HMRC reporting

Altior

If anyone knows...

What ISA figures get reported to HMRC?

I have a flexible cash ISA with Zopa, this tax year I've put in total £26050. If I go today part way to processing a withdrawal, the app states 'You're withdrawing money from an Access ISA pot. You'll have £11419.40 left of your ISA allowance with Zopa this year'.

This is obviously due to multiple withdrawals as well, as I use it as my stoozing slush account for regular savers, cash bonds etc.

I just want to ensure that Zopa reports the net allowance used (eg £8580.60 as at now), as obviously due to the multiple debits and credits means that the sum of my debits are over the £20K. Which would break the guidance for a standard ISA, but not a flexi ISA. I will be one of thousands of people in a similar position, but I also don't want a surprise letter from HMRC later this year! 

Dazed_and_C0nfused

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/returns-of-information-for-isa-managers

Altior

Cheers. Downloaded the workbook. Interesting, there's a column for 'Total Amount Subscribed' and a column for Cash ISA/JISA market value.

But after a quick eyeball, I can't see 'Total Amount Subscribed' being defined. It could be interpreted as net or gross I suppose, but gross would give the false impression that the maximum £20K subscriptions was violated. 

There's no reference to 'flexi' or flexible on the sheet that I can see. I may need to find out from Zopa directly what they interpret as the total amount subscribed.

gravel_2

Altior said:

Cheers. Downloaded the workbook. Interesting, there's a column for 'Total Amount Subscribed' and a column for Cash ISA/JISA market value.

But after a quick eyeball, I can't see 'Total Amount Subscribed' being defined. It could be interpreted as net or gross I suppose, but gross would give the false impression that the maximum £20K subscriptions was violated. 

There's no reference to 'flexi' or flexible on the sheet that I can see. I may need to find out from Zopa directly what they interpret as the total amount subscribed.

Think you are over complicating this. What could be the difference between gross and net in this context?

Subscription is new money paid in. Flexibility is not important as the rules now require you to repay flexibly withdrawn funds to the same ISA so simply the initial pay in will be reported as a subscription.

Altior

gravel_2 said:

Altior said:

Cheers. Downloaded the workbook. Interesting, there's a column for 'Total Amount Subscribed' and a column for Cash ISA/JISA market value.

But after a quick eyeball, I can't see 'Total Amount Subscribed' being defined. It could be interpreted as net or gross I suppose, but gross would give the false impression that the maximum £20K subscriptions was violated. 

There's no reference to 'flexi' or flexible on the sheet that I can see. I may need to find out from Zopa directly what they interpret as the total amount subscribed.

Think you are over complicating this. What could be the difference between gross and net in this context?

Subscription is new money paid in. Flexibility is not important as the rules now require you to repay flexibly withdrawn funds to the same ISA so simply the initial pay in will be reported as a subscription.

New money paid in is over £20K. But of course factoring withdrawals, net paid in is less than £10K for me. In a nutshell, if this was a standard ISA I'd have breached the rules, as it's a flexible ISA, I haven't. 

On the workbook I downloaded from the HMRC link, I can't actually see any distinction between standard cash ISAs and flexible ones. For simplicity's sake, say I put £10K in on the first day of the month, and took it out on the last day of the month, every month, that's £120K in, £120K out with nil closing balance (before interest). I'm trying to work out what Zopa (or other platforms operating a similar ISA) report to HMRC as the total subscription value in such an example. 

gravel_2

Altior said:

gravel_2 said:

Altior said:

Cheers. Downloaded the workbook. Interesting, there's a column for 'Total Amount Subscribed' and a column for Cash ISA/JISA market value.

But after a quick eyeball, I can't see 'Total Amount Subscribed' being defined. It could be interpreted as net or gross I suppose, but gross would give the false impression that the maximum £20K subscriptions was violated. 

There's no reference to 'flexi' or flexible on the sheet that I can see. I may need to find out from Zopa directly what they interpret as the total amount subscribed.

Think you are over complicating this. What could be the difference between gross and net in this context?

Subscription is new money paid in. Flexibility is not important as the rules now require you to repay flexibly withdrawn funds to the same ISA so simply the initial pay in will be reported as a subscription.

New money paid in is over £20K. But of course factoring withdrawals, net paid in is less than £10K for me. In a nutshell, if this was a standard ISA I'd have breached the rules, as it's a flexible ISA, I haven't. 

On the workbook I downloaded from the HMRC link, I can't actually see any distinction between standard cash ISAs and flexible ones. For simplicity's sake, say I put £10K in on the first day of the month, and took it out on the last day of the month, every month, that's £120K in, £120K out with nil closing balance (before interest). I'm trying to work out what Zopa (or other platforms operating a similar ISA) report to HMRC as the total subscription value in such an example. 

Clearly in your example £10k is the subscription that will be reported.

Perhaps have a look at this to understand it. https://www.gov.uk/guidance/manage-isa-subscriptions-for-your-investors#flexible-isas

Altior

gravel_2 said:

Altior said:

gravel_2 said:

Altior said:

Cheers. Downloaded the workbook. Interesting, there's a column for 'Total Amount Subscribed' and a column for Cash ISA/JISA market value.

But after a quick eyeball, I can't see 'Total Amount Subscribed' being defined. It could be interpreted as net or gross I suppose, but gross would give the false impression that the maximum £20K subscriptions was violated. 

There's no reference to 'flexi' or flexible on the sheet that I can see. I may need to find out from Zopa directly what they interpret as the total amount subscribed.

Think you are over complicating this. What could be the difference between gross and net in this context?

Subscription is new money paid in. Flexibility is not important as the rules now require you to repay flexibly withdrawn funds to the same ISA so simply the initial pay in will be reported as a subscription.

New money paid in is over £20K. But of course factoring withdrawals, net paid in is less than £10K for me. In a nutshell, if this was a standard ISA I'd have breached the rules, as it's a flexible ISA, I haven't. 

On the workbook I downloaded from the HMRC link, I can't actually see any distinction between standard cash ISAs and flexible ones. For simplicity's sake, say I put £10K in on the first day of the month, and took it out on the last day of the month, every month, that's £120K in, £120K out with nil closing balance (before interest). I'm trying to work out what Zopa (or other platforms operating a similar ISA) report to HMRC as the total subscription value in such an example. 

Clearly in your example £10k is the subscription that will be reported.

Perhaps have a look at this to understand it. https://www.gov.uk/guidance/manage-isa-subscriptions-for-your-investors#flexible-isas

Ta. That was what I was looking or:

Reporting

For flexible ISAs, the ‘net’ subscriptions should be reported on the annual returns of information.

masonic

Here is the spec for the electronic returns file: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/isa-annual-returns-electronic-text-file-specification/electronic-text-file-specifications-for-isa-annual-returns

It describes exactly what is to be entered. It has not been updated since the changes to flexibility. Time is running out for any changes that would be in force for this tax year's returns. Not only would an update be needed, there would need to be time for ISA managers to update their systems.