Slope weather curve and questions

ninjaef

michaels said:

I'm sure you have tried this but can you use the TRVs on the bedroom rads to achieve slightly lower room temps or does too much air mix through the open doors for that to help?

you're correct, the air mixes in, the TRVs ate off in the bedrooms, makes no difference

matt_drummer

ninjaef said:

matt_drummer said:

ninjaef said:

matt_drummer said:

Where is the thermostat?

What temperature is where you sleep when the thermostat is at 20c?

But it is your home, why don't you do what makes you happy?

If that makes you comfortable asking other people what is most efficient isn't going to help as you want comfort before efficiency.

thermostat in centre of home

? it's not 20 where I sleep. it 18 as per schedule .

Trying to run it efficiently but also so I can sleep with the constraints set out in earlier post 

So, if the thermostat is set to 20c it is 20c where the thermostat is but 18c where you sleep? 

Do you actually have the Madoka, that is Daikin's own room thermostat, or do you have something different?

ITS SET TO THE SCHEDULE 


the temp is as per the schedule, I've posted it above.

 only thing is it takes about 3 hrs to go from 18C to 20C from 6am at zero C other than that, the temps are kept as per schedule which is what would be expected because the system is never turned off.

the whole house is the same temp because doors are open (as explained).and it's open plan when only doors on two bedrooms and bathroom 

There is no need to shout at me.

My thermostat says my hallway is 23c but my bedrooms are only 20c.

I don't live in your bungalow so I have no idea how hot your bedrooms are and what you are trying to achieve.

Just because your system is turned on doesn't mean it is actually heating all that time.

Your thermostat will turn the heat pump on and off even though the whole thing is turned on.

Anyway, good luck with it.

Reed_Richards

matt_drummer said:

If the home takes a long while to heat from the night time set back, doesn't it also take quite a long time to actually cool down.

No, not logically at any rate.  Try opening a few windows at this time of year.  You'll find that your house cools quickly but then takes a lot longer than normal to heat up again (with the windows still open).   

Now I'm think of radiators.  If you have UFH embedded in a concrete slab then the concrete acts very like a night storage heater, it takes a long time to heat up but then even if you stop heating it, it will continue to heat the room as it slowly cools down.     

ninjaef

Reed_Richards said:

matt_drummer said:

If the home takes a long while to heat from the night time set back, doesn't it also take quite a long time to actually cool down.

No, not logically at any rate.  Try opening a few windows at this time of year.  You'll find that your house cools quickly but then takes a lot longer than normal to heat up again (with the windows still open).   

Now I'm think of radiators.  If you have UFH embedded in a concrete slab then the concrete acts very like a night storage heater, it takes a long time to heat up but then even if you stop heating it, it will continue to heat the room as it slowly cools down.     

Indeed, I had no intention of hearing the time then opening windows in circumstances I had explained three times then in capitals to Matt because I perceived he wasn't listening or reading and causing himself frustration. I'm somewhat relieved now that he's left me to it and wished me good luck ! 

 I have radiators not UFH. I cannot have the system run about the same temp all day because of aforementioned circumstances not do I wish to throw £££ through open windows !.I feel that I'll just have to take the hit on the morning warmup? 

btw your idea of turning up to 23C 6am to 8am. then down to 20 (my day preference)... I've read that turning it up doesn't make the rooms heat up any quicker???

FreeBear

ninjaef said: btw your idea of turning up to 23C 6am to 8am. then down to 20 (my day preference)... I've read that turning it up doesn't make the rooms heat up any quicker???

Generally speaking, you are correct. Turning up the thermostat doesn't change the rate at which the room(s) heat up.

But if you have load compensation that allows the flow temperature to increase, the radiators will become hotter, which in turn means the rooms will heat up a little faster. But this comes at a cost with reduced efficiency.

ninjaef

Thanks, I've no idea what load compensation is or where it is how how it works. my ASHP is a Daikin EDLA04E2V3 and am MMI and a room thermostat 

michaels

ninjaef said:

Reed_Richards said:

matt_drummer said:

If the home takes a long while to heat from the night time set back, doesn't it also take quite a long time to actually cool down.

No, not logically at any rate.  Try opening a few windows at this time of year.  You'll find that your house cools quickly but then takes a lot longer than normal to heat up again (with the windows still open).   

Now I'm think of radiators.  If you have UFH embedded in a concrete slab then the concrete acts very like a night storage heater, it takes a long time to heat up but then even if you stop heating it, it will continue to heat the room as it slowly cools down.     

Indeed, I had no intention of hearing the time then opening windows in circumstances I had explained three times then in capitals to Matt because I perceived he wasn't listening or reading and causing himself frustration. I'm somewhat relieved now that he's left me to it and wished me good luck ! 

 I have radiators not UFH. I cannot have the system run about the same temp all day because of aforementioned circumstances not do I wish to throw £££ through open windows !.I feel that I'll just have to take the hit on the morning warmup? 

btw your idea of turning up to 23C 6am to 8am. then down to 20 (my day preference)... I've read that turning it up doesn't make the rooms heat up any quicker???

It depends on the logic your controller works on.  The physics are that a bigger temp difference between the rad temp and the room temp will see fast heat transfer to the room. 

If your heat pump goes for max output when the room temp is below the desired temp whatever the size of that temp gap then it will indeed make no difference.  However if its logic says: the gap is only 3C (20-17) so I will set the flow temp only a few degrees higher than that needed to maintain 20C then it will take longer than if it says: The gap is 6C so I will set the flow temp hotter to close the bigger gap in the same length of time. 

Taking longer is more efficient as it is done via a lower flow temp but if that then means it keeps a higher flow temp once 20 is reached and cycles on and off to maintain the 20 then you lose efficiency that way!

ninjaef

michaels said:

ninjaef said:

Reed_Richards said:

matt_drummer said:

If the home takes a long while to heat from the night time set back, doesn't it also take quite a long time to actually cool down.

No, not logically at any rate.  Try opening a few windows at this time of year.  You'll find that your house cools quickly but then takes a lot longer than normal to heat up again (with the windows still open).   

Now I'm think of radiators.  If you have UFH embedded in a concrete slab then the concrete acts very like a night storage heater, it takes a long time to heat up but then even if you stop heating it, it will continue to heat the room as it slowly cools down.     

Indeed, I had no intention of hearing the time then opening windows in circumstances I had explained three times then in capitals to Matt because I perceived he wasn't listening or reading and causing himself frustration. I'm somewhat relieved now that he's left me to it and wished me good luck ! 

 I have radiators not UFH. I cannot have the system run about the same temp all day because of aforementioned circumstances not do I wish to throw £££ through open windows !.I feel that I'll just have to take the hit on the morning warmup? 

btw your idea of turning up to 23C 6am to 8am. then down to 20 (my day preference)... I've read that turning it up doesn't make the rooms heat up any quicker???

It depends on the logic your controller works on.  The physics are that a bigger temp difference between the rad temp and the room temp will see fast heat transfer to the room. 

If your heat pump goes for max output when the room temp is below the desired temp whatever the size of that temp gap then it will indeed make no difference.  However if its logic says: the gap is only 3C (20-17) so I will set the flow temp only a few degrees higher than that needed to maintain 20C then it will take longer than if it says: The gap is 6C so I will set the flow temp hotter to close the bigger gap in the same length of time. 

Taking longer is more efficient as it is done via a lower flow temp but if that then means it keeps a higher flow temp once 20 is reached and cycles on and off to maintain the 20 then you lose efficiency that way!

I have no idea how the controller works, If I did then I would not be here asking and listening, rather I would be helping others😀

ninjaef

I'm going to create a new post at this thread has gone off the rails and all sorts of insight and inconsistent views from y perspective with ideas of opening windows. 

Thanks but please don't comment here.