Carers allowance overpayment when paid calender monthly?

Augustleaves

Hi first post,

I've been claiming carers allowance about 4 years and I also have a part time job 12.5 hours a week minimum wage (I dont claim anything else).

Yesterday I noticed I hadn't been paid carers allowance so I phoned them. They say my claim was suspended as I had earned about £10 over the monthly limit.

I work 12.5 hours a week mon-fri on minimum wage which is under the earnings limit (I get about £145 a week) BUT I get paid calender monthly so my earnings fluctuate each payday depending how many weekdays were in the previous month.

How can it be that I have gone over the earnings limit when Im on a fixed weekly wage which is under the weekly earnings limit of £151 meaning I qualify for carers allowance but because I get paid calender monthly I am suspended for earning over? Its still the same amount weekly, its still under the earning limit.

Sorry for the ramble, anyone experienced this before?

Talk about stressed!

chrisbur

From https://www.gov.uk/carers-allowance/eligibility

"If your earnings are sometimes more than £151 a week you might still be eligible for Carer’s Allowance. Your average earnings may be calculated to work out if you’re eligible."

kaMelo

If you're paid calendar monthly then your earnings should be averaged out.. Multiply monthly earnings by 12 and divide by 52 to calculate your weekly earnings.

On a side note, do you notify DWP of your earnings or have they picked this up themselves?

Augustleaves

Hi thanks yes, my earnings are exactly £143 per week, it's getting paid calender monthly that makes it look I earn more on occasion (depends how many weekdays were in the previous month). I don't earn a penny over the weekly limit though. I will see what happens now its with the decicion maker I guess.

Augustleaves

kaMelo said:

If you're paid calendar monthly then your earnings should be averaged out.. Multiply monthly earnings by 12 and divide by 52 to calculate your weekly earnings.

On a side note, do you notify DWP of your earnings or have they picked this up themselves?

Hi yes when I first put in a claim for carers allowance they had payslips and knew I was paid calender monthly and I assume averaged out, everything has been ok for the last 4 years, they know my hours and where I work, nothing has changed. They just stopped it yesterday. They said they calculate a £151 weekly earning limit by 52 (£7852) and then divide by 12 for the monthly earning limit cut off (£654.33). Now because of how days fall each calender month some months I get say for example £665 other months Im getting £600. If my employer paid me weekly I would always have £143.

It does need averaging, what a faff!

kaMelo

Augustleaves said:

kaMelo said:

If you're paid calendar monthly then your earnings should be averaged out.. Multiply monthly earnings by 12 and divide by 52 to calculate your weekly earnings.

On a side note, do you notify DWP of your earnings or have they picked this up themselves?

Hi yes when I first put in a claim for carers allowance they had payslips and knew I was paid calender monthly and I assume averaged out, everything has been ok for the last 4 years, they know my hours and where I work, nothing has changed. They just stopped it yesterday. They said they calculate a £151 weekly earning limit by 52 (£7852) and then divide by 12 for the monthly earning limit cut off (£654.33). Now because of how days fall each calender month some months I get say for example £665 other months Im getting £600. If my employer paid me weekly I would always have £143.

It does need averaging, what a faff!

They've done the calculation the wrong way around, your actual earnings need be annualised and then divided by 52 to get a weekly amount.
Doing it the way they have does not average it out. For example, you worked school term time only and was only paid when you worked then it's possible to average out and be eligible for carers allowance all year, doing it the way they have it might end up as someone only being eligible during school holidays.

Augustleaves

kaMelo said:

Augustleaves said:

kaMelo said:

If you're paid calendar monthly then your earnings should be averaged out.. Multiply monthly earnings by 12 and divide by 52 to calculate your weekly earnings.

On a side note, do you notify DWP of your earnings or have they picked this up themselves?

Hi yes when I first put in a claim for carers allowance they had payslips and knew I was paid calender monthly and I assume averaged out, everything has been ok for the last 4 years, they know my hours and where I work, nothing has changed. They just stopped it yesterday. They said they calculate a £151 weekly earning limit by 52 (£7852) and then divide by 12 for the monthly earning limit cut off (£654.33). Now because of how days fall each calender month some months I get say for example £665 other months Im getting £600. If my employer paid me weekly I would always have £143.

It does need averaging, what a faff!

They've done the calculation the wrong way around, your actual earnings need be annualised and then divided by 52 to get a weekly amount.
Doing it the way they have does not average it out. For example, you worked school term time only and was only paid when you worked then it's possible to average out and be eligible for carers allowance all year, doing it the way they have it might end up as someone only being eligible during school holidays.

Thank you very much, I knew something didn't make sense, hopefully it gets sorted out soon. 

HillStreetBlues

Augustleaves said:

kaMelo said:

Augustleaves said:

kaMelo said:

If you're paid calendar monthly then your earnings should be averaged out.. Multiply monthly earnings by 12 and divide by 52 to calculate your weekly earnings.

On a side note, do you notify DWP of your earnings or have they picked this up themselves?

Hi yes when I first put in a claim for carers allowance they had payslips and knew I was paid calender monthly and I assume averaged out, everything has been ok for the last 4 years, they know my hours and where I work, nothing has changed. They just stopped it yesterday. They said they calculate a £151 weekly earning limit by 52 (£7852) and then divide by 12 for the monthly earning limit cut off (£654.33). Now because of how days fall each calender month some months I get say for example £665 other months Im getting £600. If my employer paid me weekly I would always have £143.

It does need averaging, what a faff!

They've done the calculation the wrong way around, your actual earnings need be annualised and then divided by 52 to get a weekly amount.
Doing it the way they have does not average it out. For example, you worked school term time only and was only paid when you worked then it's possible to average out and be eligible for carers allowance all year, doing it the way they have it might end up as someone only being eligible during school holidays.

Thank you very much, I knew something didn't make sense, hopefully it gets sorted out soon. 

The way it's normally worked out is multiplying monthly by 12 then divide by 52 and looks like they have done this. But this doesn't take into account of your situation.
You need to refer them to 15452 from DMG Chapter 15: Earnings for non-income-related benefts

Averaging of amounts
15452 The weekly amount of a person’s income from earnings may be averaged1
 if the income varies or
the regular pattern of work means that the claimant does not work every week. The DM should average
over
1. a complete cycle if there is a recognisable cycle of work or
2. five weeks2or
3. another period if this means a more accurate weekly amount can be calculated.
1 SS Ben (C of E) Regs, reg 8(3) ; 2 LB v SSWP (ESA) [2019] UKUT 153 (AAC)
Averaging of amounts
15452 The weekly amount of a person’s income from earnings may be averaged1
 if the income varies or
the regular pattern of work means that the claimant does not work every week. The DM should average
over
1. a complete cycle if there is a recognisable cycle of work or
2. fve weeks2or
3. another period if this means a more accurate weekly amount can be calculated.
1 SS Ben (C of E) Regs, reg 8(3) ; 2 LB v SSWP (ESA) [2019] UKUT 153 (AAC)

The actual period they use for calculation  doesn't matter as long as it accurately reflects your actual weekly wage of £143 a week.

Augustleaves

This is very helpful. Thank you very much!

Augustleaves

Well there we are, I just phoned carers allowance for any updates and I was told that they NEVER average earnings over 5 weeks, I told him my payroll cycle and that its in the DWP publication and said NO we dont do that, we NEVER have because everyone would be gaming the system (?)  Even though I consistantly earn under £151 per week I can't ever go over £654.33 per month in a payslip even though Im under that amount monthly 10 months of the year. It's my payroll cycle not me gaming the system

I give up

jodielee26xx

Hey. I’m not sure if you are going to receive this thread, but iv just read your last comment and I’m in the same situation as sometimes I have to work a 5weeker. Before I ring them and get myself into mither, I was wondering if you could explain that you said you can’t go over £654.33 in any month, if the limit is £151 a week would that not mean you couldn’t go over £604? Sorry if I’m being stupid and missing something here x