Looking At Older Cars That Don't Have Modern Tech / Electronic Gizmos and Sensors etc......

tedted

you dontt what a clipper is? vw golf cabriolet called a rabbit in the usa

paul_c123

Mildly_Miffed said:

tedted said:

i have a 1992 clipper no cat carb with choke and its not on the ega database normal emission test 

What is this "clipper"?
A sailing ship used for carrying tea from the East Indies?
Packard Clipper?
Trident Clipper?
They were all out of production long before 1992, though.

Cats became compulsory on petrol cars with the inception of Euro1 emissions from August 1992, the start of J-prefix plates in the UK, but most manufacturers had been introducing them gradually in the years before that final deadline. Whatever your "clipper" turns out to be, it must have been a run-out model by then.

And, yes, a 1992 car with no cat will be subject to the basic non-cat 1986-1992 MOT emissions limit of 3.5% CO, 1200PPM HC (1975-86, same HC but 4.5% CO - pre-75, just not excessive visual smoke).
That's really, REALLY filthy by modern standards - anything catted should have near as dammit 0% CO or HC - which is unburnt fuel being wasted out of the exhaust.

With most cars now adhering to modern emission standards, we've forgotten just how unpleasant urban exhaust pollution used to be.

A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5a81bcf5ed915d74e6233d90/in-service-exhaust-emission-standards-for-road-vehicles-19th-edition.pdf

There is an exemption for some 1992-1995 cars, no cat needed. The VW Golf Mk1 Cabriolet (Clipper, ie not GTI, so uses a carb) is one such vehicle.

Mildly_Miffed

tedted said:

you dontt what a clipper is? vw golf cabriolet called a rabbit in the usa

It's usual to refer to cars by their make and model, not just their trim level - so, no, I did not connect "Clipper" with a VW Golf. It may be common parlance within VWonk circles, but not more widely.

And, yes, I was aware that the Mk1 Golf convertible inexplicably stayed in production well into the Mk3 Golf's lifecycle - although not that they'd cheaped out so badly on production that lower-spec versions were still on a carb despite the hatch having injection a decade and a half previously. The convertible had definitely been available with the GTi injection powertrain earlier in its lifecycle, so...

Bonniepurple

pseudodox said:

FlorayG said:

I was recently thinking about selling my 2003 Defender and getting something smaller. Every dealer went on and on about this gadget, that gadget, it's got this, it's got that...I just wanted a car that would go reliably and stop safely. In the end I decided to keep the Defender!

Good to hear of your 2003 vehicle still giving satisfactory service.  I am taking my 2005 car for her annual service and MOT next week.  Notwithstanding minor repairs over the years (all cars need new tyres, wipers, brake shoes etc) she runs like a dream and has very little that is complicated or that that can go expensively wrong.  So having passed her last 5 MOTs with flying colours I am keeping fingers crossed as I have no intention of replacing her.  When I bought this car about the most "exciting" feature the dealer pushed was the colour choice of the upholstery!

My elderly cousin drives a 2013 Defender and because of a minor incident he was sent for a driver assessment.  He has never had a serious accident, always driven big 4WDs, towed trailers and caravans and done years of rallying and off roading in very basic stripped out vehicles.  He was so confused by the gadgets, digital displays and gizmos of the assessment car he failed & to avoid a court appearance has to have driving lessons in a small modern gadget packed car in the hope he can pass a re-test only to get his beloved uncomplicated Defender back on the road

What exactly confused him? When driving, you need to watch the road (in front and behind), keep an appropriate speed, and, if in a manual, change gear.  I just ignore the other gizmos.  Having just seen a programme about elderly drivers involved in fatal accidents (one of which could only see 5cm in front of them!) I would be concerned that a driver who can’t cope with/ignore an electronic display might not be able to cope with modern day driving.

I’ve just changed from a 2016 Honda Jazz to a 2018 Ford Focus, and the latter definitely has more bells and whistles. I also drive a 2014 Peugeot Expert and I’m finding the difference unnerving for a couple of minutes but then I relax into the vehicle I’m in, not the other one.  

facade

To answer the original question, I reckon mid nineties to early 2000s.

They had just enough electronic controls to make them reliable, but still relied on mechanical engineering and reasonable build quality. The engines weren't made of unsuitable plastics either!

The only problem is they are getting on for 30 years old, and 30 years takes a toll on the cheap wiring, never mind 30 years of mechanical wear!

paul_c123

Fuel injection was a game changer in driveability. Definitely after the intro of fuel injection.

daveyjp

A Ford Fiesta or Focus with a non turbo petrol engine.

That_Sinking_Feeling

Our household runs two Ford Focuses.

Mine is a 2017 with the dreaded 'Ecoboom' engine so not what you're looking for. 

My husband's previously belonged to me, but I gave it to him and bought another when the mileage reached 170k. It's a 2012 1.6 Ti-VCT engine, which is pretty much the 1990s Ford Sigma engine with variable timing. It has had a couple of things go wrong with it over the years but they were good old-fashioned mechanical things, if that makes sense. And it's pretty tappety now, but that's not surprising with its mileage.

Neither Focus is overwrought with gadgets, IMO - you turn the lights on and off yourself, you turn the windscreen wipers on and off yourself... you get the idea. 

My other car is a 1987 Ford Sierra and I kinda miss the air con when I'm driving that! 😂

Frozen_up_north

When you first drive a gadget laden car, you think it is awful. However, legislation requires some assistance features so manufacturers have to include them (forward looking collision avoidance radar, lane departure warning that pulls on the steering when not indicating to change lane, etc).

The real reason as to why manufacturers have gone down the touch screen route is that it is easier for them to build, it avoids needing a lot of buttons and rotary controls. It is easier to upgrade too.

My new Seat Leon has quite a few gadgets:

All round ultrasonic sensors, handy to avoid hitting obstacles when parking, will suddenly brake if it senses you are going to hit something.

Forward looking camera, displays speed limit signs and many road signs, although a farm tractor symbol is shown as a deer (John Deere tractor  ). It even beeps if you exceed the speed limit.

Reversing camera with markings as to distance, and where your wheels will travel.

Automatic seat heating, auto fan control, auto headlights in dull light and adaptive LED headlights to avoid dazzling drivers... although they don't suddenly "dip", so many drivers don't realise your lights are adjusting to blank them from being lit up..

Being automatic, the auto handbrake, and auto park setting (when pressing the stop button) is very handy.

Linking to my phone so Waze navigation is available on the large car screen, handy for warning about pesky speed cameras, broken down cars, etc.

Spoken text messages and voice reply works perfectly.

Remote access to see your mileage, next service due, where you are parked and whether the car is locked.

The one thing I really do not like is the silly speedo and rev counter display. It is user changeable, but not to anything as nice as the older analogue meters. The road sign display is quite small, those who need glasses may need varifocals to see the road ahead and clearly see the dash board display.

Would I happily go back to a more basic car? No I wouldn't.

facade

Frozen_up_north said:

<snip>

The one thing I really do not like is the silly speedo and rev counter display. It is user changeable, but not to anything as nice as the older analogue meters. The road sign display is quite small, those who need glasses may need varifocals to see the road ahead and clearly see the dash board display.

Would I happily go back to a more basic car? No I wouldn't.

My Citroen has a HUD, an absolute gamechanger. The image appears far enough away that it is in focus, but the "dashboard" isn't.

So I can tell how fast I am going and see the prompts for speed limits, but if some tiny warning comes on the dash I can't read it.