Share of freehold bought without consent of freeholder?

kingstreet

If any of the flats is mortgaged they aren't going to be able to make any legal changes without the permission of the lenders concerned.

HiroA

loubel said:

If your Declaration of Trust with A says that you will add B to the Freehold at a premium agreed between you and A, you cannot just refuse to do this because you don't like or trust B. You both have to follow the terms of the Declaration of Trust. Hopefully this  sets out how the premium is to be decided in the event that you cannot agree?

A obviously cannot add B to the freehold unilaterally either. Both of you will need to consent. But there doesn't seem to be any evidence that they are actually trying to do this.

Honestly, it sounds like a shared freehold set up is not working for any of you and you would likely be wise to pay a management company to take over the management of the building. It may cost you all a bit more in fees but at least it would reduce the personal animosity between you over who should be doing what.

When I signed the DoT it was my first time and was ignorant and thought it could not be wrong as it was produced by a lawyer. but there was a lot of requests from A.

In fact I did agree to the freehold buy in with B, but A changed story and demanded to have more share of the premium than agreed at the last minutes, and when I didn't accept, he said the transaction would be over if I didn't accept.  So it didn't happen.  Then A came back to me and said if I would be happy to do lease extension instead. So we started the transaction. But B did not act as agreed so it did not happen.  Why can't people just stick to agreements - it should not be so complicated.  

I agree that A obviously cannot add B  to the freehold like this - my argument is that  what he is actually doing is breaching the clause that let us sell the share to B at an agreed premium.  If a share is to be sold, it has to be sold in the way set out in the DoT.  So A (and also B  )  has taken my right to sell it as set out in the DoT, and also taken my right to sell the flat with a benefit of potential income from selling a share, if the sales had not happen by that time.  I think it could be argued that it is a deliverate act to remove me from the sales and benefit A. 

I contacted my old lawyer and he advised me to seek a legal advice promptly.  He said he could not do this as he had presented both A and myself so it woud be conflict of interest.  

still no responses from A or B regarding my question about their freehold company.

loubel

Does the Declaration of Trust say what should happen in the event of a dispute?

HiroA

kingstreet said:

If any of the flats is mortgaged they aren't going to be able to make any legal changes without the permission of the lenders concerned.

B's flat is mortgaged.  

HiroA

loubel said:

Does the Declaration of Trust say what should happen in the event of a dispute?

"Trustees shall first attempt to resolve the dispute between themselves ",  otherwise " it shall be referred to an appropriate expert or professional agreed between trustees...etc"  But as it happend with A and the previous leaseholder, they could be sending documents for me to sign immediately, with a threat for court action. 

I think that's why they are not responding. 

loubel

So, if I am understanding correctly, the figure B offered is less than you feel the 1/3 freehold is worth but A was willing to accept this. So you will need to speak with A to appoint someone to adjudicate on what would be a reasonable figure to accept. Then if B wont pay it then that is B's issue and not yours. You can't just say no and walk away if A wants to go ahead with the transfer and A can't threaten legal action yet either. You both have to follow the process you agreed to in the Dec of Trust. I think you previously mentioned a surveyor being involved already, so perhaps they could assist with this.

poseidon1

loubel said:

The purpose of the Declaration of Trust is to set out how the joint ownership is to work. I would expect it to require you to transfer your interest in the freehold at the same time as selling your flat. If it doesn't then it doesn't seem it was well drafted for your needs.

100% agree!

In addition, any prospective buyer of the flat would be mad not to insist the share of freehold carries across with the leasehold. Really can't imagine what possible benefit OP think they could receive by this suggestion.

EDIT

Having just read the OPs previous thread, seems this is motivated by some wholly misguided act of revenge on other leaseholders in the midst of some kind of rolling grievance between the parties. All distinctly odd.

Emmia

poseidon1 said:

loubel said:

The purpose of the Declaration of Trust is to set out how the joint ownership is to work. I would expect it to require you to transfer your interest in the freehold at the same time as selling your flat. If it doesn't then it doesn't seem it was well drafted for your needs.

100% agree!

In addition, any prospective buyer of the flat would be mad not to insist the share of freehold carries across with the leasehold. Really can't imagine what possible benefit OP think they could receive by this suggestion.

EDIT

Having just read the OPs previous thread, seems this is motivated by some wholly misguided act of revenge on other leaseholders in the midst of some kind of rolling grievance between the parties. All distinctly odd.

Surely all the more reason  for the OP to cut ties? Why endure ongoing stress and anger? It's not good for anyone's health and wellbeing.

HiroA

loubel said:

So, if I am understanding correctly, the figure B offered is less than you feel the 1/3 freehold is worth but A was willing to accept this. So you will need to speak with A to appoint someone to adjudicate on what would be a reasonable figure to accept. Then if B wont pay it then that is B's issue and not yours. You can't just say no and walk away if A wants to go ahead with the transfer and A can't threaten legal action yet either. You both have to follow the process you agreed to in the Dec of Trust. I think you previously mentioned a surveyor being involved already, so perhaps they could assist with this.

I think you misunderstood a bit but may be my explanation was not good and clear.  Anyway, I stopped hearing from him during the last leasehold extention attempt. He stops communicatng from time to time.  A few months on,  I find their freehold company, I asked them for explanation, and they are not resonding. 

DE_612183

It looks like they have created a company to manage the 50% of the freehold that A owns, and then A&B each own 50% of that company - Look up on companies house you should be able to see the split of shares there.

However that does not change the fact that you own 50% and now Company C ( lets call it that ) owns 50% of the shares - nothing has really changed.

I can understand why you don't want to let B into the equation now, as you'll be out-voted as each member will have 33.3% - so your chare will be diminished.

What is the ideal outcome for you?