Universal Credit Dividends Stocks or Shares

TimeLord1

Just read on another forum of someone applying for UC and they're unsure of the value of the shares and only know what dividend is paid yearly and the amount of shares they were designated through a bank takeover. So do they just put the dividend payment in or is there an option for them to enter the number of shares owned? And how accurate is a calculator estimate of value of the next day they could drop or increase. Has anyone had anything similar when applying for UC.  I said just enter the amount of shares if there's an option.

HillStreetBlues

They need to know at least a rough idea of the share value £1,000 £10,000 £100,000?
Depending of that rough value and any other capital will show if they need a actuate valuation of shares.
As UC if based on the end of AP capital, it would be the share price on last day of AP unless shares mean capital over £16k in that case they can't claim UC.

TimeLord1

I thought originally it was based on purchase price or amount and value at that time but clearly it's value can fluctuate substantially over time. I also said to enquire to sell them but they stated they don't know how to but I thought bank Shares contacted people to buy or sell annually?  

TimeLord1

But UC would only see any dividend as income and share value as saving or investment I think that's right?

Grumpy_chap

TimeLord1 said:

Just read on another forum of someone applying for UC and they're unsure of the value of the shares and only know what dividend is paid yearly and the amount of shares they were designated through a bank takeover. So do they just put the dividend payment in or is there an option for them to enter the number of shares owned? And how accurate is a calculator estimate of value of the next day they could drop or increase. Has anyone had anything similar when applying for UC.  I said just enter the account of shares if there's an option.

AIUI, the dividend (income) from the share and the number of shares are not considered in the case of a UC claim.  All that is considered is the value of the shares. 
The dividend statement will state how many shares are held and the correct code for the shares (many businesses have several share codes which can have different values).  With the quantity and code for the shares, an online tool can be used to obtain the value at last business close:
https://www.hl.co.uk/shares

The value of the shares is part of the total savings held by the individual so needs to be added to any bank savings, ISAs, premium bonds, BTL or whatever.  The important factors then are whether that total value is below £6k or above £16k.

TimeLord1

Thanks it's quite interesting and I'm sure many will run into it further down the road. That's strange they don't count the dividend? I'll try an see if they know the share provider and the amount owned to get a rough idea for them. Let's just hope a rough idea is good enough.

HillStreetBlues

TimeLord1 said:

Thanks it's quite interesting and I'm sure many will run into it further down the road. That's strange they don't count the dividend? I'll try an see if they know the share provider and the amount owned to get a rough idea for them. Let's just hope a rough idea is good enough.

I never looked into shares so don't know how they are classed but always thought they would have treated the same as interest on monies and become capital when paid. 

Grumpy_chap

TimeLord1 said:

That's strange they don't count the dividend? 

I understand and agree, at first glance it would seem strange.

However, I understand that shares are treated as any other form of capital, so savings in the bank, or shares, or collection of Renaissance artworks.
The value is assessed as capital and a "deemed income" reduction applied to UC entitlement across the range £6k to £16k capital
If the income was also assessed in the UC claim, that would be double-counting.

The following confirms that shares are assessed as capital:
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/universal-credit-money-savings-and-investments

born_again

TimeLord1 said:

Just read on another forum of someone applying for UC and they're unsure of the value of the shares and only know what dividend is paid yearly and the amount of shares they were designated through a bank takeover. So do they just put the dividend payment in or is there an option for them to enter the number of shares owned? And how accurate is a calculator estimate of value of the next day they could drop or increase. Has anyone had anything similar when applying for UC.  I said just enter the amount of shares if there's an option.

Would the value of the shares not be calculated on the last day of AP.
Which is easy to work out from the number of shares held against the share price on that day, which are all published in the public domain.

TimeLord1

HillStreetBlues said:

TimeLord1 said:

Thanks it's quite interesting and I'm sure many will run into it further down the road. That's strange they don't count the dividend? I'll try an see if they know the share provider and the amount owned to get a rough idea for them. Let's just hope a rough idea is good enough.

I never looked into shares so don't know how they are classed but always thought they would have treated the same as interest on monies and become capital when paid. 

I'm think the Councils  calculate it by dividend paid out or if sold that price. I had premium bonds and they was only interested in any payments.

TimeLord1

born_again said:

TimeLord1 said:

Just read on another forum of someone applying for UC and they're unsure of the value of the shares and only know what dividend is paid yearly and the amount of shares they were designated through a bank takeover. So do they just put the dividend payment in or is there an option for them to enter the number of shares owned? And how accurate is a calculator estimate of value of the next day they could drop or increase. Has anyone had anything similar when applying for UC.  I said just enter the amount of shares if there's an option.

Would the value of the shares not be calculated on the last day of AP.
Which is easy to work out from the number of shares held against the share price on that day, which are all published in the public domain.

You would say so but by the time it takes to complete a claim they could change drastically. So even if they decided to check your estimate in could be very different.