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Charge your EV from home

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  • born_again
    born_again Posts: 23,091 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Sixth Anniversary Name Dropper
    edited 6 February at 11:59AM

    Local Sainsburys that has 12 chargers installed did not need new substation, as they had a more than suitable supply, as well as a roof covered in solar & battery storage to allow the store to run offline in case of any power outage.

    EVs inherently aren't better than ICE cars. Before anyone talks about EVs being cheaper, that's the electricity price

    No one is saying they are better. They are just a different power source, with built in benefit's. Such as cheaper running costs.

    Ev's are cheaper per mile to run if you can charge at home. Which you can not do with ICE. Which is what people look at. Cost per mile.

    Life in the slow lane
  • born_again
    born_again Posts: 23,091 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Sixth Anniversary Name Dropper
    edited 6 February at 12:26PM

    Far more have been sold without subsides. ICE has the same loss to 1st time buyer.

    Companies like Stellantis are the masters of their own downfall. They have known for years of the change & timeframe. So they have no one but themselves to blame. Had they not spent time & money trying to lobby governments to change their mind, Sadly like so many of the current manufactures. They just stuck their heads in the sand & hoped the change would go away. Instead of cracking on & realizing that they could make a EV cheaper & quicker than a ICE, with a change to production lines.

    https://www.stellantis.com/en/news/press-releases/2023/october/stellantis-to-become-a-strategic-shareholder-of-leapmotor-with-1-5-billion-investment-and-bolster-leapmotor-s-global-electric-vehicle-business

    So now the rush is on to catch up, & they are forming all sorts of partnerships, such as ford & Vw group.

    https://www.stellantis.com/en/news/press-releases/2023/october/stellantis-to-become-a-strategic-shareholder-of-leapmotor-with-1-5-billion-investment-and-bolster-leapmotor-s-global-electric-vehicle-business

    Are you aware of just who Net Zero Watch are?

    Net Zero Watch is a campaign group set up to highlight the serious economic and societal implications of expensive and poorly considered climate and energy policies, both domestically and internationally.

    So basically a anti government policy change group

    Life in the slow lane
  • Herzlos
    Herzlos Posts: 16,313 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Photogenic Name Dropper

    I think in many cases EV's are better; quieter, smoother, more powerful, less moving parts and maintenace.

    The only reason we think being moved by a series of controlled explosions of flammable liquid is because it's the status quo. If we had EV's first, anyone considering moving to petrol would be deemed a lunatic.

  • born_again
    born_again Posts: 23,091 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Sixth Anniversary Name Dropper

    If we had EV's first, anyone considering moving to petrol would be deemed a lunatic.

    We did. EV's were the 1st cars produced..

    You may think electric cars are still fairly new (charging shown above), however Andreas Flocken designed the 'Flocken Elektrowagen' in 1888, although Robert Anderson created the first crude electric carriage dating back to circa 1832/1839.

    Before the first car was created, it was 1860 when the internal combustion engine was created by Jean Joseph Etienne Lenoir, while Nicolaus Otto patented the gas engine in 1864, making it commercially successful. George Brayton then went on to invent the first commercially liquid-fuelled engine in 1872.

    Life in the slow lane
  • Arunmor
    Arunmor Posts: 764 Forumite
    500 Posts Second Anniversary Name Dropper

    So what about some other companies? They aren't an isolated case.

    Ford $5.5bn

    General Motors $6.0bn

    VW Group $5.0bn

    As for Net Zero Watch (they picked up the story from the Telegraph) I know exactly who and what they are, the point out the idiocy of the current push to Net Zero, on dodgy science but more importantly the obscene costs associated with it. The country is losing it's heavy power intensive industries at an alarming rate (steel, chemicals, fertilisers etc).

  • letom
    letom Posts: 70 Forumite
    Tenth Anniversary 10 Posts Name Dropper Combo Breaker

    That's about as silly as saying "WFH worked so we can get to Pluto", the problems are in no way related or comparable.

    No one is saying it is impossible, the point is there is significant infrastructure cost required. Put simply, the entire system of putting fuel into a mode of transport relied on significant infrastructure cost going into the petrol station with no cost required after this. In a world with EVs, this changes to a far more inefficient model where there are no economies of scale. Each car (household) installs their own fuel infrastructure e.g. £1k (equipment and labour), some houses will need gullies £3k, lamp posts need upgrading, sub stations need upgrading. This is all cost required to fully move to an EV only world. Is it impossible, no. Is it free, obviously not. Do people inherently want to pay for it, no because society does not believe that there's an improvement on the former way of doing things compared with the cost to change. It's like rebuilding your house for no real benefit. It's why governments provide subsidies, to push people to do something they want where people don't inherently want to do it or don't see the value in doing it.

  • letom
    letom Posts: 70 Forumite
    Tenth Anniversary 10 Posts Name Dropper Combo Breaker

    These car makers are not doing badly because they didn't embrace EVs sooner, they are doing badly because they did precisely that. The simple truth is there is not enough market demand to support the supply of EVs on the market (hence why almost every country subsidises it). Selling EVs is basically a loss making business for almost every manufacturer including Tesla, who without regulatory credits and non-car revenue would be making a loss. The majority of Chinese car makers are making a loss, the only reason they sell cheaper than western cars is biggest one of the biggest costs of production, labour, is significantly cheaper. It's not because they are geniuses, or have perfected car making, they just pay people less. It's almost impossible to win against a competitor who has a structural advantage that big.

    If a business such as Tesla selling only EVs can't turn an automotive profit, I don't see how doubling down on EVs makes any sense.

  • Car_54
    Car_54 Posts: 9,053 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Name Dropper

    Not the only reason. China is now effectively cut of from the US market, due to Trump's tariffs. They have to sell their cars somewhere, and have to price them accordingly.

  • Herzlos
    Herzlos Posts: 16,313 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Photogenic Name Dropper

    True, I was glossing over those ones for simplicity sake. I'd assumed they never took off because the range was far too low but it seems they did 40-60 miles and were pretty popular (among people who could afford them) until they were undercut by the Model T.

    But concerns like health, safety and emissions weren't a thing in 1915.

  • born_again
    born_again Posts: 23,091 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Sixth Anniversary Name Dropper
    edited 6 February at 3:58PM

    You of course jest…

    Had they entered into the EV marketplace when the like of Nissan, Kia etc. Then they would be doing far better.

    Sadly late to the marketplace & trying to sell cars so far overpriced & TBH, simply not good enough compared to other manufactures.. Just look at MRP & then look at what you can buy a new one for on Autotrader…

    Tesla not make a profit. Now we just wonder where you are getting this from?

    Life in the slow lane
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