Drowning in (son's) debt - getting desperate

enthusiasticsaver

As others have said I think you and your son are digging a bigger hole and something now needs to change.  He has already borrowed off your brother and you and it looks like there is no way that borrowing further will improve his situation so he needs a debt reset and learn to live within his income.  I do appreciate that living in Surrey is expensive but the debt repayments he is making means he is then short to cover living costs so it looks like a DMP is the best option. 

This means defaulting on the unsecured debt costs.  This will not affect the mortgage but I do advise he moves his main bank account to another bank other than Halifax if he has overdrafts and credit cards through them.  He should prioritise the mortgage. When the defaults happen interest should stop but this can take months and he will get letters and possibly phone calls but they have no recourse other than to accept what he can afford.  I suggest he does not rush into a DMP but focuses on saving for emergencies as he will have no access to credit. 

The borrowing from you and your brother could be an issue so unless you are prepared to wait for repayments you will either need to cover the repayments yourself or he could self manage as doing a DMP through stepchange will not allow him to prioritise the £500 he pays you to cover the credit card borrowing in your name. 

Rob5342

devondiver said:

Rob5342 said:

It's been said before but he needs to take control of this himself. Until/unless he does thst he will never get into a sustainable position. 

Agreed. But . . . . . . . . . You can take a horse to water ........

No disrespect but this is more like you filling up a tanker with water and going chasing after a horse that hasn't said it's thirsty yet.

Support him by all means bit I really do think that he needs to change his mindset first, otherwise anything you do will be futile. 

kimwp

devondiver said:

Sea_Shell said:

devondiver said:

Rob5342 said:

It's been said before but he needs to take control of this himself. Until/unless he does thst he will never get into a sustainable position. 

Agreed. But . . . . . . . . . You can take a horse to water ........

But if it won't drink, then it'll just have to go thirsty.    

- and hungry, and homeless, and worse. And the grandkids? Thanks.

But they won't go hungry and homeless because he is earning a wage that allows him to pay his mortgage, bills and food. This is consumer debt, he literally has to open a new bank account (ten mins) and move his pay, mortgage payments and bills over. (Couple of hours). It can be done during his lunch break over a couple of days. 

I appreciate he is ill now, but unless you plan on managing his finances for the rest of his life, you have to start letting him sort them out.

Rob5342

I agree with the above, it's all his responsibility and he needs to sort things out himself. You won't be around forever and he'll have to continue to manage things wheb you aren't around. 

Dont get me wrong, I've managed things very badly myself and have borrowed from family which just perpetuated my problems. I may well hsve done the same as you at one point, but having been through it I can now see how counter productive it is in the long run. 

sourcrates

I think the OP gets the message now, it will still take a root and branch re-think of how the son deals with money, but the son has to realise this for himself, I think dad can only do so much, family naturally wants to help, in most cases anyway.

How long was it till most of you guys had your lightbulb moment?

Myself included, I abused credit from 20 something, well into my 40`s, took a lot for me to see sense, and I mean house re-possession, marriage break up, the full Monty.

You have to want to change otherwise its just rinse and re-peat over and over again.

devondiver

So - now drowning in figures number-crunching accounts - it seems most of his disposable income has been going in interest and charges for years. Probably a familiar story to you guys. Could be out of my depth but I have to think of the kids.

Question: RAS mentioned a while back that we needed to check whether he already had AP markers. Haven't done this yet - but does this make a difference to the approach we take as regards going via StepChange or self-managing as planned?

Please don't just tell me I have to pass it all over to him - I am trying (so is he!).

Sea_Shell

devondiver said:

So - now drowning in figures number-crunching accounts - it seems most of his disposable income has been going in interest and charges for years. Probably a familiar story to you guys. Could be out of my depth but I have to think of the kids.

Question: RAS mentioned a while back that we needed to check whether he already had AP markers. Haven't done this yet - but does this make a difference to the approach we take as regards going via StepChange or self-managing as planned?

Please don't just tell me I have to pass it all over to him - I am trying (so is he!).

Does his income cover all his outgoings if you ignore the current debt repayments and interest?   

If he could start with a "clean slate", could he cover everything without relying on any further credit, from you or anywhere else?   

Rob5342

If he has decided to sort it out then he needs to forget about the past and create a sustainable budget for now. Once he has done that then he can work out an amount that he afford for debt repayments and then look at how he uses that amount to pay towards his debts.

He can check his credit report to see if he has any arrangement to pay markers but it shouldn't make any difference to how he handles it. Ideally he'll stop paying everything, build up an emergency fund for himself, and then start making payments according to the budget he had worked out once they default. 

devondiver

Sea_Shell said:

devondiver said:

So - now drowning in figures number-crunching accounts - it seems most of his disposable income has been going in interest and charges for years. Probably a familiar story to you guys. Could be out of my depth but I have to think of the kids.

Question: RAS mentioned a while back that we needed to check whether he already had AP markers. Haven't done this yet - but does this make a difference to the approach we take as regards going via StepChange or self-managing as planned?

Please don't just tell me I have to pass it all over to him - I am trying (so is he!).

Does his income cover all his outgoings if you ignore the current debt repayments and interest?   

If he could start with a "clean slate", could he cover everything without relying on any further credit, from you or anywhere else?   

Yes, but - there will have to be cuts (such as Netflix/Amazon/Spotify/Ring/internet/mobiles/etc.)

katsu

He has to think of his kids first.  They are his responsibility before they are yours.

I'm so so sorry for you, as you've got trapped in his problems.  

If he pays the costs of his house first, ahead of debt repayments, then your grandchildren will have a safe and warm home.  So will he.  Things can be ok. Yes he needs to make changes but he and they will be OK. 

Tell him to turn his budgets upside down. Start with the home costs then food, then debt and luxuries like Netflix. And yes... he doesn't need things like a ring doorbell. He can get a doorbell in the highstreet like Argos or Robert Dyas.  You can help him think of those ideas if you suit together looking at his spending, where he's open to that.