What's going on under my sink? (Sorted!)

Jemma01

Hello 

Venturing into the underworld of my sink, there's lots going on and I don't know what's what. Would be very nice to understand that part before a disaster strikes.

For background to the pictures
* To the right of the sink, there is a dishwasher (I THINK that's the yellow)
* to the left of the sink, there is a washing machine (I THINK that's the lilac)
* behind the sink there is an outside tap (I THINK that's the red!?)

The internal stopcock is the green, and the hot and cold pipes are marked.

By looking at this, is it fair to say that
* The two blue handles are to isolate the dishwasher and washing machine?
* there is no isolation for the outside tap except the internal stopcock? I'm looking to replace the outside tap, the handle is broken, but can't figure out if there is an isolation valve to disconnect it.

How do I know for sure which one is for the oustide? I wish I could turn it on, the handle is broken, I'd be able to sense the vibration on the pipe

Thanks


this is the part above that picture




It's all sorted now, final results for this thread is here
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81373315/#Comment_81373315

MikeJXE

If you want to know for sure turn off the water at the main stopcock

silvercar

Looks to me that the tap circled in red does have an isolator. You can see the slot that will fit a standard screwdriver. Turning it so the line is in line with the pipe should allow the water to flow. Currently it looks to be off.

Jemma01

MikeJXE said:

If you want to know for sure turn off the water at the main stopcock

I put few questions, I'm not sure what you're referring to with this, and unfortunately not sure how that would help. Mind elaborating?
Wouldn't stopping the main just turn everything off leaving me just as confused trying to identify which is which?

Jemma01

silvercar said:

Looks to me that the tap circled in red does have an isolator. You can see the slot that will fit a standard screwdriver. Turning it so the line is in line with the pipe should allow the water to flow. Currently it looks to be off.

ah that's perfect, thank you. It probably explains the broken handle. Guess the previous owner would have turned things off since it wasn't of use for them.

Section62

Jemma01 said:

silvercar said:

Looks to me that the tap circled in red does have an isolator. You can see the slot that will fit a standard screwdriver. Turning it so the line is in line with the pipe should allow the water to flow. Currently it looks to be off.

ah that's perfect, thank you. It probably explains the broken handle. Guess the previous owner would have turned things off since it wasn't of use for them.

Generally when doing a quick job it can be better to do what MikeJXE suggests and turn off the main stopvalve (green) though.  Those screwdriver operated isolation valves (red) - especially cheap ones - are prone to leak if disturbed.  It is also a good idea to operate main stopvalves (green) from time to time to make sure they don't seize up.  Using the main stopvalve (green) to temporarily isolate the outside tap would avoid the risk of a leaking isolation valve (red) plus gives the main stopvalve an occasional anti-seize use.

Because the isolation valve (red) is already off you shouldn't need to operate either valve to be able to change the outside tap - although bear in mind if you buy the right replacement outside tap you may be able to swap the handle only.

Also bear in mind the isolation valve (red) may have been left in the 'off' position because that is the only place where it doesn't leak.  When you turn it on, have some towels ready and be prepared to turn it back to the current position if water starts coming out.  And try to leave it/them alone on weekends/bank holidays/evenings when emergency plumber callouts are more expensive, just in case the leak won't stop.

Rodders53

Red ringed:  It's not missing a handle.  It's a screwdriver slot type isolator.  As opposed to an appliance isolator with a coloured handle.

NB Both those waste pipes from the appliances should loop up as high as possible inside the cabinet and enter the waste going down (so joins need loosening and rotating to do that as well as bringing more waste through, if there is enough).

As they are it appears that dirty, contaminated, water could flow back into the appliances via gravity.  Most appliances come with a U-former to assist with that.

Some would recommend fitting clips to stop the waste pipes from popping off under pressure from the appliance drain pumps, too. Rather than relying on friction.

Jemma01

Section62 said:

Jemma01 said:

silvercar said:

Looks to me that the tap circled in red does have an isolator. You can see the slot that will fit a standard screwdriver. Turning it so the line is in line with the pipe should allow the water to flow. Currently it looks to be off.

ah that's perfect, thank you. It probably explains the broken handle. Guess the previous owner would have turned things off since it wasn't of use for them.

Generally when doing a quick job it can be better to do what MikeJXE suggests and turn off the main stopvalve (green) though.  Those screwdriver operated isolation valves (red) - especially cheap ones - are prone to leak if disturbed.  It is also a good idea to operate main stopvalves (green) from time to time to make sure they don't seize up.  Using the main stopvalve (green) to temporarily isolate the outside tap would avoid the risk of a leaking isolation valve (red) plus gives the main stopvalve an occasional anti-seize use.

Because the isolation valve (red) is already off you shouldn't need to operate either valve to be able to change the outside tap - although bear in mind if you buy the right replacement outside tap you may be able to swap the handle only.

Also bear in mind the isolation valve (red) may have been left in the 'off' position because that is the only place where it doesn't leak.  When you turn it on, have some towels ready and be prepared to turn it back to the current position if water starts coming out.  And try to leave it/them alone on weekends/bank holidays/evenings when emergency plumber callouts are more expensive, just in case the leak won't stop.

I'm struggling to get the courage for that because I don't know how my heat pump's water cylinder would respond to it, I might be worrying too much, I know I have to at some point and better now than when a problem occurs! 

Jemma01

Rodders53 said:

Red ringed:  It's not missing a handle.  It's a screwdriver slot type isolator.  As opposed to an appliance isolator with a coloured handle.

NB Both those waste pipes from the appliances should loop up as high as possible inside the cabinet and enter the waste going down (so joins need loosening and rotating to do that as well as bringing more waste through, if there is enough).

As they are it appears that dirty, contaminated, water could flow back into the appliances via gravity.  Most appliances come with a U-former to assist with that.

Some would recommend fitting clips to stop the waste pipes from popping off under pressure from the appliance drain pumps, too. Rather than relying on friction.

Thanks for that, much appreciated. I plan to replace the whole kitchen in a year's time. I'm taking notes, its good to know what to look for when a plumber comes in. 

WIAWSNB

Jemma01 said:

Venturing into the underworld of my sink, there's lots going on and I don't know what's what. Would be very nice to understand that part before a disaster strikes.
For background to the pictures
* To the right of the sink, there is a dishwasher (I THINK that's the yellow) Almost certainly, yes.
* to the left of the sink, there is a washing machine (I THINK that's the lilac) Almost certainly, yes.
* behind the sink there is an outside tap (I THINK that's the red!?) Almost certainly, yes.

The internal stopcock is the green, and the hot and cold pipes are marked. Yes, yes, and ditto.

By looking at this, is it fair to say that
* The two blue handles are to isolate the dishwasher and washing machine? Yes.
* there is no isolation for the outside tap except the internal stopcock? What?! You were doing so well, and now you've gorn all bonkers. You've already said that the 'red' is the outside tap valve, so there.

I'm looking to replace the outside tap, the handle is broken, but can't figure out if there is an isolation valve to disconnect it. Like, duh. It's like, circled in red, like.

How do I know for sure which one is for the oustide? Red. It's RED. RED!!!, dammit. I wish I could turn it on, the handle is broken, I'd be able to sense the vibration on the pipe

Thanks


this is the part above that picture.

And the below pic shows the same type of screwdriver-operated isolating valves for the sink tap - all good to have. See how the slots are in line with the pipes? That's 'on'.

Nice post - lots of detail :-)

Bits in BOLD above.

Are you hoping, wishing, to replace the outside tap yourself? If so, could you post a piccie of it, please, and we can guide you.

Meanwhile, check that the 'green' mains stopcock is operating smoothly - try turning it closed, and check that the cold kitchen tap has stopped. If it works, then that's your go-to in an emergency...

Now reopen it all the way until it stops, and then close it one turn - that'll help prevent it seizing in the open position.

grumpy_codger

Rodders53 said:

...

Some would recommend fitting clips to stop the waste pipes from popping off under pressure from the appliance drain pumps, too. Rather than relying on friction.

This has nothing to do with the pressure. Water pump is near the inlet of the hose. At the outlet the pressure is negligibly low unless the outlet is blocked.