Advice on dealing with insurers (O2 Insure)

Cavey

I took out O2 Insure's Gold cover for £4.99 per month. Terms and conditions are here -

http://www.o2.co.uk/termsconditions/insurance

I broke my phone (XDA Trion) just after Christmas and have had to resort to using a spare handset (Motorola V500) which is a little old and acting a little dodgy.

Now while my claim was sucessful, you may have noticed that it's about three weeks after I b0rked my phone and O2 do not have any Trion's in stock so I haven't had a new phone. According to the terms and conditions...

Section 4 – Replacement Equipment

In the event of You making a successful Claim under this contract that results in Us replacing Your Equipment We will endeavour to replace Your Equipment with a model of similar specification. The replacement may be a different model, be made by a different manufacturer and may not include the identical features, functions
and data capability as Your Equipment. We reserve the right to provide replacements which have been reconditioned. Exclusions applying to all sections:
This policy does not cover You for:

A. Excess
An excess of the first £25 will apply in respect of each Claim You make.

Now funnily enough, I want a phone that has the features of the Trion (that's why I bought the damn thing in the first place) and do not wish to be fobbed off with some phone that doesn't do what I want it to do and am therefore wary about playing the "I want it now" card (plus I have all the accessories), but I want to get them to hurry up.

So is there a way to speed things up without getting one of the "alternative" phones that I don't want? Could I request a different phone, perhaps newer and not on their initial list, that does do what I want, that they do have in stock and pay the difference?

Or should I go buy one on eBay and try to get my insurance premium's back?

Anyone got any advice or thoughts?

sohurt

Hi

The 'newer, better phone' usually only works when the original handset has been discontinued and no longer physically available, if they are simply out of stock, they should have a delivery date of when it is coming in, and will expect you to wait for it...

Hope this helps

Cavey

sohurt wrote: »

Hi

The 'newer, better phone' usually only works when the original handset has been discontinued and no longer physically available, if they are simply out of stock, they should have a delivery date of when it is coming in, and will expect you to wait for it...

Hope this helps

It does help, thank you.

Any idea on how long is reasonable to wait?

And by discontinued, do you mean that they don't sell it any more?

sohurt

Sorry just realised you had replied..

It shouldn't be too long as when a handset goes out of stock we get a date of delivery for new stock - have you phoned and asked them for this?

And yes, discontinued means that handset is no longer available through that network for new customers, meaning that if yours cant be repaired (if broken) or replaced (if lost/stolen) you get offered an alternative.

Cavey

sohurt wrote: »

Sorry just realised you had replied..

It shouldn't be too long as when a handset goes out of stock we get a date of delivery for new stock - have you phoned and asked them for this?

And yes, discontinued means that handset is no longer available through that network for new customers, meaning that if yours cant be repaired (if broken) or replaced (if lost/stolen) you get offered an alternative.

Don't worry about taking your time, I am quite patient (read stubborn ).

They said something along the lines of early to mid January, but given the general lack of availability of HTC phones it wouldn't surprise me if it takes them longer.... just a bit disappointed I guess.

And the reason why I asked about discontinued was due to it no longer being available on the O2 online shop (although I don't know about the retail outlets).

And being a cunning/scheming little git, I asked sales if they had any, and they don't Was worth a try I guess.

The screen is very cracked (four places). To get it fixed by a third party is £95 all-in (if they can find the parts, which I understand to be very hard to come by) and eBay are going for £90 to £150.

I might ring up again tomorrow and see if I can get an expected time and an email address (as I find it easier to communicate that way... or easier to get a record of what they say).

sohurt

Hi

The sales department/returns and insurance all have different stock levels and delivery times..so while the sales department may have a handset in stock, the insurers might not, because they are 3rd party. They should definetely have a spreadsheet with all the handsets they have run out of and an expected delivery date.

To be honest, I would be inclined to just wait it out for a new handset to come in, if you push, they may 'find' a reconditioned one from somewhere to send you...

Cavey

I got tired of waiting. It has been three and a half weeks and I had a worried phone call from my parents last night as they couldn't get through to my phone (old, beaten Moto V500 which claims it has signal, it's just a little dodgy having been dropped three or four too many times).

I rang them up and asked what they were doing. Turns out they were "still waiting" for Trions before they called me, then the nice lady (Sam?) pointed out I would be waiting a while as the Trion was discontinued. I was offered the Sony Ericcsson P1i (errm no), any blackberry (definitly not for me), XDA Argon (even heavier than the Trion) or XDA Orbit (no keyboard).

I rang off so I could look them up. Out of the options, the Orbit was the only phone I would want to carry, but without the keyboard I would be waiting for my next upgrade to get something which had one. And so, after a pep talk from my better half, I rang them back.

A chap named Ash answered. Firstly, I asked if the phones were reconditioned, he explained they were not. Secondly, I asked if it was possible to pay the difference and get another phone that was not on the list. He said no, but if there was something else I wanted he would explore the possibility of providing it. I pointed out the XDA Stellar which, like the Trion, I could use to admin my Linux box (add the Putty mobile client and a hardware keyboard - yes, I am a geek - and it would be suitable) as well as the other stuff I used my phone for (mobile web, MMS, phone calls, calendar etc...).

The chap didn't know why it was not offered before, unless my claim was in the time between the last Trion order arriving and the Trion being discontinued and them not having the Stellar in stock.

Either way, I believe a new phone (XDA Stellar) will be arriving tomorrow and my poor, deceased Trion will be taken away. (I'll let you know if it doesn't).

Overall, it took a while to sort it out and I had to put up with my old handset for a while, but I guess I consider myself to be pleased with the outcome and am back to thinking that the insurance I am paying for is not a waste of money.

Woody123_2

My daughter had her phone stolen/lost on day 1 of a music festival and didn't get home until 3 days later. She went to lost property at the festival twice to see if it had turned up with no joy. As soon as I found out about it we rang the police and got a crime number and then rang O2. They have turned down the claim on the grounds that it was not reported to the police within 48 hours. As it was not possible for her to do this (i.e. no phone and no transport) do you think they are being unreasonable and if so, what can I do? I have sent begging letter to them, but I doubt it will count for anything!

Cavey

The terms insurers impose are rubbish. Always will be, they need them to make sure they don't lose too much money fulfilling valid claims. Problem is, you agree to them when you sign up.

Other problem is if the argument that if there are thousands of people at the reading festival, surely there is someone there you can borrow the a phone from to report your phone stolen or at least ring home and get your parents on the case.

How long was the delay before you informed the police? When did you inform O2? If these are reasonably quick I would expect that you could either appeal to them for a bit of leeway or go and seek legal advice on whether you could threaten legal action over an unfair term in the contract.

bringmeshoes

just to let you know that the o2 insurance is a third party called Marsh so it is them that set the terms and conditions not o2. The t&c's will probably have been checked over by their legal team to make sure that they are legal so seeking legal advice would be unlikley to get anywhere

Cavey

bringmeshoes wrote: »

just to let you know that the o2 insurance is a third party called Marsh so it is them that set the terms and conditions not o2. The t&c's will probably have been checked over by their legal team to make sure that they are legal so seeking legal advice would be unlikley to get anywhere

Companies will try to get away with anything until someone challenges them. Look what happened over bank charges. The legal advice you get may be "You're screwed", "I have no idea, it has never been tested" or may be "Well there's no precedent, so let's make things better".

A quick google later I found there was a bill relating to unfair contract terms in 1977 which I think was updated in 2003 and might now be this -

Unfair Contract Terms Bill at Lawcom.gov.uk

Part 2 is the useful bit on consumer contracts. Has fun things such as

1. If a term of a consumer contract is detrimental to the consumer, the business cannot rely on the term unless the term is fair and reasonable.

Section 4 then has 5 further sub-sections of what isn't included in subsection 1. 3, 5 and 6 are price related, 4 says the term stands if it is enshrined in law covers initial definitions (the bit at the start of the contract where it defines "You", "Us" etc...), so if you think this term is unfair or unreasonable it could be that it should not apply.

Clearly, I'm not a legal expert and don't have a knowledge of case law, but there was a story on Out-law with the headline "Unfair insurance law should be changed, says Law Commission". So who knows, perhaps this clause that the customer has to have a Police number for a lost phone and that it must be reported within 48 hours could actually be unfair and the companies could be taking us for a ride.