Rightmove wrong number of bedrooms and bathrooms

eddddy

RHemmings said:

I would think that a large proportion of those people with loft conversions that can't legally be classified as bedrooms would be requesting to have the number of bedrooms increased. 

There is no legal definition of a bedroom. Different organisations use different definitions.

The scary thing is that if a loft bedroom has no building regs approval, guidance for estate estate agents is that it shouldn't be counted as bedroom.

BUT.. insurance companies would often say it does count as a bedroom.



So an Estate Agent could describe a house as 3 bedroom, but if you insure it as 3 bedroom - the insurers might reduce or refuse your claim, because they consider it to be 4 bedroom.

Here's an example where something similar to that happened (but it's not quite as clear cut as that)...
https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/article-5550933/Our-house-burnt-insurer-refused-pay-said-7-bedrooms-not-five.html

artyboy

Good lord, Rightmove has the wrong number of bedrooms, the wrong floor area and the wrong  build date for my house.

Does that mean I can sue them for a squillion pounds?

LoopyLoops

When we were viewing I have looked at these out of curiosity and to see what changes the current owners have made if the old pictures are there.  I have enough sense to work out if any details aren’t right though.  It’s fairly obvious if an owner has made big changes to the layout or it’s just an error.  I put no store in the prices it gives.  Same for zoopla. 

michael1234

LoopyLoops said:

When we were viewing I have looked at these out of curiosity and to see what changes the current owners have made if the old pictures are there.  I have enough sense to work out if any details aren’t right though.  It’s fairly obvious if an owner has made big changes to the layout or it’s just an error.  I put no store in the prices it gives.  Same for zoopla. 

That may be your case and lost of other people's too but its not everyone's by a long way. Not only do many house hunters look at these numbers as part of an overall picture, "professionals" do too. They often provide a good starting point.

Also the algorimths can easily make sense of "number of bedrooms" but would find it much harder without AI to do anything more complex although I'm sure they do a bit of that too. In other words if you up the number of bedrooms and bathrooms into Zooplas/Rightmove's algorthim they would likely increase the price.

I've done some research about ther meaning of "personal data" and I think full address comes under that because it is identifying information. Whether a photo of your loo or not does I'm not sure. I'm about to find out....

Tabieth

michael1234 said:

LoopyLoops said:

When we were viewing I have looked at these out of curiosity and to see what changes the current owners have made if the old pictures are there.  I have enough sense to work out if any details aren’t right though.  It’s fairly obvious if an owner has made big changes to the layout or it’s just an error.  I put no store in the prices it gives.  Same for zoopla. 

That may be your case and lost of other people's too but its not everyone's by a long way. Not only do many house hunters look at these numbers as part of an overall picture, "professionals" do too. They often provide a good starting point.

Also the algorimths can easily make sense of "number of bedrooms" but would find it much harder without AI to do anything more complex although I'm sure they do a bit of that too. In other words if you up the number of bedrooms and bathrooms into Zooplas/Rightmove's algorthim they would likely increase the price.

I've done some research about ther meaning of "personal data" and I think full address comes under that because it is identifying information. Whether a photo of your loo or not does I'm not sure. I'm about to find out....

I’m not sure I understand. Is your house on the market now? If so then of course Right Move need to get the details right. If you’re trying to sell a three bed and RM list it as a one bed (for example), that’s a very big deal. But if you’re not selling now it doesn’t matter. If / when you come to sell in the future, you’ll list it with an EA and the RM details will be correct. But right now it’s irrelevant and academic, anyone doing research now shouldn’t be daft enough to let old, likely inaccurate info affect a possible decision in a possible future. 

BikingBud

michael1234 said:

LoopyLoops said:

When we were viewing I have looked at these out of curiosity and to see what changes the current owners have made if the old pictures are there.  I have enough sense to work out if any details aren’t right though.  It’s fairly obvious if an owner has made big changes to the layout or it’s just an error.  I put no store in the prices it gives.  Same for zoopla. 

That may be your case and lost of other people's too but its not everyone's by a long way. Not only do many house hunters look at these numbers as part of an overall picture, "professionals" do too. They often provide a good starting point.

Also the algorimths can easily make sense of "number of bedrooms" but would find it much harder without AI to do anything more complex although I'm sure they do a bit of that too. In other words if you up the number of bedrooms and bathrooms into Zooplas/Rightmove's algorthim they would likely increase the price.

I've done some research about ther meaning of "personal data" and I think full address comes under that because it is identifying information. Whether a photo of your loo or not does I'm not sure. I'm about to find out....

Again the bizarre UK housing market tries to attribute rooms as the important factor rather than total living space. Apart from bathrooms (although they now appear without baths) and kitchens which I would offer is easy to count as the number of rooms with cookers and sinks, all other space is just that living space; bedroom, dining room, craft or hobby room, dressing room, home office, fitness room, cinema room, or even home dungeon.

The potential buyer will be either content with the total space for the price or not.

I would add that anybody that trusts algorithms as a basis for any decision should understand who wrote the algorithm and what their intent might be, algorithms carry the bias and prejudice of the author.

Silvertabby

BikingBud said:

michael1234 said:

LoopyLoops said:

When we were viewing I have looked at these out of curiosity and to see what changes the current owners have made if the old pictures are there.  I have enough sense to work out if any details aren’t right though.  It’s fairly obvious if an owner has made big changes to the layout or it’s just an error.  I put no store in the prices it gives.  Same for zoopla. 

That may be your case and lost of other people's too but its not everyone's by a long way. Not only do many house hunters look at these numbers as part of an overall picture, "professionals" do too. They often provide a good starting point.

Also the algorimths can easily make sense of "number of bedrooms" but would find it much harder without AI to do anything more complex although I'm sure they do a bit of that too. In other words if you up the number of bedrooms and bathrooms into Zooplas/Rightmove's algorthim they would likely increase the price.

I've done some research about ther meaning of "personal data" and I think full address comes under that because it is identifying information. Whether a photo of your loo or not does I'm not sure. I'm about to find out....

Again the bizarre UK housing market tries to attribute rooms as the important factor rather than total living space. Apart from bathrooms (although they now appear without baths) and kitchens which I would offer is easy to count as the number of rooms with cookers and sinks, all other space is just that living space; bedroom, dining room, craft or hobby room, dressing room, home office, fitness room, cinema room, or even home dungeon.

The potential buyer will be either content with the total space for the price or not.

I would add that anybody that trusts algorithms as a basis for any decision should understand who wrote the algorithm and what their intent might be, algorithms carry the bias and prejudice of the author.

On the subject of bathrooms, a couple of years ago our renewed house insurance policy changed ours from two to three.  We have a main house bathroom (with bath), an en-suite (with shower) and a downstairs cloakroom (toilet and handbasin only).

We queried this, and it seems they are now adopting the American term for a cloakroom, being a 'half bath'.   Assume this terminology has spilled over into selling houses as well.

KittenChops

michael1234 said:

LoopyLoops said:

When we were viewing I have looked at these out of curiosity and to see what changes the current owners have made if the old pictures are there.  I have enough sense to work out if any details aren’t right though.  It’s fairly obvious if an owner has made big changes to the layout or it’s just an error.  I put no store in the prices it gives.  Same for zoopla. 

That may be your case and lost of other people's too but its not everyone's by a long way. Not only do many house hunters look at these numbers as part of an overall picture, "professionals" do too. They often provide a good starting point.

Also the algorimths can easily make sense of "number of bedrooms" but would find it much harder without AI to do anything more complex although I'm sure they do a bit of that too. In other words if you up the number of bedrooms and bathrooms into Zooplas/Rightmove's algorthim they would likely increase the price.

I've done some research about ther meaning of "personal data" and I think full address comes under that because it is identifying information. Whether a photo of your loo or not does I'm not sure. I'm about to find out....

re the bit on bold - no it doesn't
see here: https://ico.org.uk/for-organisations/uk-gdpr-guidance-and-resources/personal-information-what-is-it/what-is-personal-data/what-is-personal-data/
quoted from there:
“‘personal data’ means any information relating to an identified or identifiable natural person (‘data subject’); an identifiable natural person is one who can be identified, directly or indirectly, in particular by reference to an identifier such as a name, an identification number, location data, an online identifier or to one or more factors specific to the physical, physiological, genetic, mental, economic, cultural or social identity of that natural person”.
An address on its own doesn't identify anyone

user1977

KittenChops said:

michael1234 said:

LoopyLoops said:

When we were viewing I have looked at these out of curiosity and to see what changes the current owners have made if the old pictures are there.  I have enough sense to work out if any details aren’t right though.  It’s fairly obvious if an owner has made big changes to the layout or it’s just an error.  I put no store in the prices it gives.  Same for zoopla. 

That may be your case and lost of other people's too but its not everyone's by a long way. Not only do many house hunters look at these numbers as part of an overall picture, "professionals" do too. They often provide a good starting point.

Also the algorimths can easily make sense of "number of bedrooms" but would find it much harder without AI to do anything more complex although I'm sure they do a bit of that too. In other words if you up the number of bedrooms and bathrooms into Zooplas/Rightmove's algorthim they would likely increase the price.

I've done some research about ther meaning of "personal data" and I think full address comes under that because it is identifying information. Whether a photo of your loo or not does I'm not sure. I'm about to find out....

An address on its own doesn't identify anyone

Indeed. "Michael Bloggs lives in a 3 bedroom house" is personal data, "21 Acacia Avenue is a 3 bedroom house" is not.

michael1234

KittenChops said:

michael1234 said:

LoopyLoops said:

When we were viewing I have looked at these out of curiosity and to see what changes the current owners have made if the old pictures are there.  I have enough sense to work out if any details aren’t right though.  It’s fairly obvious if an owner has made big changes to the layout or it’s just an error.  I put no store in the prices it gives.  Same for zoopla. 

That may be your case and lost of other people's too but its not everyone's by a long way. Not only do many house hunters look at these numbers as part of an overall picture, "professionals" do too. They often provide a good starting point.

Also the algorimths can easily make sense of "number of bedrooms" but would find it much harder without AI to do anything more complex although I'm sure they do a bit of that too. In other words if you up the number of bedrooms and bathrooms into Zooplas/Rightmove's algorthim they would likely increase the price.

I've done some research about ther meaning of "personal data" and I think full address comes under that because it is identifying information. Whether a photo of your loo or not does I'm not sure. I'm about to find out....

re the bit on bold - no it doesn't
see here: https://ico.org.uk/for-organisations/uk-gdpr-guidance-and-resources/personal-information-what-is-it/what-is-personal-data/what-is-personal-data/
quoted from there:
“‘personal data’ means any information relating to an identified or identifiable natural person (‘data subject’); an identifiable natural person is one who can be identified, directly or indirectly, in particular by reference to an identifier such as a name, an identification number, location data, an online identifier or to one or more factors specific to the physical, physiological, genetic, mental, economic, cultural or social identity of that natural person”.
An address on its own doesn't identify anyone

You might be right but your link doesn't really prove it either way.

I think this link (if you search for "house") is more to-the-point. Again its not 100% clear.
https://ico.org.uk/for-organisations/uk-gdpr-guidance-and-resources/personal-information-what-is-it/what-is-personal-data/what-is-the-meaning-of-relates-to/

This one whilst not the bible on the subject is likely to be correct. Which?'s take:

https://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/advice/what-counts-as-personal-data-a4T2s2Y2ffXd
"for example your home address "
is listed as personal data.

Its definitely not crystal clear. I think folk should be more circumspect before jumping in.