the supermarket staff, which wouldn't be very highly in this case as if it went through twice they could say it was two meals you had paid for and not give a refund, certainly not automatically.
    • VfM4meplse
    • By VfM4meplse 14th Jan 20, 3:21 PM
    • 32,435 Posts
    • 67,404 Thanks
    VfM4meplse
    • #3
    • 14th Jan 20, 3:21 PM
    • #3
    • 14th Jan 20, 3:21 PM
    I'd like to know if the refund actually materialised? And which supermarket?
    Value-for-money-for-me-puhleeze!

    "No man is worth, crawling on the earth"- adapted from Bob Crewe and Bob Gaudio

    Hope is not a strategy ...A child is for life, not just 18 years....Don't get me started on the NHS, because you won't win...I love chaz-ing!
    • MacMickster
    • By MacMickster 14th Jan 20, 8:59 PM
    • 3,399 Posts
    • 11,924 Thanks
    MacMickster
    • #4
    • 14th Jan 20, 8:59 PM
    • #4
    • 14th Jan 20, 8:59 PM
    Pay a proper assistant at a proper till with cash.

    Keep someone in a job, get a little bit of human interaction and no doubts about whether you've paid. No having to rely on fallible technology.

    Simples!
    "When the people fear the government there is tyranny, when the government fears the people there is liberty." - Thomas Jefferson
    • pickledonionspaceraider
    • By pickledonionspaceraider 14th Jan 20, 9:16 PM
    • 1,830 Posts
    • 4,279 Thanks
    pickledonionspaceraider
    • #5
    • 14th Jan 20, 9:16 PM
    • #5
    • 14th Jan 20, 9:16 PM
    Oh whatevs
    'Entitled' and 'Snowflake' = buzz words, of the passive aggressive..they are not even a 'thing'.
    • Stevia
    • By Stevia 14th Jan 20, 9:29 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Stevia
    • #6
    • 14th Jan 20, 9:29 PM
    • #6
    • 14th Jan 20, 9:29 PM
    This happened to me just before Christmas in Asda and I had bought a lot of stuff. I had no choice but to pay twice. I spoke with both asda HO and my bank, nothing either could do as it was a fault with the till! I did get a refund after two weeks. Apparently it happens often!!!��
    • shirley999
    • By shirley999 14th Jan 20, 10:09 PM
    • 1,887 Posts
    • 15,438 Thanks
    shirley999
    • #7
    • 14th Jan 20, 10:09 PM
    • #7
    • 14th Jan 20, 10:09 PM
    I was chased out of Frankie and Benny’s after paying on their app and like you ended up paying twice. I ended up with a £30 goodwill gesture for the embarrassment caused and never saw the staff member involved again.
    • PennyPinch
    • By PennyPinch 14th Jan 20, 10:15 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    PennyPinch
    • #8
    • 14th Jan 20, 10:15 PM
    • #8
    • 14th Jan 20, 10:15 PM
    I paid with card and pin but the real life checkout person told me because we were too busy interacting that I'd removed my card too soon and the payment failed so I had to do it again. Sure enough when statement checked I found two identical payments. Bank said talk to shop. I had to make purpose trip to shop to talk to them as no one answering phone. They said my bank will return it automatically when they realise. Happened on a Friday eve and money not returned until following Friday am. Not happy with the way ASDA dealt with it. Did complain but just wasted more of my time. For some people it could have made them overdrawn.
    • Bowmill
    • By Bowmill 14th Jan 20, 10:29 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    Bowmill
    • #9
    • 14th Jan 20, 10:29 PM
    No!
    • #9
    • 14th Jan 20, 10:29 PM
    When you put in your pin to pay for anything, the card machine gets in touch with the bank to process the payment. Sometimes the connection is lost. Card taken out too soon for instance. The money has been allocated to the retailer by the bank but the retailer's processing company has not received a valid authorisation number. The till shows the transaction as still to be paid. You then do it all again and the transaction is paid. The bank put the first lot of money into a pending account and eventually (7 -10 working days) the money drops back into the customer's account.
    Hope this helps people understand what goes on. Xx
    • harrycrac
    • By harrycrac 14th Jan 20, 10:39 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    harrycrac
    Yes make a fuss at the time
    Same happened to me recently using an on line account debit card, payment went through and got an alert on phone to say transaction completed. However the card terminal would not display completed transaction, well thatís what the assistant told me. I had to pay again, the transactions were 3 minutes apart and it took two weeks to get my refund. I should of asked for a void transaction slip at time of transaction and stood my ground. I will next time.
    • REJP
    • By REJP 14th Jan 20, 11:05 PM
    • 139 Posts
    • 180 Thanks
    REJP
    Pay twice for meal?
    No, their faulty machine was to blame. I would have asked to speak with the manager, showed the approved statement on the app, and walked out. And never used their cafe again.
    • geemac_one
    • By geemac_one 15th Jan 20, 1:03 AM
    • 2 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    geemac_one
    You were right to pay again. If the store had no record of you having paid and you left the store, you could have been accused of shoplifting. Pay with a more reliable means next time!
    • tgroom57
    • By tgroom57 15th Jan 20, 6:55 AM
    • 1,386 Posts
    • 13,254 Thanks
    tgroom57
    My grandson paid for something at a self-service till, and it said he was £1 short of the amount, even though we knew he'd put the full amount in. he never did get that refund because it was a cash transaction/he was a kid and kids aren't customers / the staff weren't watching. (Tesco)

    • SassySara
    • By SassySara 15th Jan 20, 7:39 AM
    • 4 Posts
    • 2 Thanks
    SassySara
    Yes, but it's done now so nothing u can do. Why worry about the past, focus on the future and learn from mistakes. Next time, go to a physical human being who is paid to do that job, taking the stress out of your day. Namaste 🧘🏻!♀️
    • suki1964
    • By suki1964 15th Jan 20, 7:47 AM
    • 12,539 Posts
    • 33,440 Thanks
    suki1964
    This week's MoneySaver who wants advice asks...

    I paid for lunch at a supermarket self-service till by scanning its payment app, so it automatically charges my credit card and awards me loyalty points. I got the usual instant notifications (from that app and my credit card app) that the payment went through - but the till said it didn't. I alerted staff who insisted I pay again and told me I'd get an automatic refund if there was a double charge. I paid again, but should I have kicked up more of a fuss?
    Originally posted by MSE Sarah
    Well now, that depends on how much of a fuss you kicked up?

    I mean if you were getting close to punching someone first time around, I guess we can safely say you kicked up plenty
    if you lend someone £20 and never see that person again, it was probably worth it
    • dysucker
    • By dysucker 15th Jan 20, 7:49 AM
    • 25 Posts
    • 9 Thanks
    dysucker
    Just pay again, and ask the credit card company to refund if a double charge has occurred.

    I see some people saying their credit card asks them to query the charge with the shop - nope, tell the credit card it's a double charge and you want it refunded back, they can contact the shop themselves if they want to.
    • bertiewhite
    • By bertiewhite 15th Jan 20, 7:51 AM
    • 1,800 Posts
    • 2,118 Thanks
    bertiewhite
    What day of the week was it?
    • Mikeat60
    • By Mikeat60 15th Jan 20, 8:01 AM
    • 7 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    Mikeat60
    Mike Solomons
    .


    If you have paid and can prove it just leave. If challenged, e.g. by security staff, explain that you have paid. If detained, warn you'll ring the Police for help and if that doesn't do the trick, dial 999 and ask for urgent Police assistance.


    However, if the staff do not advise you that you have been arrested, politely say you're leaving and leave.


    Then write to head office. I favour a short letter sent by post, it generally gets better attention than a 'phone call or email.


    As you can prove payment, it's most unlikely that you can legally be arrested or penalised in any way.


    Some years after a dispute like that, I was approached by a manager in a major supermarket who said to me, "I thought I had banned you from the shop". I told him that I had written to the head office and he had been over ruled. Interestingly, he didn't argue.




    .
    • dw1
    • By dw1 15th Jan 20, 8:29 AM
    • 37 Posts
    • 72 Thanks
    dw1
    ď If detained, warn you'll ring the Police for help and if that doesn't do the trick, dial 999 and ask for urgent Police assistance.Ē

    Ridiculous. Just pay it again and sort it out afterwards with their head office.

    Who in their right mind has time to get into an argument with the store security guard?!
    • mxxx
    • By mxxx 15th Jan 20, 9:42 AM
    • 83 Posts
    • 26 Thanks
    mxxx
    Opinions...
    I find it staggering how so many people have such different opinions but all state them almost as fact, like 'how could you possibly consider any alternative way of dealing with this?'. Guess that's just how the internet is these days, been a long time since I got involved in a forum thread...

    Anyway, in my opinion i'd just go along with it and wait for the refund, but i'm financially stable enough that it's unlikely to cause significant problems for me if it didn't get refunded quickly. If it was likely to make me overdrawn i'm not sure how i'd handle it.

    This has happened to me once before and it took over a week for the money to be returned but it was returned without me doing anything. The explanation from Bowmill is very helpful and makes perfect sense so it seems the simplest solution is to just pay twice and wait for the refund but only if you can afford to do this.
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