Grade II listed property

greenbee

I’ve just been doing training on retrofitting historic buildings - looking at how to interpret planning/work with planning and building control, materials, what works when/were etc. There are some fantastic case studies of retrofits, so it is possible to do (although not cheap) but you probably need to do a lot of detailed research or work with an architect or builder who specialises in retrofits and has experience of Georgian buildings in particular, and by the sounds of it, working with English Heritage. I’ve seen more than one building the same ages as yours or older sympathetically restored and retrofitted so they are warm and draught=free.

And no, I”m not looking for work - I did the training as a householder, but if you’re interested I can send you the details.

Scot_39

1. Would a smart meter fit if the hub (top 2+") was cabled instead of on top - piicy of one makes meter top link here Kaifa fl100- and the hub installed in a cradle - think the long cable only 1m (at least 2 suppliers customers have posted had / had similar fitted in past)?

https://www.smartme.co.uk/comms-hubs/

1. Similarly 20m for the gas can sometimes be fixed using alt han equipment - a battery powered unit at the gas meter - wireless connection to a wireless to alt-han relay 13A socket plug in unit - talks to the meter. So B4/B3 combo as

https://www.smartme.co.uk/home-area-network

Have you had any serious investigation from specialist insulation / building companies - of internal modifications you would be allowed to improve thermal performance ?

The chances are the secondary glazing does work - but the windows loss saving hidden given all your wall and roof losses. But every little helps as they say.

Materials are often key to maintain "breathability" so the normal - often cheaper materials and fixes probably wont work. Due to damp risk.

The restricted options might not be cheap - but if it's a long term home - quick searches suggest seems some can have wool rather than fibre / synthetic loft insulation, options like hempcrete on interior of walls, and are things like hidden door sealants strips suitable.

Google came up with a list - and linked this page from one such firm (there will be others probably local even to you) - with several potential options - which you may or may not have come across.

https://mitchellanddickinson.co.uk/knowledge-hub/is-internal-wall-insulation-allowed-in-a-grade-ii-listed-home/

Is the property unique - or are there similar around your area ? If unique - wondering if EH might have some guidance already as to what has been done to similar properrties.

Emily_Joy

We have quite a few listed buildings in our small town in Warwickshire and there have been some community meetings where owners share their energy saving experience and practical tips. Perhaps there is something similar where you are based?

drspouse

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82157336#Comment_82157336

It comes up for me: stopgaps dot com

squirrelpie

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82159385#Comment_82159385

Try following the link and try to buy some! As I said, it's not available. 😪

drspouse

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82159407#Comment_82159407

Ah, I misunderstood - I thought the website wasn't available.

Amazon get enough of our money as it is, but I will link to them anyway.

We found it helpful on our conservation area, Victorian floorboards. It was also helpful for toddlers thinking they could put CDs from the car down the floorboards (but the toddlers are both teens now and we don't have CDs any more).

Stop G-P

QuietRadiator

One thing that might explain the "can't even hang a picture" problem, which someone above picked up on: a Grade II listing on its own normally covers alterations that affect the building's character, and a lot of internal, reversible work goes through listed building consent without much drama. A covenant from the organisation that restored it is a separate private agreement and can be much stricter than the listing. So it may be the covenant, not the listing, that's really boxing you in. It's worth getting a copy and reading exactly what it says, then asking the covenant holder and the council's conservation officer together what they would agree to, rather than assuming the answer is no.

If you do get a hearing, the roof is probably your biggest lever. With no loft, it means insulating between or under the rafters from inside. On an old building that has to be done with breathable (vapour-open) materials and with ventilation thought through, so it's very much a consent-and-specialist job, not DIY. But it tends to help in both seasons: less heat escaping in winter, and less sun-baked roof heat coming through upstairs in summer.

Smaller things that usually get through consent because they're reversible and invisible from outside:

• Have a joiner ease and re-hang the doors so they actually close square, then add discreet seals. Brushes on a door that doesn't fit don't do much.
• Secondary glazing only performs if it's well sealed. If the existing units have gaps round the edges, that may be why you notice no difference.
• Heavy lined curtains, or internal shutters if the windows have them, closed at dusk in winter.
• For summer: keep curtains or blinds shut on the sunny side during the day, keep windows shut while it's hotter outside than in, then open up at night for a through-draught.

Agree with the others on heating the rooms you use rather than the whole house. With walls like that, trying to hold the whole place at temperature is always going to be brutal.

rural_dweller

As owner of grade 2 1750s black and white cottage I sympathise. Deep loft insulation laid over the ceiling was our most effective add on. Our loft is a cold loft and there is no sarking under the tiles, so plenty of airflow up there! No lbc needed as it is a non permanent non invasive solution. We run a big log burner and 8 night storage heaters. Accessing economy7 is a must and you can then consider battery storage if you have an opportunity. The log burner is 12kW so oversized but we keep the room door open so heat carries to the rest of the house. We burn our own wood -about 1 1/2 cords a winter, lit evenings unless really cold when it runs all day. For outside doors you can source a heavy door curtain that works with a hinged hanger ie it opens with the door. No drafts. Also ensure that any unused chimney has a chimney balloon fitted. This is also a big heat saver. For windows that have space you can fit a thermal blind with channels that discretely fit to the window surround, similar to secondary glazing (we also have new leaded lights with single glaze 3mm glass but our windows are not too big. Our house, although single brick , stays cool in the summer. I have a wisteria and a passiflora criniforrnum(?) (Passion flower vine) on the south side. This helps keep the south aspect cooler in summer. Not all of the night storage heaters are on usually. You need to work these to suit your time in and use of the house. We average 12,000kWh of economy 7 usage in a year (+5,000kWh peak). 4 beds. Our worst times are when the wind blows and we get a draft around each of the infill panels where the oak timber squares are infilled, either with brick or insulated panel with stainless steel mesh (approved replacement which places less stress on the structure). Healthy to have that many air changes when using a wood burning stove though!

mangoChecko

Hello,

You may find useful advice from the Society for the Protection of Ancient Buildings (SPAB)). They have a technical advice line and also run training and awareness courses.

There is a lot you can do with heritage materials and techniques which means there is no reason to be cold. There is benefit to understanding how old buildings work.

Also highly recommend Carrington Lime who run heritage skills training and are expert in repair and maintenance of old buildings.