Does anyone have a Mac?

Bob63

markymoo wrote: »

Macs do crash, but so does windows... macs crash less, and the whole OS rarely rarely crashes. You might have to restart the finder, but it is rare you have to reboot the whole computer!

I would agree with that. I have only had the spinning rainbow wheel of death once since I got my first Mac in November. My daughters Macbook hasn't crashed once since December. In contrast, the PC my youngest daughter used until she got an iMac last week has probably had the blue screen of death roughly once a month since November.

Of course, I'm a recent convert and it could be said there are none so evangelical as the recently converted, but as someone who started using computers in 1974 and works in the IT industry I'm happy that my opinion is balanced and based on years of experience of many different computers and operating systems.

[Deleted User]

And to bring balance to it, I've been running Vista x64 since July 8th 2007 continuously with less than a dozen restarts for drivers etc and I've not had one system error that caused the system to require a reboot.

Cloudane

beinerts wrote: »

I've used a Mac before and I'm not the biggest fan. OK, they looks sexy and the OS hold your hand the whole time so it's great for newbies. However, you get more for your money with a PC and if you're like me and like tinkering and installing new hardware and software, the PCs the one to go for. Also, Macs DO crash, I've seen it happen quite a bit. The only computer that's never crashed on me is my work PC, which runs on linux.

Each to their own, I just think the PC does more of the stuff I use it for, but if you're using a machine for graphics, standard application and you care what your computer looks like then the Mac's the one for you.

You're using stereotypes here a bit. Macs are not actually expensive for what you get - in fact they're highly competitive. I've made numerous attempts to find PC equivalents and compare prices, and every time the Mac has actually worked out either cheaper, the same, or maybe about £50 more (which makes up for itself with OS X and numerous other things).

True, you can get a big ol' box with cheap components in it and save money that way. But then you're stuck with a big ol' box, and poor components that fail after a year. Oh those joys of cheap PSUs suddenly going kaboom and making smoke pour out the back Responsiveness and general reliability are also affected.

Mac Mini - no PC at that size (the whole point of it) for anywhere near that price. There's the cheaper desktop Eee coming soon from Asus, but it's unlikely to touch it for performance or build quality (I have their laptop... awesome size, but certainly not a patch on my 4 year old Powerbook for performance or quality). Yes you can get a PC tower for cheaper, but re-read the bit about size.

iMac - similar story, but with that nice tidy and compact all-in-one form factor. Dell do something similar - but about the same price and you lose out on OS X.

Mac Pro - uses workstation grade hardware, and indeed workstation grade hardware costs that much. Now, that type of hardware wouldn't make a lot of difference to your everyday user but that's not who it's aimed at. For professional apps, video editing etc that's where you get the return on the investment... and again, I've been through sites such as Scan and tried to spec out a similar machine with Xeon processors etc and the price is about equal if not more.

I won't get into the laptops - all much the same points.

True, Apple don't do "cheap". I don't blame them; they're all about the quality. But they certainly do good value for what you do pay!

Macs do crash yes, all computers crash, but if you've seen it happen a lot then I think a machine with some bad RAM may be involved. I've owned a Powerbook for 4 years (and used it almost non-stop) and an iMac for 1, and I've only ever seen OS X crash twice - once on the Powerbook when I had some dodgy RAM in it, and once on the iMac when the new Leopard OS was in its early days (serves me right for being a beta test... er I mean early adopter). To be quite fair, PCs don't crash either, if you invest in decent quality components with decent quality drivers.

There is indeed the looks thing.... hey if I'm going to be sat using something for several hours a day then it might as well be pleasing on the eyes and enjoyable to use. But don't get dragged into the "form over function" stereotyping - with the exception of that stupid 'Mighty Mouse' (nice one Apple *smack*) or arguably the Macbook Air (!!!!!!?) it's far from the truth. They like to prove that form and function are not inversely proportional or mutually exclusive.

Same with the "hold your hand" thing. "Macs are for newbies" is yet another stereotype. Normally ease of use and functionality do have a bit of an inverse proportion relationship. However Apple give you the same functionality (hell it's got a full Unix back-end for one thing) and figure that they might as well make it easy to use too. And why not. Just because I can compile a kernel module from source and add it to a text file so that it auto-inserts on startup, doesn't mean I want to (or have the time), nor does it mean that I have the desire to prove my intelligence. If the OS looks after stuff for me... great! Then I can get one with accomplishing things.

nomoneytoday

brazilianwax wrote: »

Just one word of caution. Be careful with the whole 'no viruses on Macs' statements - there is NO reason that there couldn't be viruses for Macs. There is nothing more secure about the Mac OS - there are no viruses just because there aren't enough Macs to make it worthwhile to hackers.

Nonsense. There is a huge difference, as to install a virus on a mac it would have to ask to be let in, assuming you setup an admin and user account when you got the machine running in the first place....

As for the price difference, don't forget you get free training with a mac if you ask at your local Apple Store - more than makes up for the £50 difference

toasterman

nomoneytoday wrote: »

to install a virus on a mac it would have to ask to be let in, assuming you setup an admin and user account when you got the machine running in the first place....

It's kinda the same with Linux, that.
And Vista, assuming you haven't got hacked off with the UAC thing and just disabled it. I can kinda understand what Microsoft were aiming for with that feature, but to ask you repeatedly if you're sure, gets boring very quickly.

I prefer the Mac/Linux way, where you enter a password once, do what you need to do, and then go back to your normal stuff after.

I've had my iMac (first ever Apple purchase - I didn't even have an iPod), since about last September (with Leopard, just after it came out). It's crashed what I would call 'properly' (where a reboot has been required) twice. Both times were when I was running Parallels and Windows XP. I'm told there has been an update to Parallels which fixes this problem, but I no longer need it, as I've found alternative native-Mac software for everything I need.
Other than that, it's just been the thing where Firefox crashes out, and you relaunch it. I've had the same happen on Windows/Linux too - no software is perfect, on any platform.

I find installing/uninstalling software much easier on the Mac. Most things you just drag to applications to install, and drag to trash to uninstall. That couldn't be much easier.
Some software installs with a wizard, much the same as on Windows - you pick which components, where you want to install to, etc.

Also it took about 30-35 seconds to boot the first day I got it. It still takes the same time now. I've never defragged (you don't need to on os x), or ran a check for spyware, and I've only got the 1gb memory it came with - for which I do sound editing, multitracking, etc.

The most annoying things on my Mac if I HAD to pick something, are these two.
1. The ball on the Mighty Mouse. I seem to end up cleaning it 2-3 times a week, to keep it working. Sometimes it will scroll up but not down, or vice versa. You can use any usb mouse with a Mac, but I love the ability to scroll in all directions - which is lacking in most other mice.
2. Playing video files. Windows Media Player is better than Quicktime at handling playlists, etc. WMP also supports more formats. VLC on the Mac plays absolutely everything, but it doesn't work with the Apple remote without additional software, and sometimes the colours are out, the video isn't smooth, etc. It's only really a problem if you download a lot of movie clips in different formats.

Marty_J

Quicktime will play whatever codecs you have installed; Perian contains quite a few.

There's also Windows Media Components for QuickTime if you need to play Windows Media files.

The little scroll ball is very annoying; I'd rather have a wheel that works all the time than a little 360 degree ball that works some of the time.

toasterman

Marty_J wrote: »

Quicktime will play whatever codecs you have installed; Perian contains quite a few.

The little scroll ball is very annoying; I'd rather have a wheel that works all the time than a little 360 degree ball that works some of the time.

I wish I could remember which files it is I just can't get to play in Quicktime no matter what I do. I have Perian, and the Flip4mac thing.
It is annoying that it needs an add-on to do anything with mpeg2, as well. Granted though, so does Windows, and although there are free ones available on Windows, they all suck. So you end up paying about £20 for the ability to use mpeg2 video (properly), on Windows or Mac.

The silly thing with the little scroll ball is that it could work, with a redesign.
Think back to trackball-style mice. They didn't clog up and stop working 2-3 times a week. It's just an annoying design fault in an otherwise beautifully designed system.
I can use a different mouse but I like the side buttons, and although it's not like any other mouse in the world
- I find if you relax a little and stop trying to strangle it like with other mice, it feels nicer to use.

The mouse needs redesigning though.. it doesn't match the colour scheme of the aluminium/black now.
Plus some people still think its a 1-button mouse! (I read someone recently slating Apple's mouse for only having one button). It is by default, but you can turn it into a 2-button through the preferences menu, people!

Marty_J

It's actually a four button mouse, what with the scroll ball being a button and the nifty side buttons.

Sput2001

spec for spec macs are an affordable purchase, If we look at the £1149, 24" iMac, and compare it with a similar specced AIO computer..


Mac - 2.8Ghz Core 2 Duo, 2gb Ram, 320gb HDD, Wifi, Bluetooth, 24" Screen. AIO Design - £1149
Dell XPS One - 2.3Ghz Core 2 Duo, 2gb Ram, 320Gb HDD, Wifi, 20" Screen. AIO Design - £1099

So, a mac, is £50 more, for a higher spec... Argument Busted!

That's odd. I just went to the Apple website and specced up a Mac to match my PC and the Mac was nearly double the price - Over £1,100 versus £570 for my PC - and my PC gets a load more stuff bundled with it. Argument busted? Nah, not for me.

Even the company I work for - which until recently was resolutely 100% Mac - has just ditched them all (apart from in the graphics studios) for PCs, and saved around £7,000 in the process.

My PC tower sits on the floor behind my desk. I'm not even remotely bothered whether it looks good or ugly because I don't spend very long looking at it. I am more concerned that there's a whole load of spare capcity in it to add extra drives, USB ports, decent sound and graphics cards and so on.

Doing an Apple-style "squeeze all the hardware into the space behind a monitor" may be pretty and terribly clever, but it's also way too limiting - at least for my personal needs.

I'm not anti-Mac. As I've said previously, I'll happily use both, but for personal use, getting a PC was a no-brainer.

Marty_J

NickMidgley wrote: »

That's odd. I just went to the Apple website and specced up a Mac to match my PC and the Mac was nearly double the price - Over £1,100 versus £570 for my PC - and my PC gets a load more stuff bundled with it. Argument busted? Nah, not for me.

But are you comparing like with like? Is your PC a snazzy all in one design? Is your PC made by a high-end manufacturer?

Macs aren't Dells, and so can't really be compared with them price-wise.

As for the stuff that comes bundled with PCs, you can keep it. The stuff that comes with a Mac is far better than any bundled PC software I've ever seen. I got iPhoto, iWeb, iDVD, iMovie and Garageband. There just isn't a PC equivalent for that little lot, never-mind one that comes free.

Even the company I work for - which until recently was resolutely 100% Mac - has just ditched them all (apart from in the graphics studios) for PCs, and saved around £7,000 in the process.

Did they buy new really expensive PCs? I doubt it if they saved money. Hence, the comparison is meaningless.

My PC tower sits on the floor behind my desk. I'm not even remotely bothered whether it looks good or ugly because I don't spend very long looking at it. I am more concerned that there's a whole load of spare capcity in it to add extra drives, USB ports, decent sound and graphics cards and so on.

Well fair enough, so an all in one design isn't for you. I'm not bothered about upgrading my Mac as it works just fine.

Doing an Apple-style "squeeze all the hardware into the space behind a monitor" may be pretty and terribly clever, but it's also way too limiting - at least for my personal needs.

I'm not anti-Mac. As I've said previously, I'll happily use both, but for personal use, getting a PC was a no-brainer.

Again, that's fair enough. It would be a boring work if we were all the same. :beer:

And not to mention that us Mac guys need you PC guys to be the targets of all those viruses, worms, trojans, malware and spyware. So you're really doing us a favour.