VARS fine for fuel - cashier didn't charge me

Car1980

It sets a persuasive precedent.

A very high level judge, but only a county court case.

It's the only time the matter has ever gone in front a judge, and nobody has ever tried again in the 14 years since.

So, to all practical intents and purposes, it's binding.

MrJenkinsEsq

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82151074#Comment_82151074

Not everyone is willing or able to pay a demand just because it arrives on a letterhead. Some people can't find an extra £35 at short notice and others, quite rightly imo, simply won't pay something they don't owe.

On the camera review and tracking fees, the Court of Appeal has set out when staff time can be claimed as a loss. The business has to prove the staff were actually diverted from their normal work and that this caused significant disruption to the business (Aerospace Publishing Ltd v Thames Water Utilities Ltd [2007] EWCA Civ 3).

The Oxford court applied that to a retail recovery claim and threw out the staff time, admin and security costs because the retailer would have spent the same money anyway. Checking CCTV and till records is part of running a petrol forecourt.

Coupon-mad

"That would have saved the retailer the cost of camera review & tracking service fees."

@sheenas

There are no such costs or fees charged to the retailer.

VARS are primarily a parking operator and that sector 'rejoices' in running ANPR cameras and systems free of charge to their clients. At the vast majority of locations, this rogue, unregulated industry relies wholly on income from pursuing and frightening people into paying more than is lawful.

sheenas

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82151284#Comment_82151284

collection service like Paymyfuel and Fueldriveoff are not free services and then there are service like Forecourt Eye for the camera's. So I don't agree it's free.

Definitely all these services should be regulated to many rogues in the business.

lionking2022

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82151524#Comment_82151524

Them spending time and effort to send these letters is their job and any costs associated is the cost of business. Tacking on charges that not contractually valid is fraud. If they want to make money, they should be charging the petrol stations money for the service…

Coupon-mad

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82151524#Comment_82151524

They aren't using Paymyfuel or Fueldriveoff which I've never heard of.

ForecourtEye and VARS tech both operate free and the business costs of cameras are not charged to the landowners.

QDR also operate on a no-win-no-fee basis. There is no cost to the retailers.

MrJenkinsEsq

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82151524#Comment_82151524

The test is not whether the business pays for something, it is whether it would have paid for it regardless of a given specific breach. Costs of doing business cannot be claimed back as damages. Most of these operations are offered to businesses for free so the question of loss doesn't even arise.

sheenas

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82151574#Comment_82151574

It's definitely not part of the T&C. Which require you to pay prior to leaving the forecourt.

Rather than carry drifting the tread of course. Lets agree to disagree on this one.

MrJenkinsEsq

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82152500#Comment_82152500

Even if a VARS sign were prominent enough to be incorporated, and the ones I've seen aren't, it still wouldn't bind anyone in VARS's favour, because VARS never become a party to anything. The price on the big roadside sign is the invitation. The driver makes the offer by lifting the nozzle. The forecourt accepts by releasing the pump. Where in that did VARS offer anything, accept anything or give anything in return?

The thread only drifted because a few points needed correcting, and they needed correcting because people will find this later and could end up paying money they don't owe.

Car1980

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82151524#Comment_82151524

Bear in mind these are consciously incorporated into their pricing. If a business didn't take into account business rates, card surcharges, utilities etc. they wouldn't make a profit.

But if you didn't pay a private parking notice, they can't claim they have lost £xx worth of utilities, rates and staff wages from the very fact they have an office. If they make 80% profit on their stupid charges, that incorporates the non-payers. Which is why some of their arguments are so funny because they apparently exist to break even at the end of the day and are teetering at the edge of bankruptcy at all times.