Anti-fraud education

noitsnotme

mta999 said:

didn't buy anything from Facebook - ever

I keep telling my parents that but they think they know better!

Eco_Miser

mta999 said:

Anti fraud would go a long way if people :

didn't buy anything from Facebook - ever

didn't talk to strangers on the phone 

Including their bank's fraud department?

didn't click on any email links

If only banks and utilities didn't keep including clickable links

didn't allow any person to pay anything into their bank account

How do you stop them?

Apart from that, how would you pay your friends and family what you owe them (or pay them in advance), send a cheque?, wait until you meet again and pay cash?

comments in bold above.

Also, if you're employed by an individual are you going to insist on cheque or cash?

Zanderman

mta999 said:

Anti fraud would go a long way if people :

didn't buy anything from Facebook - ever

didn't talk to strangers on the phone

didn't click on any email links

didn't allow any person to pay anything into their bank account

All of which are unrealistic in reality. All* have to be done sometimes, it's just a matter of being alert and aware of the possible issues. Otherwise you might as well advise people to bin the phone, stop going online at all, and keep their cash under the mattress. That would solve it all, until the burglars visit.

*Except perhaps Facebook but even there, if you collect in person and pay in cash there's little chance of fraud.  

sheramber

brianposter said:

I have been having some difficulty discovering more about what has happened but it appears that the victim remains in contact with the fraudsters and trusts them more than she trusts her own bank branch. Anyone got any bright ideas as to how this might be used to investigate the case further.

Well a face to face discussion at their local bank wouls be pointless. The2y are not going to listeen to what the bank tell them.

That is how scammers succeed. They develop the trust of their victim.

brianposter

You make think that a face to face discussion would not be effective but what has actually been done certainly does not work, for the victim has now managed to cost another bank many thousands of pounds.

It is very difficult to find out how things happen but, as far as I can tell, the victim receives a phone call from the fraudsters, becomes stressed so that she follows their instructions carefully, and then when the stress disappears, completely forgets what she has done.

masonic

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81899933#Comment_81899933

Based on what you have described, the individual would seem to meet the definition of a Vulnerable Adult. Particularly that there is an "impairment in a person’s ability to protect himself from assault, abuse or neglect". In this situation, the focus needs to be around building a support network for the individual rather than expecting to be able to train them to fend for themselves.

It would seem they are also somewhat socially isolated and can't get the support they need from friends and family, which is a real shame. In this situation it is understandable that the victim forms strong bonds with the fraudsters trying to financially abuse them, who would be very willing to exploit this in the course of extracting money.

Do they really have nobody who can help them manage their financial affairs? Get Lasting Power of Attorney, file a CIFAS protective registration, etc.

brianposter

The victim actually has a relatively good support network but it appears that talking to the family is so commonplace that it simply does not get through. That is why I have been hoping for an interview with the bank or the police in that it would have more impact and that impact would be supported by an emotional jolt.

The victim is sufficiently compos mentis that she can persuade a doctor that she should not be put on any special register, and tends to think that her financial affairs are her own business and not anybody elses.

eskbanker

Putting aside the debate about what would happen in an ideal world, it seems to me that if there have been multiple frauds via multiple banks, she's probably now on borrowed time anyway, and sooner or later she'll be held responsible and won't be reimbursed and/or her account will be closed - these may jolt her into awareness of her susceptibility to fraud?

masonic

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81899996#Comment_81899996

There is an issue when the individual believes her affairs are her own business and nobody else's, and a medical professional has assessed her and considers her to have capacity to make her own decisions. Without finding a lack of capacity, professionals are not able to intervene, so it would come down to friends and family to give them a reason. Has anyone been in touch with the police to raise concerns and try to arrange a safeguarding visit?

See for example https://www.surrey.police.uk/advice/advice-and-information/wsi/watch-schemes-initiatives/os/operation-signature/

brianposter

The latest loss involved a significant contribution from the bank, They were told that the victim was vulnerable and that she was in touch with fraudsters. Their response was that they could do nothing until a power of attorney was registered by the informant. It took a month to register the power of attorney.