Transferring property to Beneficiary

fiddle290

Land_Registry said:

fiddle290 said:

Land_Registry said:

The legal ownership stays with the deceased owner's estate until it is dealt with, namely transferred. 
Leaving it to someone or inheriting is not enough to transfer the legal ownership. Your paper trail shows who died and who left what to whom and who inherited. What it doesn't do is transfer the legal ownership from the deceased's Father's estate and as a result it stays there until it is actually transferred by the appropriate executor. When he died his executor could/should have transferred it to whoever the beneficiary was.
So roll forward and you now want to transfer the property to a (later) beneficiary. That transfer will trigger first registration so forms FR1 and DL will be required plus the original deeds
In cases where a sole owner dies, probate is granted, the executor dies, and probate is granted you can create what is known as a 'chain of representation'. You refer to having probates but do you have such a chain?
If you do then the final executor can transfer the legal ownership to the current beneficiary using form AS1 but you need to prove that 'chain' by producing certified copies of each probate.
For example if A owned the property and dies; probate granted to B; B then dies and probate for B is granted to C. C now wants to transfer the ownership to D - your chain is probates for A and B

If I am understanding you correctly I have to produce the probates from A-C which I have, all original showing it passed from father to mother to daughter and now trying to pass this to cousin.  Is that correct?  If so, Land Registry have been given all.

If you can prove a chain of representation has bene created then that can be acceptable for registration purposes. You don't need a separate transfer by each executor to a beneficiary for example.
You have made an application and received a specific response from us so you should be guided by that response as my colleagues will be aware of the specifics involved and what you have lodged to date.
You can research a 'chain of representation' online and confirm for yourself if you have achieved same - IHTM05114 - Exceptions where no grant is needed: chain of representation (England, Wales and Northern Ireland) - HMRC internal manual - GOV.UK

I appreciate your answer and have gone through everything, so no chain is broken.  Next step a complaint to Land Registry.

fiddle290

fiddle290 said:

Land_Registry said:

fiddle290 said:

Land_Registry said:

The legal ownership stays with the deceased owner's estate until it is dealt with, namely transferred. 
Leaving it to someone or inheriting is not enough to transfer the legal ownership. Your paper trail shows who died and who left what to whom and who inherited. What it doesn't do is transfer the legal ownership from the deceased's Father's estate and as a result it stays there until it is actually transferred by the appropriate executor. When he died his executor could/should have transferred it to whoever the beneficiary was.
So roll forward and you now want to transfer the property to a (later) beneficiary. That transfer will trigger first registration so forms FR1 and DL will be required plus the original deeds
In cases where a sole owner dies, probate is granted, the executor dies, and probate is granted you can create what is known as a 'chain of representation'. You refer to having probates but do you have such a chain?
If you do then the final executor can transfer the legal ownership to the current beneficiary using form AS1 but you need to prove that 'chain' by producing certified copies of each probate.
For example if A owned the property and dies; probate granted to B; B then dies and probate for B is granted to C. C now wants to transfer the ownership to D - your chain is probates for A and B

If I am understanding you correctly I have to produce the probates from A-C which I have, all original showing it passed from father to mother to daughter and now trying to pass this to cousin.  Is that correct?  If so, Land Registry have been given all.

If you can prove a chain of representation has bene created then that can be acceptable for registration purposes. You don't need a separate transfer by each executor to a beneficiary for example.
You have made an application and received a specific response from us so you should be guided by that response as my colleagues will be aware of the specifics involved and what you have lodged to date.
You can research a 'chain of representation' online and confirm for yourself if you have achieved same - IHTM05114 - Exceptions where no grant is needed: chain of representation (England, Wales and Northern Ireland) - HMRC internal manual - GOV.UK

I appreciate your answer and have gone through everything, so no chain is broken.  Next step a complaint to Land Registry.

I have sought legal advice and they have said "all relevant documents have been submitted, so I cannot see the basis for the requisition. Under these circumstances, you may raise your concerns about how the matter has been handled as a formal complaint."  So to summarise, I have provided:

1.  A (father) leave property to B (wife)
2. B (wife) gets probate and Assent, both given to Land Registry
3. B (wife) leave to C (daughter), Will/Death Cert given to Land Registry
4. C (daughter) gets Probate, provided to Land Registry
5. C (daughter) dies.  C leaves to D.
6. E (Executor) gets Probate, giving Will and Probate to Land Registry  and tries to transfers to D with AS1.  The property was never registered so tried to do FR1.

So, for chain, I have proven it with no gapes, in fact, have given more, yet the person dealing with this still won;'t call me despite saying in a letter to arrange one or letters.  I've given B's probate for A's estate; B's will, C's probate for B's will' C's Will and probate for E.  (also given Death Certs and wills).

Where do I go from here?

Land_Registry

fiddle290 said:

fiddle290 said:

Land_Registry said:

fiddle290 said:

Land_Registry said:

The legal ownership stays with the deceased owner's estate until it is dealt with, namely transferred. 
Leaving it to someone or inheriting is not enough to transfer the legal ownership. Your paper trail shows who died and who left what to whom and who inherited. What it doesn't do is transfer the legal ownership from the deceased's Father's estate and as a result it stays there until it is actually transferred by the appropriate executor. When he died his executor could/should have transferred it to whoever the beneficiary was.
So roll forward and you now want to transfer the property to a (later) beneficiary. That transfer will trigger first registration so forms FR1 and DL will be required plus the original deeds
In cases where a sole owner dies, probate is granted, the executor dies, and probate is granted you can create what is known as a 'chain of representation'. You refer to having probates but do you have such a chain?
If you do then the final executor can transfer the legal ownership to the current beneficiary using form AS1 but you need to prove that 'chain' by producing certified copies of each probate.
For example if A owned the property and dies; probate granted to B; B then dies and probate for B is granted to C. C now wants to transfer the ownership to D - your chain is probates for A and B

If I am understanding you correctly I have to produce the probates from A-C which I have, all original showing it passed from father to mother to daughter and now trying to pass this to cousin.  Is that correct?  If so, Land Registry have been given all.

If you can prove a chain of representation has bene created then that can be acceptable for registration purposes. You don't need a separate transfer by each executor to a beneficiary for example.
You have made an application and received a specific response from us so you should be guided by that response as my colleagues will be aware of the specifics involved and what you have lodged to date.
You can research a 'chain of representation' online and confirm for yourself if you have achieved same - IHTM05114 - Exceptions where no grant is needed: chain of representation (England, Wales and Northern Ireland) - HMRC internal manual - GOV.UK

I appreciate your answer and have gone through everything, so no chain is broken.  Next step a complaint to Land Registry.

I have sought legal advice and they have said "all relevant documents have been submitted, so I cannot see the basis for the requisition. Under these circumstances, you may raise your concerns about how the matter has been handled as a formal complaint."  So to summarise, I have provided:

1.  A (father) leave property to B (wife)
2. B (wife) gets probate and Assent, both given to Land Registry
3. B (wife) leave to C (daughter), Will/Death Cert given to Land Registry
4. C (daughter) gets Probate, provided to Land Registry
5. C (daughter) dies.  C leaves to D.
6. E (Executor) gets Probate, giving Will and Probate to Land Registry  and tries to transfers to D with AS1.  The property was never registered so tried to do FR1.

So, for chain, I have proven it with no gapes, in fact, have given more, yet the person dealing with this still won;'t call me despite saying in a letter to arrange one or letters.  I've given B's probate for A's estate; B's will, C's probate for B's will' C's Will and probate for E.  (also given Death Certs and wills).

Where do I go from here?

The devil will be in the detail of what has been submitted and how the property is registered. I assume your complaint remains ongoing/outstanding so that would be where you go from here if the application is not progressing