Coventry ISA transfer in form

35har1old

All current years subscriptions plus part previous years subscriptions

Immediately adjacent to this line it says total amount beside a box for entering the figure say £10000 pounds how much would you expect the current holder to transfer?

Coventry are unaware of the current years figure

masonic

I would expect them to transfer the greater of:

• All current year subscriptions (if more than £10,000), or
• £10,000

What did they actually transfer?

There's an argument that if your current year subscriptions were more than £10,000, the transfer should be rejected by the sending provider on the grounds you did not give an actionable instruction.

35har1old

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81874247#Comment_81874247

Perphaps should have stated this years total as being £5000

masonic

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81874520#Comment_81874520

Then I fail to see how it could have been interpreted as a request to transfer anything other than £10,000 in total.

35har1old

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81874528#Comment_81874528

They ended up transferring £15000

For this to be correct would have needed a tick between this years and previous years and should not have said total amount but amount only

eskbanker

I think there is an argument, albeit not a particularly strong one, that in that context 'total amount' refers to total of the previous years' subscriptions, rather than that plus the (unquantified) current year money in aggregate, but certainly wouldn't argue that this is the most obvious interpretation!

masonic

Without the word "total", I'd agree it would be arguable. However, total is variously defined as "including everything", "comprising of or constituting the whole", "the product of addition of all the parts".

The word "subtotal" was created for scenarios where not everything is included. One would traditionally place a subtotal on a separate line.

If one felt disadvantaged by the actual outcome, I think a formal complaint would be completely justified.

Though I do note that HMRC provide different and clearer wording on their model cash ISA transfer authority form, so one may consider that Coventry BS also has a case to answer:

eskbanker

That model form is out of date in asserting that current year money can only be transferred wholly rather than partially, so both this and the Coventry form are structured on the basis that the value of current year subscriptions to be transferred effectively can't be nominated - I do agree that 'total amount' is more likely to be reasonably understood as total amount for the transfer rather than total amount of prior year money, but am just saying that I can see both interpretations, especially when the current year value isn't to be quantified.

masonic

Don't get me started on the lack of adoption of the 2024 reforms 😤

I don't think HMRC publishes a model transfer form any more as it seems to be encouraging use of electronic transfers. The above one was the most recent I could find.

But I would say, if it were to mean "total amount of prior year money" that would be as opposed to what? What is the customer intended to add up? Each individual tax year excluding the current one? I think that stretches credulity.

eskbanker

But I would say, if it were to mean "total amount of prior year money" that would be as opposed to what? What is the customer intended to add up? Each individual tax year excluding the current one? I think that stretches credulity.

Effectively, yes - total amount as opposed to breaking it down into amounts for individual prior years. Not necessarily signifying any adding up as such, but simply not requiring it to be allocated across multiple years.

masonic

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81874665#Comment_81874665

Maybe I'm not being imaginative enough, but I cannot conceive of a real world scenario where the customer would be there with a breakdown warranting use of the word "total" to be applied to prior year money.

But I am happy to concede and conclude that a formal complaint should be made to both providers; Coventry BS for not providing a form with unambiguous wording, and the other provider for not using the obvious interpretation (or checking with the customer). Which will also yield the best outcome for the OP and hopefully help to persuade Coventry BS to sort out their form.