Recent CCJ - Advice Needed

cda17

I've updated WS above with your recommendations @Coupon-mad

How does it all look now?

Thanks

Coupon-mad

May 2024 was the month of the preliminary finding in Carr which let him appeal to the CoA.

4/3/25 was the date of the hearing (video).

cda17

Coupon-mad said:

May 2024 was the month of the preliminary finding in Carr which let him appeal to the CoA.

4/3/25 was the date of the hearing (video).

I have changed the date in updated WS in previous comment.

Is there anything else before I submit the application?

cda17

Finally, is my N244 form ok:

I have wrote CNBC as the "Name of Court" as the N244 form isn't a form used by Scottish Courts and Tribunals Service. 

If not CNBC, I'm not sure what to write in that box?





If this looks ok, I'll email it all across to CNBC today and pay the fee.

Johnersh

I'd probably have done a much shorter statement limited to the facts, rather than legal argument, but that's me.

Lengthy recitation from other cases (too much legal argument) potentially obscures your story and the short points that this is obviously a procedural error. I think it can be punchier. My personal view is that one shouldn't make a judge work hard to understand the key issues. 

So, for example, why is there reference to service by alternative means if C has never applied for that (at all)?

The application is for:

1. To set aside default judgment on the basis that it was incorrectly entered
2. To strike out the claim, which has not been served to a permitted service address 
3. Costs

You can request costs on the application, but you don't need lengthy case law about costs in a witness statement - you ain't been awarded costs yet, nor are your costs crystallised (you may need to travel for a hearing). If it were my statement i'd prune that.

Probably the only exhibits needed are the claim form, the trace enquiries and a utility bill - that shows where D was, what info C could have obtained and what date C issued.

Remember classes of documents can be bunched into a single exhibit (with index) if paginated. So 5 utility bills or a whole bunch of letters can be single exhibits. That's less unwieldy.

If you are serving a witness statement the box on the back of an n244 does not require completion.

I suspect that this will be allocated to the county court nearest the claimant, given that the defendant has no address in E&W.

cda17

@Johnersh - thanks for your recommendations.

I'll keep it short and simple on my N244 form as you said (Updated N244 above).

In regards to cost, I will be paying £313 straight away for the application fee.

Can you quote which parts of my WS you would remove, keeping in mind I would like to at least have my application fee reimbursed.

I'm still not sure what court to put on the N244 form. The PoC doesn't tell me much, I'm actually unsure where this CCJ was even done.

Thanks again

Coupon-mad

The CCJ was granted by default by the CNBC system, with no Judge even looking at it. The claim never got allocated to a court nor even small claims.

So you are right to put 'CNBC' as the 'court'.

Johnersh won't have time pro bono to provide exact pruning and he isn't here giving 'legal advice' (even though he's a solicitor). Just pointers.

He did say you could prune out the costs section (which could be separately stated with Orton v Barclaycard appended to your full 'costs assessment' before the hearing, when you'll know where you will have to fly to and when, so you can add your return travel costs to the list then, plus three or more days of lost leave/salary and a hotel).

Talking of that, also attach a list NOW to this application, of any dates for the next 8 or 9 months when you would be UNAVAILABLE to attend an English Court.

Think Weddings, POSSIBLE holiday weeks, any 'baby due' week, family birthdays, busy work conferences, kids' half terms, the lot. Plot days either side of any commitment as unavailable too because you don't want to be flying to England and genning up on your case before or immediately after something else that takes up headspace.

cda17

Coupon-mad said:

So you are right to put 'CNBC' as the 'court'.

Thanks, I'll leave CNBC.

Johnersh won't have time pro bono to provide exact pruning and he isn't here giving 'legal advice' (even though he's a solicitor). Just pointers.

He did say you could prune out the costs section (which could be separately stated with Orton v Barclaycard appended to your full 'costs assessment' before the hearing, when you'll know where you will have to fly to and when, so you can add your return travel costs to the list then, plus three or more days of lost leave/salary and a hotel).

Ok, shall I remove para 22 then for the time being? Also, cut down para c. at the beginning too?

Talking of that, also attach a list NOW to this application, of any dates for the next 8 or 9 months when you would be UNAVAILABLE to attend an English Court.

Think Weddings, POSSIBLE holiday weeks, any 'baby due' week, family birthdays, busy work conferences, kids' half terms, the lot. Plot days either side of any commitment as unavailable too because you don't want to be flying to England and genning up on your case before or immediately after something else that takes up headspace.

Should I attach this as an EXHIBIT XX-## or just attach this separately in the email?

Do I have to select "At a hearing" on my N244 form in Section 5? Can I select multiple boxes as I would rather not have to travel down to England.

You mention 8-9 months, is this how long it would take to have this heard? Essentially, out of pocket of £315 for this long as well. I should charge interest like DCBL did to me while I have to wait  

Thanks.

Coupon-mad

8-9 months is extreme but all courts are different.

A list of unavailable dates is not an exhibit.

Just attach the list of dates separately and refer to it in your email and say these dates are important to completely avoid days either side of, given a hearing in England will require a flight & hotel stay.

Do I have to select "At a hearing" on my N244 form in Section 5? 

I was toying with the idea that you might wish to tick 'without a hearing' and pay £119 (the lower fee - no hearing) and see if a CNBC central admin Judge will set the case aside without a hearing. Your case is compelling.

cda17

Coupon-mad said:

8-9 months is extreme but all courts are different.

A list of unavailable dates is not an exhibit.

Just attach the list of dates separately and refer to it in your email and say these dates are important to completely avoid days either side of, given a hearing in England will require a flight & hotel stay.

Ok, will attach to email.

Coupon-mad said:

I was toying with the idea that you might wish to tick 'without a hearing' and pay £119 (the lower fee - no hearing) and see if a CNBC central admin Judge will set the case aside without a hearing. Your case is compelling.

It would save everyone time, and money. I don't understand how you could read all the evidence and still require a hearing. Will I submit it without a hearing?