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Electric heating
Comments
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He said that the oil filled radiators keep the heat for several hours once they meet the required temperature. This is the model he recommended https://share.google/4QRL03J7l12u6ltcVScot_39 said:
No.kb1956 said:
I have just had an electrician round to look at another job and his advice was to go for oil filled radiators. He has been an electrician for a long time and he has never recommended storage and said that oil filled radiators can keep the heat for a lot longer than storage heaters. So I may now go for oil filled radiators 🤔tlcgrantham said:
As you’re on SVT but may go back to storage heaters an option now could be EDF FreePhase Static Tariff. It has 3 different fixed rates daily instead of 2.kb1956 said:
I didn't actually use the old storage heaters as they didn't work and yes the panel heaters were on SVT. I'm seriously considering having new storage heaters put in then I can go back on E7 but wondering if they continue to put out heat all day as I'm at home most of the day ??Robin9 said:@kb1956 Just checking.
When you were using the storage rads I presume you were on E7. When you had the panel heaters put in did you change to the SVT ? If do didn't then the panel heaters are costing even more as the day time rates on E7 are more than SVT
Have you had the Winter Fuel Allowance ? Reread your post as you purchased in October you will have missed the cutoff date
11:00pm - 6:00am 10pkwh less than SVT
4:00pm - 7:00pm. 8pkwh. more than SVT
All other times. 5pkwh less than SVT
All above prices are rounded and depend on your Electricity region.
1. No Cost and would save money whatever you choose to do.
2. No Exit Fees and rates fixed for a year
3. Free Electricity when wholesale price is zero or negative.
Really - think what exactly did he say - keep heat as in retain heat in the heater - or keep as in keep rooms hotter for longer - at increased running costs - by continuinely recharging during tne day at day rates - just like your panel heaters were doing.
And he also may not have any experience of modern lot 20 and hhr programmable room air thermostat regulated night storage heaters. Thry really as chalk and cheese by comments of those who have upgraded.
Your room needs a fixed amount of kWh of energy per day - to maintain a given temperature profile. You need a regulated heat source - time and temp programmable with thermostat - to achieve that - and one that ideally charges at the lowest rates / kWh to control your bills.
Oil filled radiators have more thermal mass than say a convector panel heater - but will cool quickly once remove power. Even gne most opti istic wall mounted glossies talking maybe 1.5-2hrs , less with some, and as cool will give out progressively less heat.
I use plug in OFR - but on e10 at my off peak rates - before need my nsh even on min settings - they are not wall mounted and they are certainly not nsh substitutes. Lucky if my largest 9 fin c10 kG model even retains heat for 30m-1hr on typical settings once power off. A large wall mounted can weigh twice that though.
They may be a slightly better match to run across say a cosy off peak gap - like 3hrs 4-7 than other panels.
But if run on sr they will cost the same as any non ashp style heating.
Wheras a nsh is designed to last 24 hrs from a 7 hrs night charge if properly sized for room losses. And at a night rate that can be 40-60% of single rate depending on region and supplier.
Did he quote a brand / model for these potentially magical oil filled rads - and a cost ?0 -
Too late now sadly 😥WiserMiser said:Your old NSHs probably only needed one or two new elements, probably about £20 plus fitting. Your useless electrician should have checked. Would you scrap a car just because a headlight bulb had failed?Here's the Storage Heater Sanity Test.0 -
Again basic physics - to basic costs - you need a given a amount of energy N on a given day
N kWh at X p / kWh = NX p cost.
You'd need to be able to lower the cost for some of the charge slots - and so look at some of tou options listed above and hope they or your room stays hot enough for the gaps to justify investing in more expensive panel heaters.
Or will cost the exact same to run over 24 hrs on single rate - which is why you ripped the old ones out.
And remember if they do retain heat for several hours (if) they will also take several hours to reheat from cold every day.
And if holding temp, tgen that means not hesting up, so suddenly your 2kW heater isnt really 2kW output. If heating element on 50% tine its 1kW effectively - and thats into the range of modern nsh output power
Or spend twice as much on a lot 20 nsh - and get energy at as low as 9p for Snug and possibly hot water all year round (one e7 supplier was offering c10p in some regions over summer iirc now ?) vs single rate say c26p.
Id risk panels in bed rooms etc if ok once under the covers maybe - others need even bedrooms fairly warm - but not the main living room.
Get a qualified nsh installer - not just an electrician - to give you a quote - one who will do proper sizing check taking walls, windows and cubic feet all into account - and see what they say cost would be to install 1 large or my guess 2 medium to large in that large room. And see if price makes payback / benefit from the potential energy unit cost savings worth it.
70 is still young these days - ave life expectancy well into 80s for those who have made it that far
£400 extra on a lot 20 nsh heater - at 17p snug vs sr savings = c2300 kWh energy use.
But could need more wiring as well. So need an installed cost to do proper figures.
Based on your neighbours £180 (180×12)/ cap £1229 / 3900kWh = c6900 kWh pa - that 2300kWh could be just one winters worth of heating.
2 -
Sure, if they're switched on and drawing power ( = using electricity = £££ ) to maintain the temperature. They might be good at heating rooms but they will cost you a bomb doing so.kb1956 said:
He said that the oil filled radiators keep the heat for several hours once they meet the required temperature. This is the model he recommended https://share.google/4QRL03J7l12u6ltcVScot_39 said:
No.kb1956 said:
I have just had an electrician round to look at another job and his advice was to go for oil filled radiators. He has been an electrician for a long time and he has never recommended storage and said that oil filled radiators can keep the heat for a lot longer than storage heaters. So I may now go for oil filled radiators 🤔tlcgrantham said:
As you’re on SVT but may go back to storage heaters an option now could be EDF FreePhase Static Tariff. It has 3 different fixed rates daily instead of 2.kb1956 said:
I didn't actually use the old storage heaters as they didn't work and yes the panel heaters were on SVT. I'm seriously considering having new storage heaters put in then I can go back on E7 but wondering if they continue to put out heat all day as I'm at home most of the day ??Robin9 said:@kb1956 Just checking.
When you were using the storage rads I presume you were on E7. When you had the panel heaters put in did you change to the SVT ? If do didn't then the panel heaters are costing even more as the day time rates on E7 are more than SVT
Have you had the Winter Fuel Allowance ? Reread your post as you purchased in October you will have missed the cutoff date
11:00pm - 6:00am 10pkwh less than SVT
4:00pm - 7:00pm. 8pkwh. more than SVT
All other times. 5pkwh less than SVT
All above prices are rounded and depend on your Electricity region.
1. No Cost and would save money whatever you choose to do.
2. No Exit Fees and rates fixed for a year
3. Free Electricity when wholesale price is zero or negative.
Really - think what exactly did he say - keep heat as in retain heat in the heater - or keep as in keep rooms hotter for longer - at increased running costs - by continuinely recharging during tne day at day rates - just like your panel heaters were doing.
And he also may not have any experience of modern lot 20 and hhr programmable room air thermostat regulated night storage heaters. Thry really as chalk and cheese by comments of those who have upgraded.
Your room needs a fixed amount of kWh of energy per day - to maintain a given temperature profile. You need a regulated heat source - time and temp programmable with thermostat - to achieve that - and one that ideally charges at the lowest rates / kWh to control your bills.
Oil filled radiators have more thermal mass than say a convector panel heater - but will cool quickly once remove power. Even gne most opti istic wall mounted glossies talking maybe 1.5-2hrs , less with some, and as cool will give out progressively less heat.
I use plug in OFR - but on e10 at my off peak rates - before need my nsh even on min settings - they are not wall mounted and they are certainly not nsh substitutes. Lucky if my largest 9 fin c10 kG model even retains heat for 30m-1hr on typical settings once power off. A large wall mounted can weigh twice that though.
They may be a slightly better match to run across say a cosy off peak gap - like 3hrs 4-7 than other panels.
But if run on sr they will cost the same as any non ashp style heating.
Wheras a nsh is designed to last 24 hrs from a 7 hrs night charge if properly sized for room losses. And at a night rate that can be 40-60% of single rate depending on region and supplier.
Did he quote a brand / model for these potentially magical oil filled rads - and a cost ?
They do not store heat like actual storage heaters do.1 -
I have had lots of conflicting advice but have now decided against oil filled radiators. I'm having a survey done on 7/1 with a view to possibly getting a grant for storage heaters through my local council so will see what comes of that 🤞🤞Spoonie_Turtle said:
Sure, if they're switched on and drawing power ( = using electricity = £££ ) to maintain the temperature. They might be good at heating rooms but they will cost you a bomb doing so.kb1956 said:
He said that the oil filled radiators keep the heat for several hours once they meet the required temperature. This is the model he recommended https://share.google/4QRL03J7l12u6ltcVScot_39 said:
No.kb1956 said:
I have just had an electrician round to look at another job and his advice was to go for oil filled radiators. He has been an electrician for a long time and he has never recommended storage and said that oil filled radiators can keep the heat for a lot longer than storage heaters. So I may now go for oil filled radiators 🤔tlcgrantham said:
As you’re on SVT but may go back to storage heaters an option now could be EDF FreePhase Static Tariff. It has 3 different fixed rates daily instead of 2.kb1956 said:
I didn't actually use the old storage heaters as they didn't work and yes the panel heaters were on SVT. I'm seriously considering having new storage heaters put in then I can go back on E7 but wondering if they continue to put out heat all day as I'm at home most of the day ??Robin9 said:@kb1956 Just checking.
When you were using the storage rads I presume you were on E7. When you had the panel heaters put in did you change to the SVT ? If do didn't then the panel heaters are costing even more as the day time rates on E7 are more than SVT
Have you had the Winter Fuel Allowance ? Reread your post as you purchased in October you will have missed the cutoff date
11:00pm - 6:00am 10pkwh less than SVT
4:00pm - 7:00pm. 8pkwh. more than SVT
All other times. 5pkwh less than SVT
All above prices are rounded and depend on your Electricity region.
1. No Cost and would save money whatever you choose to do.
2. No Exit Fees and rates fixed for a year
3. Free Electricity when wholesale price is zero or negative.
Really - think what exactly did he say - keep heat as in retain heat in the heater - or keep as in keep rooms hotter for longer - at increased running costs - by continuinely recharging during tne day at day rates - just like your panel heaters were doing.
And he also may not have any experience of modern lot 20 and hhr programmable room air thermostat regulated night storage heaters. Thry really as chalk and cheese by comments of those who have upgraded.
Your room needs a fixed amount of kWh of energy per day - to maintain a given temperature profile. You need a regulated heat source - time and temp programmable with thermostat - to achieve that - and one that ideally charges at the lowest rates / kWh to control your bills.
Oil filled radiators have more thermal mass than say a convector panel heater - but will cool quickly once remove power. Even gne most opti istic wall mounted glossies talking maybe 1.5-2hrs , less with some, and as cool will give out progressively less heat.
I use plug in OFR - but on e10 at my off peak rates - before need my nsh even on min settings - they are not wall mounted and they are certainly not nsh substitutes. Lucky if my largest 9 fin c10 kG model even retains heat for 30m-1hr on typical settings once power off. A large wall mounted can weigh twice that though.
They may be a slightly better match to run across say a cosy off peak gap - like 3hrs 4-7 than other panels.
But if run on sr they will cost the same as any non ashp style heating.
Wheras a nsh is designed to last 24 hrs from a 7 hrs night charge if properly sized for room losses. And at a night rate that can be 40-60% of single rate depending on region and supplier.
Did he quote a brand / model for these potentially magical oil filled rads - and a cost ?
They do not store heat like actual storage heaters do.3 -
Good luck with survey.1
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IMHO if that's his belief it is now time for all electricians to pass A level physics before going anywhere near electrics.kb1956 said:
He said that the oil filled radiators keep the heat for several hours once they meet the required temperature. This is the model he recommended https://share.google/4QRL03J7l12u6ltcVScot_39 said:
No.kb1956 said:
I have just had an electrician round to look at another job and his advice was to go for oil filled radiators. He has been an electrician for a long time and he has never recommended storage and said that oil filled radiators can keep the heat for a lot longer than storage heaters. So I may now go for oil filled radiators 🤔tlcgrantham said:
As you’re on SVT but may go back to storage heaters an option now could be EDF FreePhase Static Tariff. It has 3 different fixed rates daily instead of 2.kb1956 said:
I didn't actually use the old storage heaters as they didn't work and yes the panel heaters were on SVT. I'm seriously considering having new storage heaters put in then I can go back on E7 but wondering if they continue to put out heat all day as I'm at home most of the day ??Robin9 said:@kb1956 Just checking.
When you were using the storage rads I presume you were on E7. When you had the panel heaters put in did you change to the SVT ? If do didn't then the panel heaters are costing even more as the day time rates on E7 are more than SVT
Have you had the Winter Fuel Allowance ? Reread your post as you purchased in October you will have missed the cutoff date
11:00pm - 6:00am 10pkwh less than SVT
4:00pm - 7:00pm. 8pkwh. more than SVT
All other times. 5pkwh less than SVT
All above prices are rounded and depend on your Electricity region.
1. No Cost and would save money whatever you choose to do.
2. No Exit Fees and rates fixed for a year
3. Free Electricity when wholesale price is zero or negative.
Really - think what exactly did he say - keep heat as in retain heat in the heater - or keep as in keep rooms hotter for longer - at increased running costs - by continuinely recharging during tne day at day rates - just like your panel heaters were doing.
And he also may not have any experience of modern lot 20 and hhr programmable room air thermostat regulated night storage heaters. Thry really as chalk and cheese by comments of those who have upgraded.
Your room needs a fixed amount of kWh of energy per day - to maintain a given temperature profile. You need a regulated heat source - time and temp programmable with thermostat - to achieve that - and one that ideally charges at the lowest rates / kWh to control your bills.
Oil filled radiators have more thermal mass than say a convector panel heater - but will cool quickly once remove power. Even gne most opti istic wall mounted glossies talking maybe 1.5-2hrs , less with some, and as cool will give out progressively less heat.
I use plug in OFR - but on e10 at my off peak rates - before need my nsh even on min settings - they are not wall mounted and they are certainly not nsh substitutes. Lucky if my largest 9 fin c10 kG model even retains heat for 30m-1hr on typical settings once power off. A large wall mounted can weigh twice that though.
They may be a slightly better match to run across say a cosy off peak gap - like 3hrs 4-7 than other panels.
But if run on sr they will cost the same as any non ashp style heating.
Wheras a nsh is designed to last 24 hrs from a 7 hrs night charge if properly sized for room losses. And at a night rate that can be 40-60% of single rate depending on region and supplier.
Did he quote a brand / model for these potentially magical oil filled rads - and a cost ?
Ask him where that heat which stays for several hours comes from. So you know it comes from heating the oil on expensive electricity. A storage heater works on the same principal,, but it can store much more heat in the brick core and is charged from much cheap overnight electricity.3 -
Thank you I'm going to wait until I get the survey from Cosy Homes Lancashire (they offer grants via Lancaster council) and see what the surveyor says. They only offer grants for storage heaters and I have already passed the first stage so 🤞🤞daveyjp said:
IMHO if that's his belief it is now time for all electricians to pass A level physics before going anywhere near electrics.kb1956 said:
He said that the oil filled radiators keep the heat for several hours once they meet the required temperature. This is the model he recommended https://share.google/4QRL03J7l12u6ltcVScot_39 said:
No.kb1956 said:
I have just had an electrician round to look at another job and his advice was to go for oil filled radiators. He has been an electrician for a long time and he has never recommended storage and said that oil filled radiators can keep the heat for a lot longer than storage heaters. So I may now go for oil filled radiators 🤔tlcgrantham said:
As you’re on SVT but may go back to storage heaters an option now could be EDF FreePhase Static Tariff. It has 3 different fixed rates daily instead of 2.kb1956 said:
I didn't actually use the old storage heaters as they didn't work and yes the panel heaters were on SVT. I'm seriously considering having new storage heaters put in then I can go back on E7 but wondering if they continue to put out heat all day as I'm at home most of the day ??Robin9 said:@kb1956 Just checking.
When you were using the storage rads I presume you were on E7. When you had the panel heaters put in did you change to the SVT ? If do didn't then the panel heaters are costing even more as the day time rates on E7 are more than SVT
Have you had the Winter Fuel Allowance ? Reread your post as you purchased in October you will have missed the cutoff date
11:00pm - 6:00am 10pkwh less than SVT
4:00pm - 7:00pm. 8pkwh. more than SVT
All other times. 5pkwh less than SVT
All above prices are rounded and depend on your Electricity region.
1. No Cost and would save money whatever you choose to do.
2. No Exit Fees and rates fixed for a year
3. Free Electricity when wholesale price is zero or negative.
Really - think what exactly did he say - keep heat as in retain heat in the heater - or keep as in keep rooms hotter for longer - at increased running costs - by continuinely recharging during tne day at day rates - just like your panel heaters were doing.
And he also may not have any experience of modern lot 20 and hhr programmable room air thermostat regulated night storage heaters. Thry really as chalk and cheese by comments of those who have upgraded.
Your room needs a fixed amount of kWh of energy per day - to maintain a given temperature profile. You need a regulated heat source - time and temp programmable with thermostat - to achieve that - and one that ideally charges at the lowest rates / kWh to control your bills.
Oil filled radiators have more thermal mass than say a convector panel heater - but will cool quickly once remove power. Even gne most opti istic wall mounted glossies talking maybe 1.5-2hrs , less with some, and as cool will give out progressively less heat.
I use plug in OFR - but on e10 at my off peak rates - before need my nsh even on min settings - they are not wall mounted and they are certainly not nsh substitutes. Lucky if my largest 9 fin c10 kG model even retains heat for 30m-1hr on typical settings once power off. A large wall mounted can weigh twice that though.
They may be a slightly better match to run across say a cosy off peak gap - like 3hrs 4-7 than other panels.
But if run on sr they will cost the same as any non ashp style heating.
Wheras a nsh is designed to last 24 hrs from a 7 hrs night charge if properly sized for room losses. And at a night rate that can be 40-60% of single rate depending on region and supplier.
Did he quote a brand / model for these potentially magical oil filled rads - and a cost ?
Ask him where that heat which stays for several hours comes from. So you know it comes from heating the oil on expensive electricity. A storage heater works on the same principal,, but it can store much more heat in the brick core and is charged from much cheap overnight electricity.1 -
I do hope the survey goes well and that you qualify for the grant.Storage heaters are currently the least-worst form of electric heating for a property that can't readily get a heat pump.N. Hampshire, he/him. Octopus Intelligent Go elec & Tracker gas / Vodafone BB / iD mobile. Ripple Kirk Hill Coop member.Ofgem cap table, Ofgem cap explainer. Economy 7 cap explainer. Gas vs E7 vs peak elec heating costs, Best kettle!
2.72kWp PV facing SSW installed Jan 2012. 11 x 247w panels, 3.6kw inverter. 35 MWh generated, long-term average 2.6 Os.1 -
How many did they say at that price, in your room?kb1956 said:
He said that the oil filled radiators keep the heat for several hours once they meet the required temperature. This is the model he recommended https://share.google/4QRL03J7l12u6ltcVScot_39 said:
No.kb1956 said:
I have just had an electrician round to look at another job and his advice was to go for oil filled radiators. He has been an electrician for a long time and he has never recommended storage and said that oil filled radiators can keep the heat for a lot longer than storage heaters. So I may now go for oil filled radiators 🤔tlcgrantham said:
As you’re on SVT but may go back to storage heaters an option now could be EDF FreePhase Static Tariff. It has 3 different fixed rates daily instead of 2.kb1956 said:
I didn't actually use the old storage heaters as they didn't work and yes the panel heaters were on SVT. I'm seriously considering having new storage heaters put in then I can go back on E7 but wondering if they continue to put out heat all day as I'm at home most of the day ??Robin9 said:@kb1956 Just checking.
When you were using the storage rads I presume you were on E7. When you had the panel heaters put in did you change to the SVT ? If do didn't then the panel heaters are costing even more as the day time rates on E7 are more than SVT
Have you had the Winter Fuel Allowance ? Reread your post as you purchased in October you will have missed the cutoff date
11:00pm - 6:00am 10pkwh less than SVT
4:00pm - 7:00pm. 8pkwh. more than SVT
All other times. 5pkwh less than SVT
All above prices are rounded and depend on your Electricity region.
1. No Cost and would save money whatever you choose to do.
2. No Exit Fees and rates fixed for a year
3. Free Electricity when wholesale price is zero or negative.
Really - think what exactly did he say - keep heat as in retain heat in the heater - or keep as in keep rooms hotter for longer - at increased running costs - by continuinely recharging during tne day at day rates - just like your panel heaters were doing.
And he also may not have any experience of modern lot 20 and hhr programmable room air thermostat regulated night storage heaters. Thry really as chalk and cheese by comments of those who have upgraded.
Your room needs a fixed amount of kWh of energy per day - to maintain a given temperature profile. You need a regulated heat source - time and temp programmable with thermostat - to achieve that - and one that ideally charges at the lowest rates / kWh to control your bills.
Oil filled radiators have more thermal mass than say a convector panel heater - but will cool quickly once remove power. Even gne most opti istic wall mounted glossies talking maybe 1.5-2hrs , less with some, and as cool will give out progressively less heat.
I use plug in OFR - but on e10 at my off peak rates - before need my nsh even on min settings - they are not wall mounted and they are certainly not nsh substitutes. Lucky if my largest 9 fin c10 kG model even retains heat for 30m-1hr on typical settings once power off. A large wall mounted can weigh twice that though.
They may be a slightly better match to run across say a cosy off peak gap - like 3hrs 4-7 than other panels.
But if run on sr they will cost the same as any non ashp style heating.
Wheras a nsh is designed to last 24 hrs from a 7 hrs night charge if properly sized for room losses. And at a night rate that can be 40-60% of single rate depending on region and supplier.
Did he quote a brand / model for these potentially magical oil filled rads - and a cost ?
https://www.argos.co.uk/product/6310914?
A lot cheaper & allows movement near to where you are. OK not as good looking.. But this is MSE 👍Life in the slow lane0
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