No gas usage recorded on DCC since April. - Octopus billed for unreasonable amount of usage.

Chrysalis

masonic said:

Maybe we need a £40 standard of performance payment for meters not fixed within 28 days of being reported as dead.

I expect this to go to ombudsman again, they being deliberately obtuse e.g. asking me to send a meter read from a dead meter, and then when I reply with smart meter data they can use for their estimation, they then reply we understand what you showing us, and then go on to say what else can I do for you, I reply you can adjust the estimation with what I just sent you, and then radio silence.  There will be of course no deadlock like last time so a 2 month wait again.  Although I probably should wait until the new meter is in before escalating that far anyway.  This company is so hostile to deal with.

Also suspect they might replace electric meter as well, as I was informed power will need to be cut and it will be an extensive visit.

Meanwhile a dishonest person might not report the meter is dead and just get free gas for years because they dont react to broken meters of their own accord.

Chrysalis

masonic said:

Maybe we need a £40 standard of performance payment for meters not fixed within 28 days of being reported as dead.

They are behaving like a guilty party now, they have removed all data before April from my account.

Got a reply explaining they wont be rebilling, and an explanation of how they convert to kWh.  (this was pointless as the data has already converted to kWh, this perhaps suggests poor training from their staff as if they think I am looking at cubic meters)
I got a statement about how EAC is fair, and that in their words it is a "accurate estimate", is there such a thing?
They claimed they used smart meter data. (the 3 weeks recorded since weather got warm was 79kWh).
They didnt explain what data they used, and why they think EAC is fair, and what evidence they have to support that idea.

I went to reply with details of the usage, and all data has been wiped from my account prior to April.  Luckily its still on bright.

This has shown how important it is to have another supply of data given how devious these suppliers can become.

Chrysalis

EAC is on my bill, the amount estimated is pretty much 1/12th of the EAC (cost not consumption, consumption isnt presented), so no seasonal adjustment or anything, even if were to assume EAC is accurate.  So despite a claim they have factored in actual usage, I think they have done a lazy estimated annual cost by 12, no seasonal adjustment, then calculated a estimated usage to meet the £ value.
They also billed estimated during a week when there is data. (billed 103 kWh, when logged usage was 25.538 kWh)

I am dealing with a cowboy outfit.

superkoopauk

Makes you think Kraken isn't as good as system as they make it out to be!

brianposter

Chrysalis said:
They also billed estimated during a week when there is data. (billed 103 kWh, when logged usage was 25.538 kWh)

Surely that is the starting point for negotiation - actual usage is one quarter of their estimate.

Chrysalis

brianposter said:

Chrysalis said:
They also billed estimated during a week when there is data. (billed 103 kWh, when logged usage was 25.538 kWh)

Surely that is the starting point for negotiation - actual usage is one quarter of their estimate.

I agree, its logical right, Sadly there is no negotiation, Octopus are being authoritative.

masonic

I had the same issue last time I complained to them. About 7 replies got me nowhere. I then phoned and insisted for agreement that we had reached an impass and for permission to go to the Ombudsman. Later that day received a response from the original complaint handler (who I still believe to be an agentic AI) backing down and giving me everything I asked for. Essentially parroting back exact phrases I used in my last email reply. Peppered with apologies and acknowledgement it could now see I was right all along.

I think the problem is that humans play an ever diminishing role in the customer journey at Octopus. But for now I don't think they have the tech to fob off phonecalls.

Chrysalis

masonic said:

I had the same issue last time I complained to them. About 7 replies got me nowhere. I then phoned and insisted for agreement that we had reached an impass and for permission to go to the Ombudsman. Later that day received a response from the original complaint handler (who I still believe to be an agentic AI) backing down and giving me everything I asked for. Essentially parroting back exact phrases I used in my last email reply. Peppered with apologies and acknowledgement it could now see I was right all along.

I think the problem is that humans play an ever diminishing role in the customer journey at Octopus. But for now I don't think they have the tech to fob off phonecalls.

Thanks, I will probably do a phone call again at some point to try and resolve that way, but going to wait for the new meter to get installed as makes sense to wait to know all of what I will be disputing before taking it further.  Not convinced this is just down to dumb AI, but will see how it goes over the phone, my previous experiences of phone disputes hasnt been good with the company either.

Chrysalis

Ok so another small update, although I was leaving it alone they emailed me again and there has been further manipulation of my data.

They replied offering to regenerate estimated bill based on last 2 reads instead of something called AQ.

However there is more things happening which again call in to the integrity of who I am dealing with.

They are insisting there is no April data from the meter now, and by coincidence this data has been removed from my account, the earliest visible date is now mid April, so more history is continuously being removed, I have started a thread asking other Octopus customers if this is something routine so I have an idea of whats going on with the vanishing data,

Their story is start of April is estimated only, thats what I am supposedly looking at with the graph, however the graph is completely empty for the period where the meter died (2nd week of April onwards), and of course I know these graphs are specifically for smart meter data.  In addition the data is on Bright  for the first week of April, a independent 3rd party.  Bright doesnt estimate consumption it just presents what the meter has sent.

So I am now having to decide if Octopus are at this point being devious, or if their is a difference on interpretation of useable data.  I know in an earlier thread and some Octopus information pages validated readings get mentioned, so what "could" be happening is they are refusing to treat any data after the last validated reading as usage data from the smart meter, as they are also mentioned "last 2 meter reads" in their offer which would indicate that as well, it seems they are unwilling to estimate on day to day consumption data but only on validated readings aka legacy style readings.

They gave no indication of what this new proposal would calculate and didnt put those 2 readings in the email, so basically if I was to accept the offer its a roll of the dice with what comes out of it.  I feel inclined to not respond, as I feel they are being obstructive (such as claiming there is no April data and then it conveniently vanishes), wait for at least a month of usage on the new meter, and then resume attempted negotiation, if that goes nowhere, the 8 weeks will have expired for the ombudsman.

I have already decided to leave Octopus after this is closed, I have been with multiple energy suppliers, and its only Octopus I have found to be so aggressive and hostile when dealing with metering problems, trying to profit from every situation.

On the app these are the dates showing for readings (legacy).  They are also metric.

4 jun (zero value not an actual reading at all)
15 may obviously estimated although not labelled as such, increased by 27
14 april approx a week after meter failed.  probably fully estimated given their claim of no data for april. increased by 18

  7 april, I attempted to calculate m3 from kWh consumption data and this would be a little bit over 2 m3.

1 april the date they claimed meter stopped communicating, no increase
30 march, increased by 3
22 march, increased by 43
22 feb
22 jan
11 jan

Thats it for 2025, their offer is 2 most recent reads in March, so my guess would be 30 march and 22 march, the 22 feb to 22 march period includes 3 weeks of winter level usage which of course is convenient for Octopus.  So I think this is the issue, it seems they simply refuse to treat consumption data as usage for calculating estimated bills (actually completely invalidating it so not even a actual usage bill generated).  Then claiming there is no communication since the last validated reading.

There will be a counter from me, so one more attempt before the new meter is in, it will be to treat my calculated 7 April value as a reading (rounded up to 3 as goodwill gesture), and then use the two most recent readings of 7 April and 30 March.  

brianposter

There is another thread running which suggests that suppliers do not automatically have access to daily smart meter readings. This may be relevant and suggests that you should be making counter-proposals.