I don’t know where to turn.

itsthelittlethings

Also if you feel alone try making some friends. You don't have to bear this alone. You can make friends at work, through evening classes, at the gym even. I work with someone who met her husband at the gym. Ridiculous but true.

elsien

itsthelittlethings said:

Emmia said:

itsthelittlethings said:

Do not pay for the roof to be fixed. You have done an absolutely wonderful and kind thing by buying him a flat and saving him from homelessness. I used to work in homelessness and it is a terrible thing. If he was in hostel accommodation and addicted to drugs he might have ended up back on the streets easily. 

If you pay for the roof to be fixed you are further enabling him and impoverishing yourself. It’s time for him to be a big boy and stand in his own two feet. You may be surprised what he can achieve when you stop “fixing” things for him.

The OP is the owner of the flat her son is living in. As a leaseholder (presumably) they are legally responsible for their share of the repairs to the building including the roof. The OP has no choice but to pay for the roof to be fixed. 

As a landlord, they need to take steps to evict their son, and can then sell the flat. Unfortunately this isn't easy as I expect the OP feels guilty or blames themselves for the son's drug problem. It is likely that the son will end up on the streets as a result, and I can see why the OP is reluctant... It will be incredibly hard emotionally to do this, which I think shows how much they love and care for their son despite this awful situation.

Don't be ridiculous. You have no responsibilities as a leaseholder. It's a contract. If you fail to pay the charges you may eventually forfeit your property and get back some of the money you paid for it. I don't see that she is legally over a barrel to pay this money.

I don’t think it’s Emmia who is being ridiculous here.  It’s the lease is forfeit then the contract is terminated and they will not get any money back on the property. There will also be legal costs to pay. 

And aside from the hundred percent chance that the son will refuse to take any responsibility the chances of getting a long-term loan for someone living in their overdraft is fairly remote. 

Emmia

itsthelittlethings said:

Emmia said:

itsthelittlethings said:

Do not pay for the roof to be fixed. You have done an absolutely wonderful and kind thing by buying him a flat and saving him from homelessness. I used to work in homelessness and it is a terrible thing. If he was in hostel accommodation and addicted to drugs he might have ended up back on the streets easily. 

If you pay for the roof to be fixed you are further enabling him and impoverishing yourself. It’s time for him to be a big boy and stand in his own two feet. You may be surprised what he can achieve when you stop “fixing” things for him.

The OP is the owner of the flat her son is living in. As a leaseholder (presumably) they are legally responsible for their share of the repairs to the building including the roof. The OP has no choice but to pay for the roof to be fixed. 

As a landlord, they need to take steps to evict their son, and can then sell the flat. Unfortunately this isn't easy as I expect the OP feels guilty or blames themselves for the son's drug problem. It is likely that the son will end up on the streets as a result, and I can see why the OP is reluctant... It will be incredibly hard emotionally to do this, which I think shows how much they love and care for their son despite this awful situation.

Don't be ridiculous. You have no responsibilities as a leaseholder. It's a contract. If you fail to pay the charges you may eventually forfeit your property and get back some of the money you paid for it. I don't see that she is legally over a barrel to pay this money.

I think you are confusing repossession and forfeiture. They are not the same.

In a repossession by the mortgage lender (because you haven't paid) the property is sold and you get back any difference in what you owe Vs the sale price.

In a forfeiture of the lease, because you've not paid what is required (or broken the lease in another way) the flat becomes the property of the freeholder, and the leaseholder doesn't get any money back (including if the freeholder subsequently sells the flat).

The OP in a forfeiture scenario would still be liable for any mortgage and any fees etc incurred as a result of owning the property. But wouldn't have any property - they lose twice.

Forfeiture is relatively uncommon, but nonetheless this isn't a route the OP ought to be contemplating.

Emmia

itsthelittlethings said:

If he holds down a job he can get a long term loan to pay for the roof with the added plus that he will not have so much money for drugs.

Tenants (like the son) don't pay for works like this. Leaseholders (like the parent) do.

sammyjammy

Maybe Dad is taking the right approach, to help him you've got to let him help himself.  If this is just a place to get your thoughts out then great, carry on but you ask for help and then say you can't stop doing what you are doing.

You need to be strong and try and take the emotion out of it, maybe employ someone to evict him on your behalf, if you leave things as they are he will never stop taking drugs, why would he?

I think your OP said that the roof leak is impacting the flat?  You have rights to access the flat and fix the issues, if he doesn't let you this is also grounds for eviction.  Are you in England?

itsthelittlethings

Emmia said:

itsthelittlethings said:

Emmia said:

itsthelittlethings said:

Do not pay for the roof to be fixed. You have done an absolutely wonderful and kind thing by buying him a flat and saving him from homelessness. I used to work in homelessness and it is a terrible thing. If he was in hostel accommodation and addicted to drugs he might have ended up back on the streets easily. 

If you pay for the roof to be fixed you are further enabling him and impoverishing yourself. It’s time for him to be a big boy and stand in his own two feet. You may be surprised what he can achieve when you stop “fixing” things for him.

The OP is the owner of the flat her son is living in. As a leaseholder (presumably) they are legally responsible for their share of the repairs to the building including the roof. The OP has no choice but to pay for the roof to be fixed. 

As a landlord, they need to take steps to evict their son, and can then sell the flat. Unfortunately this isn't easy as I expect the OP feels guilty or blames themselves for the son's drug problem. It is likely that the son will end up on the streets as a result, and I can see why the OP is reluctant... It will be incredibly hard emotionally to do this, which I think shows how much they love and care for their son despite this awful situation.

Don't be ridiculous. You have no responsibilities as a leaseholder. It's a contract. If you fail to pay the charges you may eventually forfeit your property and get back some of the money you paid for it. I don't see that she is legally over a barrel to pay this money.

I think you are confusing repossession and forfeiture. They are not the same.

In a repossession by the mortgage lender (because you haven't paid) the property is sold and you get back any difference in what you owe Vs the sale price.

In a forfeiture of the lease, because you've not paid what is required (or broken the lease in another way) the flat becomes the property of the freeholder, and the leaseholder doesn't get any money back (including if the freeholder subsequently sells the flat).

The OP in a forfeiture scenario would still be liable for any mortgage and any fees etc incurred as a result of owning the property. But wouldn't have any property - they lose twice.

Forfeiture is relatively uncommon, but nonetheless this isn't a route the OP ought to be contemplating.

I think I would go for forfeiture over shelling out £10,000 I don't have to get the roof fixed.

I live in my overdraft and the bank are falling over themselves to lend me money.

Brie

Strawberry_cupcakes said:

Hi. I’m a mum of a 23 year old son whose life is chaos. To cut a long story short, he got involved with drugs approx 4.5 years ago, maybe earlier. It got really bad and he was homeless with his life spiralling. His homeless accommodation was so bad, I ended up buying him a bedsit apartment  in the hope it may stabilise his life. It is in my name so I am legally responsible for it.

 Fast forward 3.5 years, nothing is really changing. He abuses the property by leaving it in a filthy condition, he pays no rent and still buys and uses drugs, albeit he holds down a job paying approx £1200 per month. He has an unemployed girlfriend living with him and is getting deeper and deeper into his overdraft. I have recently had a solicitors letter from a large multi national company to say the roof of the apartment block he lives in is leaking into their property, and early indication is the whole roof needs replaced at a cost of approx £60k (old tenement building with complex issues).

I am sick with worry while he smokes his drugs and is oblivious to the real world. When I threaten eviction, he will speak about ending his life. He has me over a barrel. His dad takes no interest in him. Where do I turn to for help? I’m battling this alone. Thank you for reading. 

Hold on a second.  Have we got this wrong?  OP says she bought a flat and son lives in it paying no rent and despite being a bedsit (meant for 1 person) he has a second person living there.

So - first question - is he actually a tenant?  Is the OP actually a landlady?  If not then all she needs to do is go in to HER flat when he is not there, bag everything up and change the locks.  Very very hard step to take I would expect but isn't that legally possible?  Surely if he was living in the same house as her she could do this.

Secondly- this is one flat in an old building.  How many freeholders are there?  How many leaseholds?  How much of the £60k would actually be the OP's responsibility?  And is the £60k a suggested cost or an actual quote?

Sorry OP this doesn't address the heartache you are going through but maybe it will help get some practical advice.

Emmia

itsthelittlethings said:

Emmia said:

itsthelittlethings said:

Emmia said:

itsthelittlethings said:

Do not pay for the roof to be fixed. You have done an absolutely wonderful and kind thing by buying him a flat and saving him from homelessness. I used to work in homelessness and it is a terrible thing. If he was in hostel accommodation and addicted to drugs he might have ended up back on the streets easily. 

If you pay for the roof to be fixed you are further enabling him and impoverishing yourself. It’s time for him to be a big boy and stand in his own two feet. You may be surprised what he can achieve when you stop “fixing” things for him.

The OP is the owner of the flat her son is living in. As a leaseholder (presumably) they are legally responsible for their share of the repairs to the building including the roof. The OP has no choice but to pay for the roof to be fixed. 

As a landlord, they need to take steps to evict their son, and can then sell the flat. Unfortunately this isn't easy as I expect the OP feels guilty or blames themselves for the son's drug problem. It is likely that the son will end up on the streets as a result, and I can see why the OP is reluctant... It will be incredibly hard emotionally to do this, which I think shows how much they love and care for their son despite this awful situation.

Don't be ridiculous. You have no responsibilities as a leaseholder. It's a contract. If you fail to pay the charges you may eventually forfeit your property and get back some of the money you paid for it. I don't see that she is legally over a barrel to pay this money.

I think you are confusing repossession and forfeiture. They are not the same.

In a repossession by the mortgage lender (because you haven't paid) the property is sold and you get back any difference in what you owe Vs the sale price.

In a forfeiture of the lease, because you've not paid what is required (or broken the lease in another way) the flat becomes the property of the freeholder, and the leaseholder doesn't get any money back (including if the freeholder subsequently sells the flat).

The OP in a forfeiture scenario would still be liable for any mortgage and any fees etc incurred as a result of owning the property. But wouldn't have any property - they lose twice.

Forfeiture is relatively uncommon, but nonetheless this isn't a route the OP ought to be contemplating.

I think I would go for forfeiture over shelling out £10,000 I don't have to get the roof fixed.

I live in my overdraft and the bank are falling over themselves to lend me money.

That's nuts.

Ok. Let's say you own a flat worth £200k on which you have a mortgage which has £150k outstanding, so you have £50k of equity.

You don't want to pay £10k for the roof repairs, so instead you give the freeholder your flat via forfeiture... The freeholder gets a property worth £200k, which they can sell and they keep all the money. You get nothing. You also have to move out (get evicted) as the flat is no longer yours.

However when you do this, you still owe the mortgage company £150k - and yes, you still need to pay that... But you have no flat.

Alternatively if you don't want to pay the £10k bill, you sell the flat and walk away with the equity. This is what most people do, which is why forfeiture is not common.

At some point you'll find the banks will stop seeing you as a good bet for lending... What's your plan when the music stops?

silvercar

Emmia said:

itsthelittlethings said:

Emmia said:

itsthelittlethings said:

Emmia said:

itsthelittlethings said:

Do not pay for the roof to be fixed. You have done an absolutely wonderful and kind thing by buying him a flat and saving him from homelessness. I used to work in homelessness and it is a terrible thing. If he was in hostel accommodation and addicted to drugs he might have ended up back on the streets easily. 

If you pay for the roof to be fixed you are further enabling him and impoverishing yourself. It’s time for him to be a big boy and stand in his own two feet. You may be surprised what he can achieve when you stop “fixing” things for him.

The OP is the owner of the flat her son is living in. As a leaseholder (presumably) they are legally responsible for their share of the repairs to the building including the roof. The OP has no choice but to pay for the roof to be fixed. 

As a landlord, they need to take steps to evict their son, and can then sell the flat. Unfortunately this isn't easy as I expect the OP feels guilty or blames themselves for the son's drug problem. It is likely that the son will end up on the streets as a result, and I can see why the OP is reluctant... It will be incredibly hard emotionally to do this, which I think shows how much they love and care for their son despite this awful situation.

Don't be ridiculous. You have no responsibilities as a leaseholder. It's a contract. If you fail to pay the charges you may eventually forfeit your property and get back some of the money you paid for it. I don't see that she is legally over a barrel to pay this money.

I think you are confusing repossession and forfeiture. They are not the same.

In a repossession by the mortgage lender (because you haven't paid) the property is sold and you get back any difference in what you owe Vs the sale price.

In a forfeiture of the lease, because you've not paid what is required (or broken the lease in another way) the flat becomes the property of the freeholder, and the leaseholder doesn't get any money back (including if the freeholder subsequently sells the flat).

The OP in a forfeiture scenario would still be liable for any mortgage and any fees etc incurred as a result of owning the property. But wouldn't have any property - they lose twice.

Forfeiture is relatively uncommon, but nonetheless this isn't a route the OP ought to be contemplating.

I think I would go for forfeiture over shelling out £10,000 I don't have to get the roof fixed.

I live in my overdraft and the bank are falling over themselves to lend me money.

That's nuts.

Ok. Let's say you own a flat worth £200k on which you have a mortgage which has £150k outstanding, so you have £50k of equity.

You don't want to pay £10k for the roof repairs, so instead you give the freeholder your flat via forfeiture... The freeholder gets a property worth £200k, which they can sell and they keep all the money. You get nothing. You also have to move out (get evicted) as the flat is no longer yours.

However when you do this, you still owe the mortgage company £150k - and yes, you still need to pay that... But you have no flat.

Alternatively if you don't want to pay the £10k bill, you sell the flat and walk away with the equity. This is what most people do, which is why forfeiture is not common.

At some point you'll find the banks will stop seeing you as a good bet for lending... What's your plan when the music stops?

It doesn’t work like this.

The freeholder will write to the mortgage lender, informing them that the leaseholder is not paying required service charge or maintenance. The mortgage lender writes to the mortgagee reminding them of their obligations. If they still fail to pay, the mortgage lender would choose to make the payment on your behalf and charge you a high rate of interest on this extra money. They would consider it a breach of your mortgage terms and could choose to repossess or they could continue it as a second loan for as long as you continue to pay it. 

Does the lender know, you have a family member living in the property? You should have a regulated BTL mortgage on the property. Different to an ordinary BTL as you are letting to a family member.