PCN for box Junction

flang

cajef wrote: »

Once again you are making an incorrect and misleading statement, they are NOT illegal, get your facts straight.:rolleyes:

May I make a suggestion that you read section 12 of chapter 5 & The traffic signs regulations and general directions 2002.
Wording can sometimes be interpreted differently between engineers

cyclonebri1

Wig wrote: »

If you did not stop, and the photos do not prove you stopped then you can appeal. They have to show you stopped that means 2 photos with the car in the same position over a period of time.

I suppose you could write back and ask them to supply photos which prove an offence was committed.

Also you could look into the box placement and dimensions, if it isn't correct, they can't enforce it. I think it was Peter999 who went on about all this a while back.

Totally agree surely if the 2 pictures are different it does not prove the car stopped, in fact it proves the car was moving during that time frame. Moving very slowly is not being stopped. For example when required to stop at a stop sign on a junction, this also has to be only for a nano second, also as pointed out to me by a copper, in the event of an accident it is a requirement to stop or else failure to stop. The guys thats hit me stopped, but 1/2 sec later he was off again - no failing to stop offence.

So surely the converse must apply?

And if you did stop then tough, it's a fair cop if you didn't then wriggle;)

Bob63

flang wrote: »

May I make a suggestion that you read section 12 of chapter 5 & The traffic signs regulations and general directions 2002.

May I make a suggestion that you read section 12 of chapter 5 and pay attention to some of the subsections.

12.3 The Directions do not permit the use of yellow box markings at roundabouts unless traffic entering the box is controlled by signals at all times - Traffic lights mentioned here and legally mandated.

12.6 Box markings are no substitute for traffic signals. They can however help to improve traffic flow at junctions where blocking back causes obstruction. - Traffic lights mentioned but not mandated

12.9 Yellow box markings may be used outside police, fire, ambulance stations or hospitals only where there is an access road forming a junction with the main road - Traffic lights not mentioned

12.10 Half-boxes, in which only half the area of the junction is marked (diagram 1044) are appropriate at “T” junctions and other junctions where the traffic blocks back from one direction only. - Traffic lights not mentioned

12.13 Box markings are sometimes effective in combination with priority signs to break queues through an exceptionally narrow pinch point and enable an opposing flow to continue without unnecessary delay - no mention at all of traffic lights

So on the basis that in just one situation the use of traffic signals is mandated, you state that all yellow boxes not controlled by traffic signals are illegal? That is a very strange way to interpret things.

cajef

flang wrote: »

May I make a suggestion that you read section 12 of chapter 5 & The traffic signs regulations and general directions 2002.

I have read them, can you point out exactly where it states

'that box markings that are not within a traffic signal junction are illegal.'

I cannot see the word illegal in any of the chapters there.

KIIZA

Thanks Cheesy.mike. I have asked them to send me another set of pictures to prove that i stopped in the box. I also sent the llettter by email

KIIZA

I have asked tfl to send me another set of pictures and also requested to see the video.

Antioch3

I also just received a PCn for box junction in lewisham way/ parkfield, I was not aware of going into a box junction so I went back and looked. Coming from Parkfield Road I could see that virtually all the box had faded and so on a bad weather visibility day it would seem like no box's, I took photographs and sent them to tfl by email as they quite clearly show no clear visibility yellow box's but the red lines can be seen quite clear.

Daily mail had a story “Driver wins yellow box challenge”. Boxes were faded. In fact hundreds win their appeal if photo evidence shows faded lines or boxes. They have to be maintained regularly because faded lines cause entrapment. They know that most people just pay and accept judgement and so the maintenance crew are given the wink to overlook keeping the lines nice and bright. More stealth tax for the borough.

But now they have been forced now to even allow the 50% off fine if paid within 14 days to be allowed for those that appeal before the 14 days are up. So if you lose the appeal you can still pay only half the fine

My advice take photographs and send in appeal. here is my photograph I took..