Cant have ev car or solar panels or gas or heat pump!

WiserMiser

@MattMattMattUK "Heat pump is the same or cheaper than other alternative options for domestic fuel"

Founder of Ecotricity Dale Vince doesn't agree with you...

https://www.aol.co.uk/news/survey-casts-doubt-heat-pump-103758099.html

https://youtube.com/shorts/AX66Q9QM-oo

EssexHebridean

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81857694#Comment_81857694

Did you post here for information and advice, or in the hope that lots of people would commiserate but not offer anything constructive? You've had explanations about the heat pump thing, you've had suggests about the EV thing, and you've had a word of hope for the future about the solar. Commiserations won't help your situation but the information you've been given will at least inform you about where you stand.

QrizB

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81857694#Comment_81857694

Did you actually read the replies before posting that?

QrizB

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81858415#Comment_81858415

"Founder of Ecotricity Dale Vance" has been hopelessly out of touch for a while now.

I'm going to believe the people like @matt_drummer who measure and report on their energy use, not some CEO who got lucky.

WiserMiser

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81858871#Comment_81858871

And what about the 1,000 people in the survey who measured and reported on their energy usage? Are they all wrong?

matt_drummer

I saw Dale on the BBC Politics show yesterday.

He seems likeable enough but I am not sure he understands heat pumps, n fact I am sure he does not understand at all!

Along with the BBC `expert' they seem to believe that heat pumps are only suitable for well insulated homes. They won't work anywhere else for some reason that they never explain.

They also think you need upgraded pipework, I can tell you that you don't!

My house is plumbed primarily in 15mm od plastic pipe yet miraculously it is the second most efficient air source heat pump on heatpumpmonitor.org with a heating SCOP for the last twelve months of 5.26 and an overall SCOP since installation of 5.00 (including DHW)

Dale thinks all of the money should be spent on solar panels as that gives the best returns.

It is a nice idea but I don't understand his logic, the solar panels will produce lots of energy in the summer, during the day time, what will we do with it all?

And his solar panels will produce very little when it's cold and dark, the times when people need heating and spend the most on energy.

The BBC should get somebody on who actually understands heating and heat pumps, not people who keep perpetuating the same myths so loved by `my mate down the pub'

The problems with heat pumps are related to poor installation (mainly sizing of the heat pump and radiators) and owners operating them like a gas or oil boiler.

Insulation is not a factor in heat pump efficiency.

Good insulation is recommended whatever the heating system and poor insulation will make heating more expensive than it could be whatever system is employed.

QrizB

And what about the 1,000 people in the survey who measured and reported on their energy usage? Are they all wrong?

Well, there's nothing in the Green Britain Foundation report to suggest that the 1001 people surveyed "measured and reported on their energy usage". On the contrary, all that's reported is that one question (number 22) on the survey asked whether their house was more or less expensive to heat than before. There's no investigation into their energy use, or questions about how they calculated this, or comparison to energy costs in general (which have varied wildly over the past few years).

Have you read the report? It's here.

Curiously, 81% of the heat pump owners in that survey also have other means of heating; 57% retained their existing gas or oil boilers (and so will be incurring ongoing costs eg. gas boiler servicing andd standing charge) while 40% had woodburning stoves. I'd suggest that it's impossible, in the contect of this survey, to identify exactly why it's these people believe it's costing more to heat their houses than before.

silverwhistle

Curiously, 81% of the heat pump owners in that survey also have other means of heating;

That is curious. Personally I'm planning to get an Air2Air heat pump, sometimes referred to as air conditioning, and for a first experimental heating season I'll probably keep old my gas boiler, but then I rather look forward to the savings on the standing charge. Perhaps there are others in that situation? I'd also use my wood burner, particularly for cold snaps, as that would mean getting a lower power unit which would be better most of the time.

As for some of the rest of the thread, I'm not sure what the OP wanted either, and certainly don't understand their situation regarding EV charging as they haven't been very good at explaining.

I'd also agree with your opinion of Dale Vance, and his early Ecotricity EV charging monopoly on motorways probably delayed and hindered rather than helped the adoption of EVs.

Qyburn

The comment about running ccosts should really be qualified with "properly designed and installed".

Just like any system. For example the oil fired system we inherited in our house was badly designed and ineffective.

Qyburn

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81859098#Comment_81859098

What sort of flow and return temperatures do you run? Hearsay claims that heat pumps need to run at a much lower temperature than oil boilers, which leads to the quoted necessity for larger bore pipes and/or larger radiators.