Parking space problems

SarahB16

Did the planning permission assign one space as a visitor space?

Can you see what was approved on the planning portal and see if there have been any subsequent revisions where the other households have one car parking space but your house was assigned two?

Did perhaps the housing developer seek to vary the approved planning permission so that your house has two car parking spaces?

thrifty_not_tight

I've tried looking but I can't see it in the Portol.…there are hundreds to trawl through.

I did call Redrow when this first came to light in to see if they had a clearer copy but they said they don't keep records for that length of time.

RelievedSheff

Download copies of your neighbours title plans from the Land Registry site and see what they say.

silvercar

The development is 20 years old, so what was on the original planning permission is largely irrelevant. What you need is the deeds of your house to clearly show your parking spaces. As a secondary check, the deeds of neighbouring properties should show their parking places. Hopefully there is no overlap.

If there is a marked parking space “on the ground” and neither you nor your neighbours have it on their deeds, it’s safe to assume it is a visitor bay.

Often the case that people negotiate with the developer to gain additional parking, often the developer will happily do so, particularly for the last few plots. There may also have been a sale and purchase of a parking space between neighbours at some point. Occasionally these fail to make it to the deeds, until someone has an issue.

Section62

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82089756#Comment_82089756

The development is 20 years old, so what was on the original planning permission is largely irrelevant.

The original planning consent will give a guide, and is still relevant if the requirement for visitor spaces in specific locations was part of a condition. If the plans don't show any visitor spaces, but a condition requires that a minimum of 'x' visitor spaces were provided then it was left to the developer to decide where to put the visitor spaces. If the plans show visitor spaces and there is a condition saying visitor spaces must be provided in accordance with the approved plan then that is definitive (subject to no subsequent variations of the condition)

What you need is the deeds of your house to clearly show your parking spaces.

This is the OP's conundrum - the OP's deeds show they own the land of two parking spaces, but they don't appear to be shown in any way to be visitor spaces. It is possible for someone own land, but not the exclusive right to park on it. Therefore one of the two spaces the OP owns could be a visitor space, just not shown correctly on the plan the OP has.

The OP either needs to prove the second space isn't for visitors, or else ask the neighbour to provide proof that it is a visitor space.

Fundamentally, if there is a dispute then the OP can only enforce their exclusive right to park in both spaces (assuming that is the correct legal position) by imposing control over the spaces - either by physical means (e.g. a lockable bollard), or else going down a legal route to get an injunction (or similar) requiring the offending neighbours to stop parking there. The lockable bollard would be the easier option, subject to having the right to install one. It won't necessarily be good for neighbourly relations though.

Boohoo

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82089746#Comment_82089746

Good idea but can get expensive at £7.50 a pop.

If you are lucky to get the the right info from the neighbours deeds in 2 or 3 goes then good.

silvercar

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82089783#Comment_82089783

If the OP owns the land and their deeds don't say anything about having to allow access by anyone else, then that is definitive. The title deeds are the law. If the developers have breached their planning permission, they need to provide visitor parking spaces elsewhere (which they may have done some distance from OPs house on a large development).

I would say the burden of proof is not on OP. OP has the proof in the title deeds that they own the space, with no clauses in their deeds to show any rights over their spaces. Let whoever else thinks they have rights show their proof.

It could easily be that the previous owner only had one car and didn't use their second space and took no interest in who parked there.

Boohoo

Section62 makes some very good points.

Lockable bollard is good but will annoy one or more neighbours and what will stop them from parking Infront of the bollard?

This could all end in tears.

Section62

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82089854#Comment_82089854

If the OP owns the land and their deeds don't say anything about having to allow access by anyone else, then that is definitive. The title deeds are the law.

Title deeds, like legal documents generally, are capable of containing errors though. They are only definitive if they are correct. If someone has forgotten to draw a 'V' on the plan, or tint the space on the plan the right colour then this doesn't, by itself, alter the legal status of the parking space.

If the developers have breached their planning permission, they need to provide visitor parking spaces elsewhere (which they may have done some distance from OPs house on a large development).

This was the point about why the original planning consent remains relevant. If the approved drawings/conditions require that this space is made available for visitors then it is fairly conclusive the neighbour is right. If the planning consent only requires 'x' spaces within the development without specifying where they are then the situation is less clear.

The developers obtained the original planning consent for the development, but the OP - as owner of the land and building constructed under that consent - is now also subject to that consent. It is they, not just the developer, who would be in breach if they took steps to stop visitors using the second space if the planning consent required that space to be for visitors.

I would say the burden of proof is not on OP. OP has the proof in the title deeds that they own the space, with no clauses in their deeds to show any rights over their spaces. Let whoever else thinks they have rights show their proof.

I agree. But my point was that it was one thing to require a neighbour to prove their visitors have a right to park on my land, but another to stop them parking on my land. Even if the OP can rebut the neighbour's claims, stopping other people parking there won't necessarily be easy.

thrifty_not_tight

My immediate neighbours aren't the issue. We are amiable. Tends to people from other parts of the estate. Sometimes I just don't where they have come from.

We could just be the annoying neighbour who moves vehicles about so that either the works van/own car permanently occupies that space.

I just wanted to be sure I was in the right in case someone confronted me.

I don't know what the answer is long term to the parking situation short of knocking down trees and creating more spaces which is don't believe in doing.

There is a management company but they are only interested in collecting payment and paying to have grass cut and a pond maintained.