Parking charge - question about CCTV

TicketGuy2222

Hi all

I've read the Newbies thread, but I'm just looking for a bit more info on what to do when CCTV has been provided.

Brief summary: LadyBee Marina in Shoreham is a private car park where you can pay by the hour, but within the Marina is a pub. Customers of the pub can type in their registration on a tablet at the bar to be given free parking. I was not aware that relatively new rules meant the parking is only for 2 hours, but it used to be 4. I don't think this is made clear enough, there's no message on the tablet to inform you, and judging by what I've seen online a lot of people have been caught out.

I received a Parking Charge Notice to Keeper letter from GXS Services ltd, IPC accredited. They have CCTV footage of me entering and leaving the area, which shows I was indeed there 3.5 hours. Called the pub, nothing they can do as they are totally independent and have no control over the parking.

Interestingly, this parking area has multiple entrances as it is actually a through-road, there's nothing to stop you just driving through the car park if going to another part of the marina. Theoretically speaking,I could have entered, driven out the back, then passed through again 3.5 hours later. Now it's VERY LIKELY they have actual CCTV footage facing the car parking area, but who knows.

My question is, do I just send the standard template, or do I edit a little to say (obviously after stating the usual that I am not confirming the name of the driver) that it's a through road and that I would like CCTV evidence that I was there for the two hours (which is covered) as well as the 1.5 hours where it went over?

Or, just ignore that stuff, and just go in with the standard letter?

Thanks in advance!

Gr1pr

Are you sure that it's CCTV  ?  Not the more usual  ANPR cameras   ?

Surely they are monitoring the vehicles not the people like you  ?

If its a marina then I would expect that it's not relevant land,  so subject to bylaws 

TicketGuy2222

Gr1pr said:

Are you sure that it's CCTV  ?  Not the more usual  ANPR cameras   ?

Surely they are monitoring the vehicles not the people like you  ?

If its a marina then I would expect that it's not relevant land,  so subject to bylaws 

It could be ANPR by the entrance. Although looking on street view, I can see there are other CCTV cameras in the area. Although can't be sure if they are just for the various buildings around the place.

So do you think it would be worth mentioning this point when I send the template?

Gr1pr

Does the paperwork mention CCTV , or ANPR  ?

No point complaining about it if you dont know what it is they used, it's usually mentioned on the pcn

You seem to believe that it's relevant,  but why  ?  To what aim  ?

TicketGuy2222

I felt it would be relevant due to the fact that the road they've captured an image of my car (whether ANPR or CCTV) is a through-road, not just an entrance to a car park. Just seems like it would be an additional line of defense to point this out, but maybe I'm wrong.

The letter doesn't actually state it's CCTV or ANPR, it's just got two photos of my car - one on the way in, one on the way out.

Umkomaas

Let's see the NtK (suitably redacted of personal identifiable detail) where with a quick look at the photos of the vehicle will determine if ANPR or CCTV. 

A quick glance might suggest that there are byelaws in place. Do some research on that and come back with some evidence (particularly wat they might say about parking). 

Gr1pr

GXS and Shoreham come up regularly on here,  read a few other replies in similar threads 

When I asked you,  to shat aim, I was wondering what your end game was in regards to this 

Defence implies a court case, which is probably the only place it will be settled 

As for the minutia details,  I wouldn't mention CCTV unless you know it to be factual,  because its a more regulated thing regarding certification and registration,  data protection etc, than the more simpler but widely used ANPR 

TicketGuy2222

Here's a photo of the NtK.

The marina is under Shoreham Port Authority Byelaws. It states by using the car park you agree to the rates set out in their tariff. However, all it lays out is the hourly rate, it doesn't actually mention anything about enforcement.

Apologies for use of the word "defence", probably wrong term. I just meant I thought it could help my appeal.

Gr1pr

GXS are not going to cancel the pcn,  if that's what your appeal aim was  ?  It's just not going to happen,  regardless of what you write in it,  the charge would remain outstanding 

I think that its probably ANPR, and as there is no mention of CCTV, I doubt that it should be mentioned,  even if you appealed ( stick to basics, known facts  )

The whole area is probably under bylaws, including the road

TicketGuy2222

So if they're not going to cancel it, are you saying there's no point in appealing? Pardon my ignorance here, I thought following the process on the newbies thread was the right thing to do. 

Umkomaas

If the harbour is covered by byelaws, there can't be any keeper liability (not 'relevant land' as per the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012). The NtK is stating that GXS can enforce against the keeper - an unlawful misrepresentation. 

Gather all the byelaws evidence you can, then fire a complaint off to the DVLA that GXS is misrepresenting their position, contrary to their KADOE contract with the DVLA.  Getting them on your side to make GXS sweat is a more likely route to success. It also could result in DVLA sanctions against GXS. 

Use the following DVLA emails - same complaint to each. 

ccrt@dvla.gov.uk 

KADOEservice.support@dvla.gov.uk