Brother Marcus Restauarnt Scam?

TeaAndCrumpets

Hello! Today I went for brunch with some friends at popular London chain restaurant Brother Marcus. When we received the bill, added to our total was a charitable donation, a 13.5% service charge, and a 15% “tax” (it didn’t specify what kind of tax). Our understanding is that (1) a menu usually includes VAT in the prices, and if it doesn’t do so, that it is legally required to state on the menu that the prices exclude VAT and (2) VAT is 20%, not 15%. This menu did not say anything about excluding VAT from its prices. We therefore checked with the manager who confirmed VAT is included in the prices, so that’s not what this charge is.

When we asked then what is this extra “tax” charge for, she was unable to give us an answer other than to say that “all restaurants do this” and that it was a requirement. I certainly haven’t seen this before!! If VAT is already included in the prices, and service charge has been added to the bill separately, what could this extra 15% “tax” possibly be? We refused to pay it as we had received no explanation, but I think this is an issue if they are sneakily adding an extra 15% to every persons bill for a “tax” that doesn’t exist.

user1977

I suspect your latter explanation is the most likely (assuming it's not merely some sort of c0ck-up and they meant to charge only one of 13.5% or 15% for service).

Grumpy_chap

Well, the small print in the menu says "A discretionary optional service charge of 13.5% will be added to your bill. All the money is shared between the team that looked after you today. If for any reason you felt the service you received was not up to scratch, please let us know and we’ll remove it for you."

The 15% seems to be a double-charge on that service charge, perhaps at a previous rate.

I did wonder whether the 15% is the VAT that calculates based on the total of the bill plus service charge but not VAT on the service charge. The maths don't support that. I don't know what the VAT rules are for service charges. Either way the prices should include VAT or be VERY clear if that is not the case.

flaneurs_lobster

The iffy bit (apart from charging anything over and above that already described) is describing this 15% charge as a "tax", usually defined as "a mandatory financial charge collected by a government from individuals and businesses". Claiming that they are collecting monies on behalf of the Government when not doing so is probably fraud.

VAT is always included in the prices shown on a menu, although unusually it may be "split out" of the total on the bill. If you were seeing this entry on a bill then as you say the rate of VAT is 20%.

As @user1977 says, probably a male chicken-up, poor that the manager wasn't able to just say so and take it off the bill without making up stories about "all restaurants add a phantom 15% to the bill".

General reviews of this small chain are good.

flaneurs_lobster

I don't know what the VAT rules are for service charges. Either way the prices should include VAT or be VERY clear if that is not the case.

VAT is charged on bill total plus service charge if the service charge is mandatory, otherwise not.

TeaAndCrumpets

Thank you all for the responses. I’m looking again at the bill, and the maths is making even less sense now! The service charge amount is not even correct I.e. it’s more than 13.5% of the total!? The VAT is split out at the bottom as is typical, so clear that that is already included within the “food total” price.

Food total: £80.80

Charity donation: £2 (subtotal: £82.80)

Service charge (13.5%): £12.60

Tax: £12.50

Total: £107.90

VAT: £15.54

It does seem to be the case then that they are adding roughly 15% and dishonestly labelling this as “tax”. Other than raising a query/complaint to the restaurant (which I have done), is there anything else I can do? Maybe a consumer protection group that I could report it to?

la531983

The VAT portion of the food is one sixth surely, so £13.47?

Where are they getting £15.54 from?

TeaAndCrumpets

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82001049#Comment_82001049

very confusing! I think maybe they’re also charging VAT on the service charge amount as well as food total? That gets you to (almost, but not exactly..!?) £15.54

user1977

Starting at the beginning, is £80.80 an accurate total for the food (based on menu prices) and not some sort of pre-tax net figure?

la531983

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82001056#Comment_82001056

I dont know of a single menu in any restaurant that hasnt already got the VAT pre-loaded into the prices on the menu. Are they even allowed to show proces excluding VAT and only add it onto the bill at the end?

TeaAndCrumpets

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82001056#Comment_82001056

I’ve just checked this and yes it is accurate and reflects the prices on the menu