TCB DCB Legal CNBC, Advice needed please!

Nodiscounts100

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82026144#Comment_82026144

I submitted my defence through money claim website. I am just super nervous as I have never been to a court and I have no idea what the judge will say. I just read very quickly through their defence and they said that I claimed to have paid by phone but I never said I paid by phone. Do I need a solicitor for this?

Coupon-mad

No of course not. No solicitor! You cannot recover their fees.

This stage is normal except you need to ring the court on Tuesday like I said, to find out the time if the hearing. Tuesday because you have something far more urgent to do right now & Monday.

Drafted your WS bundle today, like I advised? You are already late, which we know because theirs has arrived. Better late than not at all.

DO NOT PANIC & PAY. No reason to worry.

You already knew this would go to a hearing and that even if you lose, you pay less than the claim. Nobody here pays just because there's a hearing so deep breath and get the WS & exhibits done,

Post 2 of the NEWBIES thread tells you about hearings and WS bundles plus I give a whole list there, of recommended exhibits.

This could have been done in April/May in readiness but you can do it! Read some TPS Claim threads by searching for:

Judge hearing

…and change the filter to 'NEWEST' so you don't read old threads. You can copy from the WS they used.

Nodiscounts100

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82026859#Comment_82026859

This may sound silly but is the defence not the same as witness statement? I was not given to chance to send any witness statements, only what I submitted online and emailed to DQ.CNBC@justice.gov.uk and cc DCB.

my main worry is for the CC judgement to be on my record which will prevent from getting a mortgage etc

Nodiscounts100

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82026074#Comment_82026074

This is the letter

Le_Kirk

There is obviously a notice of allocation missing because you don't know the date of the hearing whereas dcb legal do. You must call the court as advised by @Coupon-mad to confirm date AND time. A defence is not the same as a witness statement. A witness statement backs up and supports what you submitted in your defence. Use the witness statement written by @JackR1 as an example of style and format. You seem to be confused between a witness statement and the DQ - N180 that you would have sent to DQ.CNBC@justice.gov.uk.

Gr1pr

Study the details in the link below, because a witness statement is not a defence

In simple terms, a defence could be "not guilty ", which is a statement and has no witness statement or details included

A witness statement could say that you were in Tokyo or on the Moon and so definitely have no legal responsibility for what the driver may have done , because you weren't there, and here are my flight ticket details and hotel accommodation receipt from the Hilton in Tokyo, with dates

The N180 is mainly about which court you want to select near you, plus all the dates that you are not available

Link below

https://247advice.uk/Court-Claims/?i=2

Coupon-mad

Have you done the WS yet? You'll know it's not the same as the defence if you have calmly done what I suggested and quickly read what you missed in the NEWBIES thread about exhibits stage.

DO NOT PRIORITISE RINGING THE COURT. THAT NOW WAITS UNTIL WEDNESDAY.

Prioritise the WS and evidence. I'm sure by now you must have read what I advised you to read last night and are halfway there with it?

Show us your draft.

We'll help you get this all done & dusted by tomorrow but you must show us a draft because it's your case, your facts. Your story.

We won't write you a WS. This is easy stuff.

That's why we gave you JackR1's posting profile link to copy & adapt his, which most posters easily do in about two hours (one evening). That's tonight.

Nodiscounts100

Please see below my draft witness statements and exhibits

1. I, XXXXXXX of XXXXXXX, am the Defendant in this claim. The facts stated in this Witness Statement are true to the best of my knowledge and belief.
2. In this statement I refer to exhibits attached in support of my evidence and will identify them where appropriate.
3. I am a litigant in person with no formal legal training. I have done my best to present my case clearly and truthfully and respectfully ask the Court to take this into account.
4. On 1 May 2025, I drove to Park Place, Manchester with my wife. Our intention was to visit a nearby restaurant for an evening meal.
5. Upon arrival, I attempted to pay for parking using the payment methods provided by the Claimant. I understood that payment was required and had every intention of purchasing a parking session.
6. Despite several attempts, I was unable to complete payment. The payment process repeatedly failed and no parking session could be successfully created.
7. I remained on site whilst attempting to resolve the issue and make payment. At no stage was my intention to avoid payment or to obtain free parking.
8. After multiple unsuccessful attempts, I decided that I could not leave my vehicle in the car park without a valid parking session. I therefore chose not to park there.
9. I exited the car park and parked elsewhere before continuing with my plans for the evening.
10. Attached as Exhibit EH-01 is evidence of a transaction at XXXXXXX at approximately 20:02 on 1 May 2025. This supports my evidence that my purpose for attending the area was to visit the restaurant with my wife and that I continued with those plans after leaving the Claimant's car park.
11. Attached as Exhibit EH-02 is a screenshot from my Google Timeline showing my presence at XXXXXXX during the relevant period.
12. Whilst the Claimant's ANPR evidence records my vehicle as remaining within the car park boundary for approximately 22 minutes, this does not establish that I parked and left the vehicle. It merely records entry and exit times.
13. During that period I was attempting to make payment and decide how to proceed after the payment system failed.
14. The Claimant's own evidence confirms that no valid payment session was created. That fact is entirely consistent with my account that repeated attempts to pay were unsuccessful.
15. The Claimant states that users were expected to pay using the Parkonomy application or mobile payment system. It is my evidence that those payment methods failed during my attempts to use them.
16. The Claimant also relies upon a five-minute consideration period. I respectfully submit that the circumstances of this case are materially different from a motorist who simply enters a site and remains without attempting payment. 
17. The Claimant relies upon ParkingEye Ltd v Beavis [2015] UKSC 67. However, the facts of that case are materially different from the present matter.
18. In Beavis, the motorist remained parked in the car park beyond the permitted free parking period and there was no dispute that the parking terms were understood and accepted. The issue before the Supreme Court was whether the parking charge itself was enforceable.
19. In the present case, I entered the site intending to pay for parking and made repeated attempts to do so using the payment method provided by the Claimant. Despite those attempts, I was unable to complete payment due to difficulties encountered with the application. Upon being unable to complete payment, I left the site rather than remain parked without payment.
20. Accordingly, this case does not concern a motorist who knowingly remained parked in breach of clearly understood parking terms. Instead, it concerns a motorist who made genuine attempts to pay but was unable to do so and subsequently left the site. I respectfully submit that the facts are therefore distinguishable from Beavis.
21. My conduct throughout was consistent with a person attempting to comply with the parking terms rather than evade them.
22. I derive no benefit from remaining on site for a short period whilst unsuccessfully attempting payment. Had payment been successful, I would have paid. When payment could not be completed, I left.
23. The Claimant's witness statement repeatedly suggests that I remained on the land in breach of contract. I respectfully disagree. My evidence is that I was attempting to comply with the parking terms and, when that proved impossible, I decided not to park there and exited the site.
24. I respectfully submit that the Claimant has failed to properly consider the circumstances leading to my presence on the site and has instead relied solely upon ANPR timestamps without taking account of the failed payment attempts and my decision to leave and park elsewhere.
25. I believe it would be unjust to penalise a motorist who made genuine attempts to pay, was unable to do so because of issues with the payment process, and ultimately chose not to park in the Claimant's car park.
26. The Claimant states that the Defence is substantially based upon a widely available template parking defence. I respectfully submit that this assertion is irrelevant to the issues before the Court. I am a litigant in person with no legal training or experience of court proceedings. As such, I have relied upon publicly available resources to better understand the legal process and to assist me in presenting my case. There is nothing improper about a litigant in person seeking guidance in a complex area of law.
27. The Court is concerned with the facts and evidence of this particular case, not the source from which legal arguments may have been derived. The Claimant's comments appear intended to undermine the Defence without addressing the substance of the matters raised.
28. Whilst some legal arguments may be commonly raised in private parking claims, the evidence relied upon in this case is entirely specific to the circumstances of this claim. My account of the events, my attempts to make payment, my subsequent visit to XXXX restaurant, and the documentary evidence exhibited in support of those facts are unique to this matter and should be considered on their merits.
29. I respectfully submit that the Claimant's reference to a "template defence" adds nothing of evidential value and does not assist the Court in determining the facts of the case.
30. For the reasons set out above, I respectfully request that the Court dismiss the claim.

Questions regarding the WS

1- Do I need to mention the Sarah Ensall case? they said they have reviewed their internal process to ensure continued compliance, they always said that they are not the only solicitors firm to be reviewing their processes

2- They said I overstayed the consideration period but this is not mentioned anywhere and I want to question what this is based on. Should I?

3- In my defence previously I said the machine was faulty but they attached a picture of the machine which was covered and they said they deliberately disabled it, that was my mistake as a long time had lapsed and I did not remember if I had tried to use the machine at the time. Now I do. The reason I was not able to pay is because their app was faulty I tried so many times with different cards and even used my wife's phone. They said that I said I tried using a telephone payment method, I am assuming they mean I tried to call a telephone number payment but I never said I did. I am not sure what to say about this?

4- Is google timeline a valid point to mention?

5- I never received a letter from court, shall I mention this the email and ask the court to re send the letter?

Really appreciate everyone's help on this

Coupon-mad

1. No, it's no longer a thing.
2. No.
3. "I tried so many times with different cards and even used my wife's phone." add that to your WS, which is good!
4. Not to show you were at a restaurant. That's irrelevant. Evidence of paying for parking elsewhere would be great!
5. No they won't read it in time (this is a submission for your judge to read on the day). You must phone or email separately to ask, like I said.

Whilst your WS is good (but repetitive so cull some repeated paragraphs!) you do have a gaping omission or two:

• You haven't taken the opportunity to tear their evidence apart! e.g. if it was dark/evening, are their 'exhibit' signage photos in daylight? Or are thry undated? Old images? Stock images? Say so.
• You don't seem to have read the recommended exhibit list provided in the NEWBIES thread post 2, because you haven't got the Beavis sign as a comparison, or the Beavis paragraphs we carefully collated for everyone, or Excel v Wilkinson.
• You've missed the section from JackR1 about HHJ Moloney (to prove that the Beavis case DID deal with the costs of the pre-action letter chain)
• You've missed the statement of truth.

Nodiscounts100

Here is my updated WS

1. I, XXXXXXX of XXXXXXX, am the Defendant in this claim. The facts stated in this Witness Statement are true to the best of my knowledge and belief.
2. In this statement I refer to exhibits attached in support of my evidence and will identify them where appropriate.
3. I am a litigant in person with no formal legal training. I have done my best to present my case clearly and truthfully and respectfully ask the Court to take this into account.
4. On 1 May 2025, I drove to XXXXXXX with my wife. Our intention was to visit a nearby restaurant for an evening meal.
5. Upon arrival, I attempted to pay for parking using the payment methods provided by the Claimant. I understood that payment was required and had every intention of purchasing a parking session. Despite several attempts, I was unable to complete payment as the payment process repeatedly failed and no parking session could be successfully created.
6. I remained on site whilst attempting to resolve the issue and make payment. At no stage was my intention to avoid payment or obtain free parking. After multiple unsuccessful attempts, I decided that I could not leave my vehicle in the car park without a valid parking session. I therefore chose not to park there, exited the site and parked elsewhere before continuing with my plans for the evening.
7. Attached as Exhibit EH-01 is evidence of a transaction at XXXXXXX at approximately 20:02 on 1 May 2025. This supports my evidence that my purpose for attending the area was to visit the restaurant with my wife and that I continued with those plans after leaving the Claimant's car park.
8. Attached as Exhibit EH-02 is a screenshot from my Google Timeline showing my presence at XXXXXXX during the relevant period.
9. Whilst the Claimant's ANPR evidence records my vehicle as remaining within the car park boundary for approximately 22 minutes, this does not establish that I parked and left the vehicle. It merely records entry and exit times. During that period I was attempting to make payment and decide how to proceed after the payment system failed.
10. The Claimant's own evidence confirms that no valid payment session was created. That fact is entirely consistent with my account that repeated attempts to pay were unsuccessful. The Claimant states that users were expected to pay using the Parkonomy application or mobile payment system. It is my evidence that those payment methods failed during my attempts to use them.
11. The Claimant also relies upon a five-minute consideration period. I respectfully submit that the circumstances of this case are materially different from a motorist who simply enters a site and remains without attempting payment.
12. The Claimant relies upon ParkingEye Ltd v Beavis [2015] UKSC 67. However, the facts of that case are materially different from the present matter. In Beavis, the motorist remained parked beyond the permitted free parking period and there was no dispute that the parking terms were understood and accepted. The issue before the Supreme Court was whether the parking charge itself was enforceable.
13. In the present case, I entered the site intending to pay for parking and made repeated attempts to do so using the payment method provided by the Claimant. Despite those attempts, I was unable to complete payment due to difficulties encountered with the application. Upon being unable to complete payment, I left the site rather than remain parked without payment.
14. Accordingly, this case does not concern a motorist who knowingly remained parked in breach of clearly understood parking terms. Instead, it concerns a motorist who made genuine attempts to pay but was unable to do so and subsequently left the site. I respectfully submit that the facts are therefore distinguishable from Beavis.
15. My conduct throughout was consistent with a person attempting to comply with the parking terms rather than evade them. Had payment been successful, I would have paid. When payment could not be completed, I left.
16. The Claimant's witness statement repeatedly suggests that I remained on the land in breach of contract. I respectfully disagree. My evidence is that I was attempting to comply with the parking terms and, when that proved impossible, I decided not to park there and exited the site.
17. I respectfully submit that the Claimant has failed to properly consider the circumstances leading to my presence on the site and has instead relied solely upon ANPR timestamps without taking account of the failed payment attempts and my decision to leave and park elsewhere. I believe it would be unjust to penalise a motorist who made genuine attempts to pay, was unable to do so because of issues with the payment process, and ultimately chose not to park in the Claimant's car park.
18. The Claimant states that the Defence is substantially based upon a widely available template parking defence. I respectfully submit that this assertion is irrelevant to the issues before the Court. I am a litigant in person with no legal training or experience of court proceedings and have relied upon publicly available resources to better understand the legal process and assist me in presenting my case. There is nothing improper about a litigant in person seeking guidance in a complex area of law.
19. The Court is concerned with the facts and evidence of this particular case, not the source from which legal arguments may have been derived. Whilst some legal arguments may be commonly raised in private parking claims, the evidence relied upon in this case is entirely specific to the circumstances of this claim. My account of the events, my attempts to make payment, my subsequent visit to XXXXXXX restaurant, and the documentary evidence exhibited in support of those facts are unique to this matter and should be considered on their merits.
20. I respectfully submit that the Claimant's reference to a "template defence" adds nothing of evidential value and does not assist the Court in determining the facts of the case.
21. Without prejudice to my primary position that no parking contract was formed and that I did not remain parked on the site, I respectfully submit that the amount claimed is excessive and unrecoverable.
22. The Claimant continues to pursue a sum substantially exceeding the original parking charge. I respectfully draw the Court's attention to paragraphs 98, 100, 193 and 198 of ParkingEye Ltd v Beavis [2015] UKSC 67, in which the Supreme Court recognised that the parking charge itself was intended to cover the costs of operating the parking scheme. I also refer the Court to paragraph 3.4 of the first instance judgment of HHJ Moloney in Beavis concerning the meaning of the operator's "costs of the operation".
23. I further draw the Court's attention to ParkingEye Ltd v Somerfield Stores Ltd [2011] EWHC 4023 (QB), where HHJ Hegarty considered the addition of further administrative charges to a parking charge and observed that such additions appeared penal in nature. In addition, I respectfully submit that any additional sums claimed over and above the original parking charge represent a form of double recovery, particularly where legal and court costs are already separately claimed. I invite the Court to consider the findings of HHJ Jackson in Excel Parking Services Ltd v Wilkinson, where the addition of further sums to a parking charge was rejected.
24. For the reasons set out above, I respectfully request that the Court dismiss the claim.

• STATEMENT OF TRUTH

I believe that the facts stated in this witness statement are true. I understand that proceedings for contempt of court may be brought against anyone who makes, or causes to be made, a false statement in a document verified by a statement of truth without an honest belief in its truth.

Having spent long trying to pay would this be considered that I had enough time to read terms and conditions? or am I expected to read them as I drive in?This is the entrance of the car park that they submitted, as the driver entering it is very difficult to read as you drive in, and even if you wanted to read it and was visible you would have to spend a few mins reading it which means you are blocking the entrance/exit. Can I use this as an argument? I have not been able to go to the location due to work commitments.