In a panic please help. AET self employed carer transitional protection ending

kazzyb123

I have had this message from UC saying we are no longer entitled to it but I’m sure it’s wrong. My partner is self employed and I am on contributions based ESA & PIP.
As far as I know AET doesn’t apply because he is self employed, have I got this wrong?

“You no longer meet the criteria for transitional protection as within your 1st assessment period the earnings received were above our AET. This means any future assessment period where earnings are below the AET for 3 consecutive assessment periods will mean you no longer meet eligibility for transitional protection which is why u have been asked to report a change to ‘savings & investments’ to see if u are eligible going forwards”

We have savings over 16K which means the claim would end.

is this right? Please help

NedS

Yes, unfortunately this is correct.

This is about entitlement to Transitional Protection. If there were earnings above the AET in the first assessment period (which may be implied by the partner being gainfully self employed), then transitional protection will end where earnings drop below the threshold for 3 consecutive assessment periods.

If transitional protection ends, the claim will also close where the claimant(s) have more than £16k in savings as there is no longer an entitlement to UC.

kazzyb123

@Neds but he is self employed and when I looked up AET it says it doesn’t apply to self employed people.
Also because I claim contributions based ESA and Full PIP he claims carer element which i think means he doesn’t have to show he is gainfully self employed.
if you are self employed your income goes up and down all the time that can’t be helped, the Van MOT and repairs, Van insurance, etc all went out in consecutive months so the earnings were low then

TimeLord1

The contribution related ESA is New Style and will continue regardless of savings anything income related will stop once the 16k is passed 

kazzyb123

@TimeLord1 please see extra info is this still really right. Self employed people have no control over when they are paid and some months there are more expenses.
Also because I have PIP enhanced on both elements and ESA support group there is no need for him to show he is gainfully self employed

TimeLord1

kazzyb123 said:

@TimeLord1 please see extra info is this still really right. Self employed people have no control over when they are paid and some months there are more expenses.
Also because I have PIP enhanced on both elements and ESA support group there is no need for him to show he is gainfully self employed

PIP is separate and will continue anything income related will not be paid to you by Universal credit once the 16k is breached. On UC it would be earnings you would declare as income regardless because it reduces the monthly UC account after an amount certain earnings but over 16k in savings there is no income related entitlement.

Spoonie_Turtle

kazzyb123 said:

@Neds but he is self employed and when I looked up AET it says it doesn’t apply to self employed people.
Also because I claim contributions based ESA and Full PIP he claims carer element which i think means he doesn’t have to show he is gainfully self employed.

That's all relevant to conditionality thresholds - as in, if he weren't a carer then he'd either have to be gainfully self-employed or earning above the AET in order to not be required to attend appointments and look for work. 
This is probably what most information online will relate to as well, regarding the AET, because it's been relevant to very many people for many years at this point.

But you've encountered a different issue, the AET being a threshold for continued entitlement to transitional protection.

I do not know if there's any exemption from that, but when you are looking up information you need to be aware of the difference between the two issues and make sure you're not applying irrelevant info about conditionality thresholds to your situation which is a different issue.

8dayweek

AFAIK there is no exemption from losing TP due to Earnings dropping below the AET, even if your overall Conditionality doesn’t require you to meet any AET / CET. 

It mirrors Working Tax Credits in so far as there was a minimum hours limit in order to qualify (16 or 30 from memory), otherwise you’d lose it. 

HillStreetBlues

NedS said:

Yes, unfortunately this is correct.

This is about entitlement to Transitional Protection. If there were earnings above the AET in the first assessment period (which may be implied by the partner being gainfully self employed), then transitional protection will end where earnings drop below the threshold for 3 consecutive assessment periods.

If transitional protection ends, the claim will also close where the claimant(s) have more than £16k in savings as there is no longer an entitlement to UC.

If the OP's partner is gainfully self employed and subject to minimum income floor or the start-up period then would they be classed as earning above the AET whatever their ernings?

8dayweek

HillStreetBlues said:

NedS said:

Yes, unfortunately this is correct.

This is about entitlement to Transitional Protection. If there were earnings above the AET in the first assessment period (which may be implied by the partner being gainfully self employed), then transitional protection will end where earnings drop below the threshold for 3 consecutive assessment periods.

If transitional protection ends, the claim will also close where the claimant(s) have more than £16k in savings as there is no longer an entitlement to UC.

If the OP's partner is gainfully self employed and subject to minimum income floor or the start-up period then would they be classed as earning above the AET whatever their ernings?

Definitely not if in Start Up Period. 

If subject to MIF I think not… because it’s actual earnings that will count (not assumed earnings from the MIF)

(I’m basing the above assumption on the fact the application of the MIF alone does not remove the benefit cap - only physical earnings are above the threshold do). 

8dayweek

HillStreetBlues said:

NedS said:

Yes, unfortunately this is correct.

This is about entitlement to Transitional Protection. If there were earnings above the AET in the first assessment period (which may be implied by the partner being gainfully self employed), then transitional protection will end where earnings drop below the threshold for 3 consecutive assessment periods.

If transitional protection ends, the claim will also close where the claimant(s) have more than £16k in savings as there is no longer an entitlement to UC.

If the OP's partner is gainfully self employed and subject to minimum income floor or the start-up period then would they be classed as earning above the AET whatever their ernings?

Sorry I’m wording that really badly. 

Start Up Period - No, same would apply. Earnings would need to remain above AET (or not drop below AET for more than 3x AP’s) to retain TP.

MIF - No, same would apply. MIF would be used if Earnings are below this amount, but only actual Earnings (not assumed / notional Earnings) would count for purposes for whether you are consistently earning above AET to retain TP.