The MSE European Referendum? Poll results/discussion

nelly_2

Gorgeous_George wrote: »

Some members of the great British public shouldn't be allowed to decide which underwear to wear, never mind whether or not the country should be part of the EU.

That said, I'm impressed that 2,000 people have voted in a poll that doesn't start until next month.



GG

I decide underware by what mood im in if im happy then I opt for the hessian tanga briefs with kangaroo pouch gusset

If I'm in a bad mood I go for the taffeta incontinence pants with snake skin leg ties and white rhino horn buttons

Sundays I generally wear a thong back to front and stand in the trafford centre with just that on

Ive gone off the Trafford centre though cos security keep kicking me out for some reason

hbl_2

Any discussion of the EU immediately highlights the deep rooted ignorance, jingoism, nimbyism and xenophobia that is a perpetual black mark against the UK. Ignorance is not bliss people. Wake up.

I've read the European treaties and I've got no problem with free movement of goods, free movement of persons etc and on the whole it is a bloody good thing. The European Convention on Human Rights? Closest thing we've got to a bill of rights. Courts in the UK getting you down? Let's go to Strasbourg. Sick of your crummy job? Go work in Spain. Or Italy. Or Poland. No one is stopping you, in fact, I encourage it.

Also, the person who said that the UK contributes a disproportionate amount to the EU budget compared to France is flat wrong. In 2006, France contributed 4 billion more than the UK to the EU budget. If you want to talk about disproportion, then thank Germany who account for about 22% of the budget. Whether the budget is spent well enough is another debate altogether, but having read the recent UK budget, I'm not convinced that Westminster can do a better job of spending that money than the EU can.

And anybody else who says "they should bring back hanging" I'm just gonna have to confiscate the 21st Century from them. Yup, sorry, you can't be trusted with that, get back into your 20th Century hole with your Daily Mail and your wimperings about National Service.

One day people will realise that the EU is not some overpowering evil empire - every government in the UK has supported it since its inception, and it's only opposition party who bang on about it. But when they're in power? Different tune.

JimmyTheWig

hbl, While I agree some in the "no" camp suffer from what you say, there is much in this treaty that is not so welcome. What about the greater arms spending, or the moves towards more privatisation?

The enemy of your enemy isn't always your friend.

ShelfStacker_3

hbl wrote: »

Any discussion of the EU immediately highlights the deep rooted ignorance, jingoism, nimbyism and xenophobia that is a perpetual black mark against the UK. Ignorance is not bliss people. Wake up.

I've read the European treaties and I've got no problem with free movement of goods, free movement of persons etc and on the whole it is a bloody good thing. The European Convention on Human Rights? Closest thing we've got to a bill of rights. Courts in the UK getting you down? Let's go to Strasbourg. Sick of your crummy job? Go work in Spain. Or Italy. Or Poland. No one is stopping you, in fact, I encourage it.

Also, the person who said that the UK contributes a disproportionate amount to the EU budget compared to France is flat wrong. In 2006, France contributed 4 billion more than the UK to the EU budget. If you want to talk about disproportion, then thank Germany who account for about 22% of the budget. Whether the budget is spent well enough is another debate altogether, but having read the recent UK budget, I'm not convinced that Westminster can do a better job of spending that money than the EU can.

And anybody else who says "they should bring back hanging" I'm just gonna have to confiscate the 21st Century from them. Yup, sorry, you can't be trusted with that, get back into your 20th Century hole with your Daily Mail and your wimperings about National Service.

One day people will realise that the EU is not some overpowering evil empire - every government in the UK has supported it since its inception, and it's only opposition party who bang on about it. But when they're in power? Different tune.

Well said that man! It's depressing to see people ranting incoherently against something they're entirely ignorant of, save for a few slippery slope type logical fallacies from the media.

The EU has been overwhelmingly beneficial for the UK, despite the crap the Mail and others put out. The Lisbon treaty will enable us to continue that upward trend, and even better enable us to better influence the decisions the EU makes. It even gives us the right to leave, for christ's sake!

Primrose

Why on earth should I vote to support an organisation that for the past few years has had its auditors refuse to ratify their accounts? If this were a private company conducting its affairs in this manner, they would be in trouble. I'm sure that that corruption and gross incompetence exists on a large scale within the EEC administration and our taxes are helping to prop it up and perpetuate it. I have no problems with a Free Trading Environment but let's confine the boundaries there. The EEC has created a huge structure of overpaid Fat Cats,and maintaining the cost of them probably largely negates any financial benefits we have received. I want my country back please.

ps646566

The problem isn't solely the EU. Many other countries seem happy to be full and enthusiastic members of it. In some cases this is because they get a lot of money out of it, but that's not the whole story.

The real problem is our politicians and public officials. Britain is an incredibly poorly governed country, and the handling of Europe is a prime example of this. We pay in a lot more money than we get out, for no apparently sound reason. This is because Heath accepted this premise in his desperation to join up at any price, and apart from Margaret Thatcher's rebate 'blip, successive governments have not had the ability or the will to get it changed.

We appear to accept every piece of EU regulation as gospel, often even embellishing it. Whereas other countries appear to treat what the EU says as optional, if they don't agree with it. Look how long France was allowed to ban our beef, against a EU directive. Would we have done that if the boot was on the other foot ? I don't think so.

We could get a lot more out of being in the EU if our politicians had bottle, vision, backbone, and bargaining ability, if we did not have a foreign office whose aim in life is to sell out British interests to the lowest bidder, and if our public bodies were not full of ridiculous, pettifogging jobsworths who delight in using the EU as an excuse to regulate our lives to the upmost.

PS I'm not a Daily Mail reader, but I think I would bring back hanging for those who cannot express an opinion in an internet forum without resorting to accusing their protagonists of following that newspaper's alleged views. They obviously have no self-awareness of how much this tired, hackneyed old jibe discredits them and the views that they express, and makes them appear shallow, immature, and silly.

Mark7799

Agree so much with ps.

I've always wondered why no-one in England (using the word carefully) seems to have much enthusiasm for the EU. Is it island race mentality or an ambition to be a big fish in a small pond? It's been puzzling me for ages as to why the English aren't enthusiastic about Europe.

Mark7799

rcherryuk wrote: »

Agreed, Does anyone else remember how much information was given to us to enable us to make an educated decision when the UK voted to join the Common Market in 1973?

Also in the 1997 General Election I was doorstepped by a lackey from Goldsmiths Referendum Party who asked if I would vote for them so " We can have a Referendum and get out of Europe" when I asked what would happen if we had a referendum ad voted to stay in?

He literally ran away!!

Rob

We were taken in to Europe after a parliamentary vote in 1972 (membership effective from 1/1/73). It was the referendum in 1975 that produced all the paper.

rcherryuk

Primrose wrote: »

Why on earth should I vote to support an organisation that for the past few years has had its auditors refuse to ratify their accounts? If this were a private company conducting its affairs in this manner, they would be in trouble.

Not quite true.
The Court of Auditors cannot sign off the accounts of the Commision because, yet again, it cannot account for all the funds it has spent. Where did these funds go? To Member State Governments to pay for certain projects. The MSG must pass back all proofs of payments for these funds (ie an Invoice from the construction company/consultant). This often does not happen, The Commision knows where every cent is,however the Parliament will not force the relevant Member States to provide proof or repay, even though they have been asked several times!

More accurate,but much more boring!

Just don't believe everything you read/hear**/see in the media

** Radio 4 are often woefully 'wrong' regarding EU news.

Rob

zed_sump

don't want to be governed by un-elected people in Brussels.
as much as there isn't much difference in the attributes, intentions or ambitions of many of the UK politicians in the British government at the moment, atleast they're democratically elected by us. going euro = losing the right to vote for our own government.
one world rule no thank you.