Stansted-London-Stansted

dzug1

gner_ex wrote: »

Finally, I am not at all sure whether Audley End to Liverpool Street via Stansted Airport is a valid route - Altarf can you confirm that you have undertaken the mileage analysis/fares comparison/routing point analysis, or were you just guessing?

The journey planners show trips that way at the same fare as direct.

Not that means that it is right - they do get a few validities wrong.

I have a feeling that at one time the via Stansted route was not valid - maybe it's changed?

Altarf

gner_ex wrote: »

This depends on your ticket type - I believe that with day returns or open returns you can do this, but NOT with saver returns.

I think that I did say normal single or return (not an Advance or Saver).

gner_ex wrote: »

Finally, I am not at all sure whether Audley End to Liverpool Street via Stansted Airport is a valid route - Altarf can you confirm that you have undertaken the mileage analysis/fares comparison/routing point analysis, or were you just guessing?

The National Rail Enquiries web site offers it as an option (with the connection timings) if you choose Audley End to Liverpool Street via Stansted Airport, and shows it at the same price as Audley End to Liverpool Street.

gner_ex

dzug1 wrote: »

I have a feeling that at one time the via Stansted route was not valid - maybe it's changed?

I was also thinking the same - the honest answer is that I don't know, but felt a little caution was needed just in case.

Thanks Altarf for your response.

caliston

Okey dokey, here we go...

Audley End has Routing Points Cambridge and Stansted Group. Stansted Group contains Stansted Airport and Stansted Mountfitchet. This is an interesting situation because Stansted isn't a Group for fares purposes.

As we have two Routing Points and we're not using the shortest route or a through train, we must use the Fares Rule to look at the fares:

Fares Stansted Airport-London Terminals:
SOS £17
SOR £26
No Saver ticket extant

Fares Stansted Mountfitchet-London Terminals:
CDR £12.80
SVR £18
SDS £12.20
SDR £18.80
No Open tickets extant

Fares Audley End-London Terminals:
CDS £13.70
CDR £13.80
SVR £25
SDS £15.40
SDR £23.80

Fares Cambridge-London Terminals:
CDR £18
SVR £27
SDS £17.90
SDR £30
SOR £35.80

So we're on a Saver Return. By the Fares Rule, via Cambridge isn't valid because the CBG-LON fare is more than the AUD-LON fare. So we need to use Routing Point Stansted Group.

The Routeing Guide says to use the Open fares to compare if the type of ticket being used doesn't exist to both Routing Points. But there's no overlap between the Airport and Audley End. I'm going to assume the prices from Mountfitchet. Indeed the Routing Guide says:

The stations listed at the bottom of this page are grouped together to improve interchange between trains by offering customers access to a wider choice of train services and station facilities. A customer may travel via any station in a group, including doubling back, provided that the group is on one of the permitted routes between their origin and destination stations. This extended availability is for interchange purposes only and does not apply where the origin or destination stations are part of a group.

For those fares that do compare, Audley End's fares are all more than Mountfitchet's, so you're pretty safe to use Stansted Group in any case. By the above quote there's no difference between passing through Mountfitchet or the Airport.

Anyway, Stansted Group to London uses map ST only. Map ST is Stansted Group to Liverpool St via Tottenham Hale, optionally via Edmonton Green. It's not valid via Stratford.

So I see no problem with travelling Audley End to London via Stansted Airport on a Saver or any other kind of ticket. In fact, given the train service, it's a fairly sensible thing to do.

dzug1

caliston wrote: »

. In fact, given the train service, it's a fairly sensible thing to do.

Not sure I agree with you there - the service from Audley End to Stansted is (or was in Central Trains days) very prone to cancellation. Late running trains (which came from Birmingham) would be turned around at Cambridge to preserve an on-time departure that way and never reach Stansted.

Maybe the new operator has improved things.

gner_ex

Caliston, thank you for doing that - you have more patience than me.

TheBearNecessities

I'm going from stansted to london on (sat) 4th october and back again the next day.

If I use thetrainline website to get a Mountfitchet to london £18 saver return will it be a valid ticket and will i have any problems using it?

thanks for the advice posted here folks, most helpful.

yorkie2

TheBearNecessities wrote: »

I'm going from stansted to london on (sat) 4th october and back again the next day.

If I use thetrainline website to get a Mountfitchet to london £18 saver return will it be a valid ticket and will i have any problems using it?

thanks for the advice posted here folks, most helpful.

A ticket from Stansted Mountfitchet to London is valid for that journey only, it is NOT valid for going into the Airport.

See post by caliston above - it IS valid to purchase a ticket from Audley End to London for use on Stansted Express from the Airport. I can confirm that the methodology used by caliston is correct, caliston appears to be one of the few people who fully understands the routeing guide!!:D

TheBearNecessities

so i could get an open return from stanstead for £26

or...

from Audley end, the CDR (cheap day return i presume) and SDR (standard day return i presume?), do you not need to be returning that same day ?

i'm confused :rotfl:

yorkie2

TheBearNecessities wrote: »

so i could get an open return from stanstead for £26

or...

from Audley end, the CDR (cheap day return i presume) and SDR (standard day return i presume?), do you not need to be returning that same day ?

i'm confused :rotfl:

Correct (although the fare names will have changed by then). So if going for more than 1 day you can only save £1 with the Saver (to be renamed Off Peak), so really it's not worth doing except for a day trip unfortunately