Share of freehold bought without consent of freeholder?

loubel

Commonhold is completely different to freehold/leasehold and it can't be both.

It doesn't sound like you have good relations with either of your neighbours, including your co-freeholder. I would recommend finding evidence of fraud before making any accusations.

HiroA

user1977 said:

HiroA said:

user1977 said:

HiroA said:

loubel said:

If you and A own the freehold then A&B setting up a company together doesn't impact that at all. Are you saying that they are trying to take over the management of the building through this company?

I spotted a letter from HMRC addressed to this company - I think it's breaches of leasehold agreements, they can't use the addresses for business, especially when the company should be invalid?

Very unlikely that anybody's lease prohibits them receiving mail for their company. "The company should be invalid" doesn't really make sense either.

I think the lease is granted for residential purpose and B only owns flat, not the house but the business address is for the house so I think I can ask company house to remove it?

No you can't, and even if you could, what good would it do?

The property is not going to be used for a company which was set up without the consent and knowleged of the joint owner.

born_again

HiroA said:

flaneurs_lobster said:

Sounds like OP and A'n'B have had a falling out and A'n'B have found the perfect way to jerk the OP's chain.

The OP still owns 50% of the freehold.Unless the other parties declare otherwise in an official submission to Companies House, the Land Registry or elsewhere I doubt if there's much that can (or should) be done.

Objecting to mail addressed to a business just sounds like pettiness, 
 
Try not to let this escalate, sooner or later there will need to be agreement on spend on some kind of house repair or maintenance. If the parties aren't talking it inevitably ends up with managing agents/factors being appointed at much increased cost.  

The freehold is owned as commonhold.  If the transaction and changes were made without my knowledge it will be illegal and invalid and I can ask the Land Registry to void it, it's a fraud and a crime. Also, that means A only received the payment for sellig the share.   I will ask a lawyer to search application status on Land Registry or find a way to do it.  I will definitely be taking further action as I am not prepared to lose such a big chunk of my assets by fraudulence like this. 

I would suggest that you engage professional service on this given your reaction. Rather than just asking on a public forum.

user1977

HiroA said:

user1977 said:

HiroA said:

user1977 said:

HiroA said:

loubel said:

If you and A own the freehold then A&B setting up a company together doesn't impact that at all. Are you saying that they are trying to take over the management of the building through this company?

I spotted a letter from HMRC addressed to this company - I think it's breaches of leasehold agreements, they can't use the addresses for business, especially when the company should be invalid?

Very unlikely that anybody's lease prohibits them receiving mail for their company. "The company should be invalid" doesn't really make sense either.

I think the lease is granted for residential purpose and B only owns flat, not the house but the business address is for the house so I think I can ask company house to remove it?

No you can't, and even if you could, what good would it do?

The property is not going to be used for a company which was set up without the consent and knowleged of the joint owner.

So you wouldn't mind so much if the registered office was somewhere else? You're not making much sense.

HiroA

I checked the incorporation document on the Company House and the objects are "to acquire, hold, maintain, repair and administer the freehold or leasehold land for the property" - as if they are the freeholders.  I have submitted a query to Land Registry explaining the situation and hope to hear from them too.

HiroA

loubel said:

Commonhold is completely different to freehold/leasehold and it can't be both.

It doesn't sound like you have good relations with either of your neighbours, including your co-freeholder. I would recommend finding evidence of fraud before making any accusations.

Sorry I made a mistake as I have been shocked - we own the freehold as "tennatns in common".  No response from A & B so far  which I think is quite telling. I think setting up a company which object is to "acquire, hold, maintain.....the property" like this is already wrong, it's prohibited in Declaration of Trust made between A and me on purchaseing the freehold,  but will be collecting evidence.

loubel

Out of interest, why don't you want the third leaseholder to  buy into the freehold? 

HiroA

loubel said:

Out of interest, why don't you want the third leaseholder to  buy into the freehold? 

loubel said:

Out of interest, why don't you want the third leaseholder to  buy into the freehold? 

1. B has been so aggressive I am scared of him.  He has wrongly and immediately accused me for breaching contracts because he did not want to take turn to clean the common area as set out in the lease, or pay the very reasonable and just service charge, whatever I say anything as landlord he would just accuse me as if I am a criminal, which he does not do to A.  A does not live in the property and does not do much landlord duties. B and his joint leasehodler have been noisy with parties etc and my sleep has been disturbed, and they have made very aggressive responses when I asked them to be quiet. I am sure their behaviour will get a lot worse once they become joint freeholder, and that this is the main reason that B must own the share of freehold, - they have not shown much interest for property maintenance.

So it is more important for me to be able to quietly enjoy and sleep at night than receiving the profict I might get from selling the share  - even though yes, money means a lot to me.

2. I have no trust in B, especially when it comes to important legal or money matters.  They served S42 notice to extend their lease but did not comply with it, they said they wil buy a freehold and offered an extremely low premium, half of our surveyor's worst case scenario premium, and said they won't pay landlord's legal fee even though it was their legal requirement. B sent me lots of harrassing and aggressing emails.  They didn't even go to Tribunal and their notice was deemed withdrawn, but they said they will demand their deposit back and will go ahead with the freehold buy in.  A stopped communicating to me  so I had to deal with all of this.  B did not pay landlord's fee so our lawyer forwarded the invoice to us to pay c£3,000, Still no  communication from A, I had to do lots of stressful hard work to make B pay. At one point I feared I had to pay £3,000 myself (as interests would be added daily) - so I held our service charge (although we only had about £600).  When A complained I said to him this was because if I ended up paying £3,000, and A made no response.  A has made no respone regarding this to this day. 

They then asked to buy freehold informally but we agreed for lease extension instead. We agreed that if the leaseholder did not act as agreed or changed their mind the transaction stops and they will be liable for everything up to that point.   Just after both sides instructed solicitors, B started saying that they never agreed things that were agreed (written and submitted to lawyer), I warned that I may withdraw from the offer if they didn't act as agreed, A stopped communicating at this point, but the leasholder wouldn't act as agreed, so I told our solicitor that I was withdrawing from the case and as a result our solicitor closed the case as it could not continue without me.

So really, I don't want to have any more involvement  with them other than that they are leaseholders, am reluctat to share finance and property maintenance with people I find so irresponsible, irrational and frankly, foolish. 

sgthammer

Whatever else is going on with your freehold, it's not at all illegal for a company to be registered at a residential address. HMRC advice specifically allows it. Clauses in leases, local zoning plans etc forbidding "operating a business" are slightly different, but generally intended to proscribe public-facing activity where customers are coming and going, there's excessive machine noise, or the like.

HiroA

sgthammer said:

Whatever else is going on with your freehold, it's not at all illegal for a company to be registered at a residential address. HMRC advice specifically allows it. Clauses in leases, local zoning plans etc forbidding "operating a business" are slightly different, but generally intended to proscribe public-facing activity where customers are coming and going, there's excessive machine noise, or the like.

The Company House says that you can complain about the registered address if the address is used without authority. I am one of the residents and also the joint freeholder so I think I can do this, and I might get the chance to view whatever documents they have submitted to defend it