Which fence do we own?

subjecttocontract

setmefree2 wrote: »

Hi

So I've got the deeds out - no "T" on any of the gardens boundaries....so does that mean if my neighbour has built a wall (part of that wall forms an intergral part of her brick built garden shed) and has put trellis up that is on her side of the wall (and grown plants all over it - none on our side) that we can reasonably expect her to maintain it?

P.s. also read all the olde English in the Indentures and assignments can see no mention of fences...

Why didn't you ask what you were getting for the money when you bought the house ? Surely you could have asked the vendor directly or thru your solicitor ?

setmefree2

Hi,

The man who sold us the house, owned our house and the one next door. He didn't answer the question "Which fence do you own/maintain?" when asked by the solicitor - he just left it blank. He didn't want us to know that he owned the house next door (and this wasn't revealed until the day we moved in.) Until recently I'd assumed that is why he left it blank. Since we had people trying to gazump us even 2 months into the purchase, it actually didn't seem that important at the time. However, now I think there was a dispute with the other neighbour over the fence (again not revealed! - what's the point in asking anyone anything - everybody just lies!:mad:) she says it was his and he wouldn't maintain it, so she had to but now wants us to. He said it was her responsibility.....

....so I was just trying to find out which one we are responsible for

saggingvenus

Hi there is a question in the Seller's Property Information Form (pre-hips/new transaction protocol forms - cant remember all the details for the new forms but no doubt it will also be in one of them and can check if you need me to - just PM) which asks whether there are any disputes or have been. Your seller should have noted this dispute.

The boundary responsiblity, if shown, will be in the copy of deeds from Land Registry. Doesn't always show though. I live in a terraced cottage and my deeds show everything dating back to when the land was originally sold in 1825. However, some other cottages in the terrace don't show the history of the deeds. Might be worth checking the deeds for other properties in the terrace/development. Land Registry offer an online facility to download copy title deeds at £6 per set (£3 if you know the title number). If you don't know the title number, it may be possible for you to do an index map search for neigbouring properties at the land registry which are free - they only charge for replies if the land you are searching contains excessive title numbers.

setmefree2

I don't think anyone will admit to having a dispute these days will they? I think our neighbour (call him A) - the one who sold us the house - would say there was no dispute. He just refused to maintain the fence. The neighbour (Call her who says it was his responsibility (& now our responsiblity) obviously can't have know this for sure, I don't think. We have the deeds (1905)- on the drawing of the land the house is red, the land is blue (front & back garden) and there is no mention of fences - nor in the document starting "this indenture".....

subjecttocontract

saggingvenus wrote: »

Hi there is a question in the Seller's Property Information Form (pre-hips/new transaction protocol forms - cant remember all the details for the new forms but no doubt it will also be in one of them and can check if you need me to - just PM) which asks whether there are any disputes or have been. Your seller should have noted this dispute.

.......and if its NOT been declared YOU have a legal claim against the vendor for compensation. He has a duty to declare disputes......you are not expected to get a surprise after you purchase.

Go back to your solicitor and tell him that there is an undeclared dispute and you want compensation from the vendor.

saggingvenus

Thanks STC after forgetting to mention boundaries in original post I then overlooked the point of mentioning the 'unmentioned' dispute!

setmefree2

Hi

TBH I'm not that grumpy - I'm just trying to work out which fence I have a legal responsibilty for - if any. Life's messy - I don't mind that.

Richard_Webster

I don't think anyone will admit to having a dispute these days will they? I think our neighbour (call him A) - the one who sold us the house - would say there was no dispute. He just refused to maintain the fence. The neighbour (Call her who says it was his responsibility (& now our responsiblity) obviously can't have know this for sure, I don't think. We have the deeds (1905)- on the drawing of the land the house is red, the land is blue (front & back garden) and there is no mention of fences - nor in the document starting "this indenture".....

So if there's nothing in the documents there is no general maintenance responsibility. If the wall falls down then the neighbour doesn't have to replace it and neither do you.

If the wall falls and causes damage or injury then if it is sufficiently serious then it might be worthwhile trying to determine who owns it, because that could lead to a civil liability for the injury/damage. However this is pretty rare so unfortunately we are left with this vague situation where most of the time people are reliant on a local understanding in a particualr road or group of houses as to who owns which fence. Ownership on its own does not bring responsibility to maintain so as to ensure there is a fence/wall in situ in good condition, only not to cause injury to others.

setmefree2

Hi Richard,

So the situation is this:-

-The deeds appear to have nothing on them about fences- No "T".
-The wall was built by our neighbour and part of the wall forms part of our neighbours brick built shed. The wall is in excellent condition.
-the wall has a trellis on top which is starting to rot (just the top). Trellis is anchored to wall in neighbours garden. We have no acccess to it. Neighbour grows climbers on trellis. There are no plants growing on fence from our garden.
- My neighbour (2 doors down) maintains the right hand fence. The disputed fence is on the left. The previous owner of our house would not maintain the fence on the left as he said it wasn't his.

So therefore, can I conclude that it's not our responsibility. Have I got enough of a legal argument going here?

subjecttocontract

.....and even if it were your neighbours 'responsibility' to maintain the fence you cant make him do it. Thats why you very often see a brand new fence erected against an old fence.....one neighbour owns one and won't maintain it so next door have put up their own.