Loft conversion not included in lease

fluffy_kittens2024

Long story short. Currently selling my leasehold flat (first bedroom flat in a terraced house with a loft conversion above that). Buyer's solicitors are saying that the loft conversion (build by the previous sellers) isn't included in the lease.

I have the previous seller's documents such as planning permissions, party wall act, permission from landlord etc etc for the conversion.

I guess my question is, why did my solicitor not flag this when I bought the property (I am using the same solicitor and have raised this) and does anyone else have experience of this and who can shed their light? Do any of you foresee any issue with obtaining a deed of variation? There will be legal costs of course, will there also be costs in terms of the loft itself? Will I essentially be "buying" the loft space? Thank you.

silvercar

Depends on the freeholders view, arguably given that no one else owns a flat near enough to access the loft, the cost shouldn’t be prohibitive. If they don’t sell to you, there is no one else to sell to.

fluffy_kittens2024

silvercar said:

Depends on the freeholders view, arguably given that no one else owns a flat near enough to access the loft, the cost shouldn’t be prohibitive. If they don’t sell to you, there is no one else to sell to.

Thank you, let’s hope this is the case. This is all new to me (never sold before) so this might be a stupid thing to say but I wonder why this wasn’t flagged when the previous sellers got the license for alterations/permission for the loft conversion from the landlord. Thanks again. 

swingaloo

I have a friend in a similar situation. She lives in a flat, its a house divided so she has the upstairs. She had the loft converted with planning permission and permission from the council as its an ex council property. 

She has had 4 buyers and each time she has ad the sale fall through. Even though the conversion was done with the relevant permissions she does not own the loft space and the freeholder will not sell. 

fluffy_kittens2024

swingaloo said:

I have a friend in a similar situation. She lives in a flat, its a house divided so she has the upstairs. She had the loft converted with planning permission and permission from the council as its an ex council property. 

She has had 4 buyers and each time she has ad the sale fall through. Even though the conversion was done with the relevant permissions she does not own the loft space and the freeholder will not sell. 

Gosh that doesn’t sound good 😞 I wonder if it’s something indemnity insurance can cover if that’s the case 

subjecttocontract

This problem seems to highlight that the leaseholders do not understand the 'ownership' structure of a leasehold property. A leaseholder is buying permission to use the property for the length of the lease. The property is owned by and reverts to the freeholder at the end of the lease. 

user1977

subjecttocontract said:

This problem seems to highlight that the leaseholders do not understand the 'ownership' structure of a leasehold property. A leaseholder is buying permission to use the property for the length of the lease. The property is owned by and reverts to the freeholder at the end of the lease. 

It isn’t really a leasehold problem, it’s not owning everything you’re occupying.

Hoenir

user1977 said:

subjecttocontract said:

This problem seems to highlight that the leaseholders do not understand the 'ownership' structure of a leasehold property. A leaseholder is buying permission to use the property for the length of the lease. The property is owned by and reverts to the freeholder at the end of the lease. 

It isn’t really a leasehold problem, it’s not owning everything you’re occupying.

Leases give a contractual right to occupy never own. 

user1977

Hoenir said:

user1977 said:

subjecttocontract said:

This problem seems to highlight that the leaseholders do not understand the 'ownership' structure of a leasehold property. A leaseholder is buying permission to use the property for the length of the lease. The property is owned by and reverts to the freeholder at the end of the lease. 

It isn’t really a leasehold problem, it’s not owning everything you’re occupying.

Leases give a contractual right to occupy never own. 

Ok, you own a leasehold interest. My point was more that it’s not really different in principle from extending your freehold property into somebody else’s, rather than something tenure-specific.

Emmia

swingaloo said:

I have a friend in a similar situation. She lives in a flat, its a house divided so she has the upstairs. She had the loft converted with planning permission and permission from the council as its an ex council property. 

She has had 4 buyers and each time she has ad the sale fall through. Even though the conversion was done with the relevant permissions she does not own the loft space and the freeholder will not sell. 

She didn't get all the relevant permissions though. She should have sought freeholder consent and potentially purchased the space / had it added to her lease before starting any work. 

Right now, with the work done, and her wanting to sell, the freeholder has her over a barrel - they could also require her to return the converted space to it's original condition (i e. rip it all out) at her cost.

Emmia

fluffy_kittens2024 said:

swingaloo said:

I have a friend in a similar situation. She lives in a flat, its a house divided so she has the upstairs. She had the loft converted with planning permission and permission from the council as its an ex council property. 

She has had 4 buyers and each time she has ad the sale fall through. Even though the conversion was done with the relevant permissions she does not own the loft space and the freeholder will not sell. 

Gosh that doesn’t sound good 😞 I wonder if it’s something indemnity insurance can cover if that’s the case 

Indemnity insurance for building in something you don't fundamentally "own"?! I doubt it.